Elche(x) v Gamerman01 Classic no tech Russia restricted

  • 2024 2023 '22 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    2024-2-22-World-War-II-Classic R1.tsvg

    It’s been a VERY long time. Lets see what my memories combined with years of experience of later versions gets me. But being used to the new ones is also a big handicap

    We are playing with the following rules:

    1. no retreat, not even planes, from amphibious assault.
    2. No tech.
    3. Bombardment casualties can return fire
    4. You canNOT build ships into hostile zone
    5. You canNOT submerge subs (stay in same zone)
    6. AA always on? So SBR by UK of South Europe here would take AA fire from West Europe?
    7. Can’t put any planes on newly built carrier
    8. You can take a neutral by paying 3 IPCs in the combat move phase
    9. Tanks can blitz through AA or IC’s
    10. Only 1 AA gun in a territory

  • I unchecked pretty much everything
    I can’t remember which rules were changed a little, later on with Classic.

    I put in bombard casualties don’t get to fire back (I loved this rule)
    And planes can retreat from amphibious (did they really have to stay with the battle??)
    I’m not going back and studying the rulebook, I think I remember enough.

    Just say what rules you want to be different and we can talk about it


  • Interesting. Now I look at a tournament?? game you play in and I see my Russia1 is almost identical.

    I have pretty much never seen anyone else play classic.

    I don’t remember how the subs work - they’re basically destroyers? (2/2, cost 8) So I probably should have moved the Russian sub to East Canada.

    You’ve been playing Classic?? Quite a disadvantage I have, then. Well, it’s just a fun game in play boardgames so I don’t care, as long as you don’t go bragging in the league that you beat me twice (LOL)


  • The map looks gorgeous. Maybe I could get into this, we’ll see. Will mess with my G40 play because the rules are so different LOL

    But I like that there are no deserts or mountains.

    Man, even Iron Blitz is a lot more sophisticated than this. This takes me all the way back to 19 years old, 29 years ago.


  • Hello my friend,

    I think there isnt an advantage for me. I play online with new rules and this was like a new game.
    Its my first game with the new rules is still running and our game is second.
    I play now with no retreat for planes by amph attack.


  • I played max. 10 games classic in the last 10 years but 4 games in the last 6 month but with different rules.
    The biggest difference is, I never played with the economical victory.
    But its much easier than BM or OOB and PtV and much faster and funny.


  • If you attack the sub with planes and is no hit you can evade in a neighbour sz with no enemy ships. you cannot fire on the planes but you can use the sub as casuality in a battle.


  • Is for me although a long time ago, 30 years, I played it first time and we played much more than now.


  • Good luck and have fun.

    Best regards from Harry


  • Did you retreat with the sub ?
    2024-2-22-WWII-clas-b-ger1.tsvg


  • After a couple rounds with kwas, I understand most of it already. I do not feel disadvantaged lol
    Let’s see if the Allies win both


  • So in re-learning Classic (and then some, because I probably didn’t play it quite right as a teenager),
    I know you can roll by column and then the defender has to choose casualties after each column, so you could have rolled just the fighters, then required a casualty choice (although you happened to miss) and then the bomber.

    You also assumed Russian transport as casualty, and I agree I think this is my best choice because you still have 2 ships. Though you showed me my defense roll… Maybe it’s Triple A that’s leading you to do this.

    Just trying to help!

    Sub will stay for round 2, hoping for triple hit.

    I know I have a high chance of sinking your sub with UK air that has nothing much to do on UK1, but the Russian sub is doomed if it retreats anyway, is my thinking.


  • If your sub hits on surprise strike round 2, take off the transport (since my sub return fire would hit your sub)


  • @elche said in Elche(x) v Gamerman01 Classic no tech Russia restricted:

    But its much easier than BM or OOB and PtV and much faster and funny.

    Perfectly said!
    It didn’t take long to realize that I can’t take this game seriously, which is good, just have crazy fun!
    But it is still fun to make the decisions quite seriously! It is so interesting to play this game after more than 100 competitive recorded games of the advanced versions, thanks for challenging me more than once over the past year!


  • Wait a second…
    If I had moved the Russian sub to Canada, then you attacked with a fighter, then I could withdraw the sub to the North Sea where you were about to conduct combat?? Or not, because it’s not friendly because you have sea units there. What if you attacked the North Sea with air only? Then if you attacked Canada first, the sub could withdraw to the North Sea, and effectively be in 2 different battles in the same turn? Or potentically MORE than two?? Surely this isn’t right, but I’ll let you tell me before I read more rules.


  • I think retreat in a battle should not be possible but not 100 % sure. You cannot retreat into a sz with an enemy ship.
    We can play rematch with rules you prefer.


  • Game History

    Round: 1
    
        Purchase Units - Germans
            Germans buy 1 armour and 9 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 
    
        Combat Move - Germans
            1 submarine moved from Baltic Sea Zone to North Sea Zone
            1 transport moved from Baltic Sea Zone to North Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Germany to North Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Germany to North Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from West Europe to East Canada Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Finland Norway to North Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Algeria to French West Africa
                  Germans take French West Africa from British
            1 submarine moved from West Spain Sea Zone to West Mediteranean Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from South Europe to Central Mediteranean Sea Zone
            1 battleship, 1 infantry and 1 transport moved from Central Mediteranean Sea Zone to West Mediteranean Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from West Mediteranean Sea Zone to Gibraltar
            1 fighter moved from East Europe to East Mediteranean Sea Zone
            1 armour moved from Libya to French Equatorial Africa
                  Germans take French Equatorial Africa from British
            1 armour moved from French Equatorial Africa to Anglo Sudan Egypt
            1 infantry moved from Libya to Anglo Sudan Egypt
            1 infantry moved from Ukraine S.S.R. to Caucasus
            1 fighter moved from Ukraine S.S.R. to Caucasus
    
        Combat - Germans
            Battle in East Mediteranean Sea Zone
                Germans attack with 1 fighter
                British defend with 1 submarine
                    Germans roll dice for 1 fighter in East Mediteranean Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits
                    1 submarine owned by the British lost in East Mediteranean Sea Zone
                Germans win with 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 8
                Casualties for British: 1 submarine
            Battle in Anglo Sudan Egypt
                Germans attack with 1 armour and 1 infantry
                British defend with 1 armour and 1 infantry
                    Germans roll dice for 1 armour and 1 infantry in Anglo Sudan Egypt, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 armour and 1 infantry in Anglo Sudan Egypt, round 2 : 0/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                    1 infantry owned by the British lost in Anglo Sudan Egypt
                    Germans roll dice for 1 armour and 1 infantry in Anglo Sudan Egypt, round 3 : 0/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 armour in Anglo Sudan Egypt, round 3 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Anglo Sudan Egypt
                    Germans roll dice for 1 armour in Anglo Sudan Egypt, round 4 : 0/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 armour in Anglo Sudan Egypt, round 4 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    Germans roll dice for 1 armour in Anglo Sudan Egypt, round 5 : 1/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 armour in Anglo Sudan Egypt, round 5 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    1 armour owned by the Germans lost in Anglo Sudan Egypt
                    1 armour owned by the British lost in Anglo Sudan Egypt
                British win with no units remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
                Casualties for British: 1 armour and 1 infantry
                Casualties for Germans: 1 armour and 1 infantry
            Battle in East Canada Sea Zone
                Germans attack with 1 fighter
                British defend with 1 transport
                    Germans roll dice for 1 fighter in East Canada Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,50 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 transport in East Canada Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,17 expected hits
                    1 transport owned by the British lost in East Canada Sea Zone
                Germans win with 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 8
                Casualties for British: 1 transport
            Battle in West Mediteranean Sea Zone
                Germans attack with 1 battleship, 1 submarine and 1 transport
                British defend with 1 battleship
                    Germans roll dice for 1 submarine in West Mediteranean Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    1 battleship owned by the British lost in West Mediteranean Sea Zone
                Germans win with 1 battleship, 1 submarine and 1 transport remaining. Battle score for attacker is 24
                Casualties for British: 1 battleship
            Battle in Gibraltar
            Battle in Caucasus
                Germans attack with 1 fighter and 1 infantry
                Russians defend with 1 infantry
                    Germans roll dice for 1 fighter and 1 infantry in Caucasus, round 2 : 2/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                    Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Caucasus, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Caucasus
                Germans win, taking Gibraltar from British, taking Caucasus from Russians with 1 fighter and 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
                Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry
            Battle in North Sea Zone
                Germans attack with 1 bomber, 2 fighters, 1 submarine and 1 transport
                British defend with 1 battleship and 1 transport; Russians defend with 1 submarine and 1 transport
                    Germans roll dice for 1 submarine in North Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    Germans roll dice for 1 bomber, 2 fighters and 1 transport in North Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 1,67 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 submarine in North Sea Zone, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 battleship and 2 transports in North Sea Zone, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 1,00 expected hits
                    1 transport owned by the Germans lost in North Sea Zone
                    1 transport owned by the Russians lost in North Sea Zone
                    Germans roll dice for 1 submarine in North Sea Zone, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    Germans roll dice for 1 bomber and 2 fighters in North Sea Zone, round 3 : 2/3 hits, 1,67 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 submarine in North Sea Zone, round 3 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 battleship and 1 transport in North Sea Zone, round 3 : 1/2 hits, 0,83 expected hits
                    1 submarine owned by the Germans and 1 fighter owned by the Germans lost in North Sea Zone
                    1 transport owned by the British and 1 submarine owned by the Russians lost in North Sea Zone
                    Germans roll dice for 1 bomber and 1 fighter in North Sea Zone, round 4 : 1/2 hits, 1,17 expected hits
                    British roll dice for 1 battleship in North Sea Zone, round 4 : 1/1 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                    1 fighter owned by the Germans lost in North Sea Zone
                    1 battleship owned by the British lost in North Sea Zone
                Germans win with 1 bomber remaining. Battle score for attacker is 8
                Casualties for Germans: 2 fighters, 1 submarine and 1 transport
                Casualties for Russians: 1 submarine and 1 transport
                Casualties for British: 1 battleship and 1 transport
    
        Non Combat Move - Germans
            1 fighter moved from Caucasus to East Europe
            1 fighter moved from East Mediteranean Sea Zone to East Europe
            1 armour moved from South Europe to East Europe
            1 infantry moved from South Europe to East Europe
            2 armour moved from Ukraine S.S.R. to East Europe
            4 infantry moved from Germany to East Europe
            1 infantry moved from Ukraine S.S.R. to East Europe
            2 armour moved from Germany to East Europe
            1 armour moved from West Europe to East Europe
            1 fighter moved from East Canada Sea Zone to West Europe
            1 bomber moved from North Sea Zone to Germany
            1 aaGun moved from South Europe to East Europe
            1 armour moved from West Europe to East Europe
            1 infantry moved from Ukraine S.S.R. to East Europe
            1 bomber moved from Germany to East Europe
    
        Place Units - Germans
            1 armour and 2 infantry placed in South Europe
            7 infantry placed in Germany
    
        Turn Complete - Germans
            Germans collect 37 PUs; end with 37 PUs
    

    Combat Hit Differential Summary :

    Russians regular : -0,33
    Germans regular : 1,50
    British regular : 1,00
    

    2024-2-22-WWII-CL-ger1.tsvg


  • @elche said in Elche(x) v Gamerman01 Classic no tech Russia restricted:

    I think retreat in a battle should not be possible but not 100 % sure. You cannot retreat into a sz with an enemy ship.
    We can play rematch with rules you prefer.

    It’s OK, I was kind of just wondering if you knew the answer.

    Seems we should play that you can’t retreat to a combat zone.
    I was saying, if you did not have a ship in the North Sea, I don’t know that there is a rule prohibiting a withdraw into that zone, but it really seems like you should not be able to change what is in the combat, during the combat phase!! But with all these weird sub rules, I’m not sure what you can and cannot do with these withdraws.

    We can play that you can’t withdraw into a zone where there will be combat.


  • OK, I’m not sure what rules you want to play by. I’m a little confused because I’m also playing kwas and I’m trying to learn the different rules.

    You want to play

    1. no retreat, not even planes, from amphibious assault.
    2. No tech.
    3. Bombardment casualties can return fire
    4. You can build ships into hostile zone
    5. You can submerge subs (stay in same zone when withdrawing)
    6. AA always on? So SBR by UK of South Europe here would take AA fire from West Europe?
    7. Can’t put any planes on newly built carrier
    8. You can take a neutral by paying 3 IPCs in the combat move phase
    9. Tanks can blitz through AA or IC’s

    Just tell whatever of these rules you want different, before I move UK.

    Perhaps I should start a new game file and edit everything so far, so that the game options are all correct and we do not have to edit things in the future.

    Let me know!
    Have a great day in Hanover.
    I am in a town of 600 people today lol

  • 2024 2023 '22 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    @gamerman01 said in Elche(x) v Gamerman01 Classic no tech Russia restricted:

    So I probably should have moved the Russian sub to East Canada.

    Dramatic dice on G1. All went great for you except North Sea. 2 planes down, wow does that hurt.

    Just playing for fun, just playing for fun! I have to remember this

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