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US double IC



  • Just been thinking after my last match what if i build 2 IC with the US on turn 1.
    Both sinkian and china.

    Now this is pretty tricky ofcourse with defending the china 1 but if you couple it with an india IC you get 7 land units production VS 8 units he can produce in japan.
    This should be enough to keep him busy for a long time in the east and possible stall him for the rest of the game while in the mean time you can focus all troops to contain germany.

    Once both the japanese as the germans are contained you will basicaly win because of the IPC advantage you got.



  • I don’t know, Hawk.  Japan will pull out all the stops to get at those IC’s.  It’s pretty difficult to guard China, now.  Just think of the onslaught, if China has an IC.

    If you could survive the first couple of rounds, the IC’s could reinforce one another, but those first two rounds will be rough.



  • In about 95% of my games Japan owns China in US1 and if you don´t reinforce sinkiang heavily with USSR it does get Sink. on J2.  😐



  • China is nearly impossible to defend on J1.  The most you can boost it with are some extra Allied FIGs (1 from UK, 2 from Russia if you go hard-core on defense).

    That many FIGs, that little INF…  I am ging to crack that nut as Japan and make my life a lot easier for the rest of the game by killing 4 FIGs on J1 (5 counting Pearl).

    That mvoe would also leave Japan with having ANY IC build be optional (though I would probably still buy 1 on J2 in Manch or FIC).  8 Japan divisions landing startign in J2 against 5 new Allied divisions.  Then I start buildign in my Manc/FIC IC as well as that shiny new China IC…  13 divisions in Asia on J3. 
    .
    And of course the obligatory remarks about Africa due to no UK counter in Egypt on UK1…



  • Building 2 US and 1 UK IC makes the Southern route to Moscow look that much better.  Plus now the Japan player would’t have to build a factory at all.  More money for troops and TRNs which makes Japans force even more mobile.  I wouldn’t try it.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    IF you’re doing it, then go 1 IC in India, 1 in Sink, none in China until you own all of the SE Asian Continent without contest.


  • 2007 AAR League

    @Jennifer:

    IF you’re doing it, then go 1 IC in India, 1 in Sink, none in China until you own all of the SE Asian Continent without contest.

    then you might as well put 1 on the coast


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    @ajgundam5:

    @Jennifer:

    IF you’re doing it, then go 1 IC in India, 1 in Sink, none in China until you own all of the SE Asian Continent without contest.

    then you might as well put 1 on the coast

    That depends.  If the goal is to keep Japan from getting onto the mainland, you don’t need one on the coast.  It’s actually better in China/Sink so you can get tanks and infantry into Russia faster.

    If you’re doing KJF, then yea, 1 on East Indies, 1 on Borneo.  (Coast is only 3 instead of 4.)


  • Official Answers 2007 AAR League

    It is 30 IPCs of units not getting to Europe and the Germans. Those ICs get all the attention of Japan. SBRs with no AA. I would agree that it would save the J’s from having to buy that turn one IC but to me it looks even sweeter if the US puts a complex or two in China/Sinkiang. I don’t think I’ve ever played a game where China didn’t fall turn one. I’m grateful if I get two rounds with the FTR.



  • Well in my last game i had a load of luck ( held on to china with 1 fighter spare )
    and after thinking about that game if i put 2 IC with the US ( already had india in place ) i would have a easier time

    Sinkian can easy be reinforced by USSR with standing forces to put it to 6 inf. India will get to 5 inf both on turn 1.

    With that production there and only 8 production from japan the first 2 turns you could be looking at a verry cost effective way of keeping japan small and still be able to use most of your troops to KGF.



  • I think you should try it and see if it works.



  • @88:

    I think you should try it and see if it works.

    Yes, try it against me, by all means.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    I think you should refrain from China IC until Round 5, or when you own the Asian coastline.



  • @Jennifer:

    I think you should refrain from China IC until Round 5, or when you own the Asian coastline.

    no, no, Shadowhawk is going to play with me, and I want him to do those two ICs, tee heez



  • Sure if you promise to lose 5 japanese inf and 1 fig in your initial attack VS china on round 1 and leave me with 1 fig there ill build the IC there 😛

    Need to check games section to check and reply to the challenge there 😄

    Hm oki i need to start it off being the allies will send you a mail soonish ( at work here )
    Standard rules 8VC tripleA, no bid, LHTR ( where possible ), you be axis ill be allies.
    Want to make a record here for the nice fellows to follow the game or just keep it hidden from view ?



  • @ShadowHAwk:

    Sure if you promise to lose 5 japanese inf and 1 fig in your initial attack VS china on round 1 and leave me with 1 fig there ill build the IC there 😛

    Need to check games section to check and reply to the challenge there 😄

    Hm oki i need to start it off being the allies will send you a mail soonish ( at work here )
    Standard rules 8VC tripleA, no bid, LHTR ( where possible ), you be axis ill be allies.
    Want to make a record here for the nice fellows to follow the game or just keep it hidden from view ?

    no wai, that’s bad for teh Japs.

    LHTR, where to get the most recent version; link plz, maybe smoreyswamp but not sure

    No record cos it involves a lot of that writing stuff.  Eats up time munch munch.





  • @ncscswitch:

    Most recent LHTR:

    http://www.dicey.net/revised/viewtopic.php?t=92

    hawt, thanx


  • 2007 AAR League

    If I were going to build 2 US IC I would:

    R1-8 inf
    Attack Belo-8inf, 1art, 1tnk, 1fgt
    Attack Ukraine-3inf, 1art, 2tnk, 1fgt
    4inf to Sink (2 Kazkh, 2 Novo)
    1tnk Sink (Russia)
    6inf Bury (Yakut, SFE)
    2inf Yakut (Evenki)
    1 fgt Sink
    1 fgt Caucasus

    UK1-1 IC (India), 5inf
    Attack jap tp-1fgt, 1CV
    land fgt in china
    link dd & tp from India & ss & tp from Australia in sz30

    US-2 IC plus $12 spent in the atlantic
    1fgt Hawaii, 1fgt WUS, 1bmb EUS to SFE
    Reinforce UK

    R2
    Attack China & possibly Manchuria
    2inf Yakut to SFE to cover US air forces

    UK2
    Take FIC if Vacant
    move fleet sz30 to India

    US2
    reinforce China (ground forces from Sink, Air forces from SFE)
    build in both IC’s

    any thoughts?



  • “R1-8 inf
    Attack Belo-8inf, 1art, 1tnk, 1fgt
    Attack Ukraine-3inf, 1art, 2tnk, 1fgt
    4inf to Sink (2 Kazkh, 2 Novo)
    1tnk Sink (Russia)
    6inf Bury (Yakut, SFE)
    2inf Yakut (Evenki)
    1 fgt Sink
    1 fgt Caucasus”

    With only that many units attacking Ukraine, there is quite a decent chance that the attack will fail and Germany will keep its fighter.  Russia really needs two fighters or three tanks to make that fight favorable - but of course, using three tanks means losing three tanks.

    Attacking West Russia (not Belo) will almost certainly be an Allied win, but for a multiple round combat, a tank can make a big difference - especially if the German player has a little luck.  West Russia’s infantry reserves may be seriously drained before Germany ever attacks.

    Because of those two combined, there’s a chance Germany can fortify Ukraine on the first round to threaten West Russia and the Caucasus; combined with a tank build or S. Europe transports, Russia could be attacked very quickly.  If Germany held the Ukraine with one or two ground units, a suicide attack on the Caucasus becomes a possibility to knock out the Russian fighter.

    Russia’s German front will be very weak, and Russia will hardly be able to mount any decent counterattack with so much of its forces tied up in Asia.

    At the end of the UK turn, Germany will be in awesome position.  UK will be in poor attacking position from spending 15 IPC on an industrial complex and Russia’s front will be depleted.

    When Japan goes, it can choose any number of options.  Given the fact that the Allies are obviously going KJF, Japan should not buy an industrial complex, but get three transports plus some ground instead.  It should switch to fighters, and when any US fleet approaches, subs.  Even given this almost certainly necessary build, Japan has at least two good options.

    1.  Japan could ignore Pearl Harbor to smash Burytia and China leaving the Soviet Far East wide open (in this case, the US could not build an IC, but would have the Hawaii navy to build up a fleet to attack Japan faster, but a defensive build of transports, fighters, and infantry by Japan could be used early to protect a coastal holding, midgame to attack (fighters and infantry), and late game to defend against the US fleet.

    2.  Japan could ignore Burytia and smash China and Pearl.  If any Burytia units move into Manchuria, four transports worth of units plus air support will crush them.

    One is a land stall, the other is a sea stall.  Both should work well enough to delay the Allies for quite some time; there’s a very good chance Moscow would fall well before Tokyo was seriously threatened.



  • JSP:

    Your moves in india leave you exposed on that side to a critical level.

    I would sugest the following moves with the UK

    Fight -> India.
    Dest + AC -> Trannie

    Transport picks up the 1 inf from trans jordan and moves it to india. This gives you 5 inf and 1 fig in india at least ( expecting Egypt to be lost. It is decent defence against japan attacks.

    In this case india will be your main point of resistances VS japan. If you put a lot on kwatun build the IC there first turn so you can get new units out on turn 2 when japan is still weak. IF you can threathen them sufficient to not build an mainland IC you could almost match their production.



  • To hold India 1 or 2 extra rounds means the loss of ALL of Africa in the same amount of time.

    If you do not counter a G1 attack on Egypt, you will probably lose T-J, IEA, BC, and FEA on G2, so -4 in order to save 3.

    Then in turn 3, you lose FWA and Rhodesia, possibly even UOSA depending on UK1 & 2 moves.  The same turn, you are probably also going to lose India, and possibly Persia to Germany.

    End of Turn 3, UK is down 11-14 with an non-IC India reinforce. 
    While with an India abandonment, UK is only down a maximum of 9, and more likely only 5-7.

    And the end of Turn 3 is when the Americans should begin re-claiming Africa. If UK countered Egypt on UK1, then Germany is only ever up $4 at msot in Africa.  If UK did not counter, then it will take the Americans 3-4 turns or so to get UK’s income back.

    UK is better off financially to abandon India on UK1.



  • Sometimes I leave one infantry in India to pressure the Japanese a bit - they can’t just march in with one infantry, and if they leave French Indochina empty, I can just march in with one infantry myself.  Otherwise, though, I abandon India.

    “IF you can threathen them sufficient to not build an mainland IC you could almost match their production.”

    Japan can produce 8 units a turn.  India can only produce 3.  Of course, it’s not that simple, but I will say that it is very difficult to defend India.



  • New, the 1 INF India on UK1 is a VERY viable move.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    I was thinking a UK attack on Borneo and New Guinee and the Tran in Sea Zone 59 followed by two American aircraft carriers and a fighter on US 1.


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