What to do with British fighter off of India?



  • He slightly underpowered a couple of fights, but he did get hammered by Dice.  Gibraltar BB still alive, Egypt still UK’s, UK fleet in the Med, and he had to pull back from Western… all on G1.

    It will take a LOT of work to fight back from that.

    Of course Jen then did another option for the UK fighter… it is in SZ15 with a major UK fleet 🙂


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Yea.  I figured 4 British Fighters over Europe was a force to be reckoned with.  Also lets England split it’s navy for a change…since Germany’s down to 3 fighters, Carrier, DD, 2 SS, 2 Trn, 1 BB now.

    Of course, it left me weak against Japan and with Japan having a stronger then normal navy.  We’ll just have to see how it plays out.


  • 2007 AAR League

    I’m with Trihero on this one. I go with the retaking of Egypt. My policy is to also bring the UK bomber. Make Germany work for Africa’s IPC’s.

    You guys were discussing what to do with the bomber afterward. My plan following that attack is to package the bomber and fighter together and land them in Congo. Germany will need at least 2 fighters and a bomber in Libya for them to have a significant advantage. If it comes down to having only 1 unit left after the Egypt attack then I lose the bomber because the fighter can land out of range of Germany’s ability to kill it which is exactly what happened in my game against jsp last time I did it.

    The attack on the Japanese sub and landing in sz52 is also a good move. It reinforces the idea that, as Japan, you either come strong to sz52 or you don’t come at all. Anything short of overkill there is just asking for trouble.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    I think the land in SZ52 and the land in Bury are similar in rational.

    In the former you are attempting to force Japan to use more navy then normal in Hawaii in an effort to weaken them.  In the latter you are trying to force Japan to use less navy or forgo the attack and thus strengthen America.

    Both achieve the same objective.  America is stronger compared to Japan then if the British fighter just landed in India and thumbed it’s nose at the whole war.



  • Just hit Hawaii with fodder sub (if survived), destroyer, lots of air.  Most of rest of Jap fleet parks at Solomons.

    You can lose a fighter or two in exchange for not committing the Jap fleet to a counterattack by US battleship, transport, two fighters, and bomber.



  • I prefer to lose those FIGs, along with an AC, taking out the BB, TRN, and some US AF on the counter-attack.  Make them treat my AC and FIGs as a defense total of 11 instead of an attack total of 7.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Yea, if you can work it out that way.  If all you have left is a carrier, I’m hitting Pearl on Counter attack.  You have much more then a carrier and MAYBE a fighter and I’ll just kill off Germany.  Not worth the extra round to get the battleship over and the potential to loose a fighter.  Japan will surrender when Berlin falls anyway



  • Except in JSP and U-505’s game 🙂



  • Im missing 1 option here.
    Land in India to help defend it.

    Because that is my current normal move ( 8CV ) Team up all units in india so japan cant take it on turn 1 or 2.

    5 inf 2 figs vs 2 inf 4 fig 1 bomb with LL that will result in all but my fighter surviving. Afrika aint that important you can take it easy with the US from turn 2 onward just pour troups in there and he wont get the rewards anyway.



  • You don’t need the fighter in India on turn 1. If you have 4 infantry there and Japan attacks it with 4 fighters they will lose multiple fighter if it wants to take India and will have to forgo either pearl or China. (Unless there is a bid in FIC)
    Of course if they prepare to take it turn to and you want to defend it you need the fighter around but then UK1 fighter india and UK1 fighter sinkiang transpose.


  • 2007 AAR League

    multiple fighters? uk should b happy if they take out 1 because statistically it is 1/6 so if they only get to fire 4 shots thats less i cant do math but japan can take it on J1 if they realy wanted to … they could sacrifice fighters if they r desperate and if you didn’t take out the transport there is no need for fighter sacrifice because you can send in 4 inf nd a bomber



  • Well of course you take out the transport. With the destroyer it’s 6/7 to succeed. With the carrier as well (and frankly I see no better purpose for the carrier) it’s 100%.

    If you leave 4 infantry in india and Japan attacks with 2 infantry 4 fighters we have and preserves 1 infantry to take India we have:
    Attacker wins 71%
    Expected casualties:
    None 5%
    1In  13%
    1 ftr 2%
    1In 1 ftr 14%
    2 ftr 1%
    1In 2 ftr 17%
    1In 3 ftr 12%
    1In 4 ftr 7%
    2In 4ftr 29%

    Assuming no possible counter that’s an expectation of
    -26.83 Japaneese losses
    +10.5 British losses
    +4.38 expected territory gains
    = -11.95 IPC for the Japaneese

    And that doesn’t  include forgoing Pearl Harbor which is something like ~+20 for the japaneese. I would be more than happy to give up any strategic advantages India has for such a huge economic windfall.


  • 2007 AAR League

    @Infantry:

    Well of course you take out the transport. With the destroyer it’s 6/7 to succeed. With the carrier as well (and frankly I see no better purpose for the carrier) it’s 100%.

    If you leave 4 infantry in india and Japan attacks with 2 infantry 4 fighters we have and preserves 1 infantry to take India we have:
    Attacker wins 71%
    Expected casualties:
    None 5%
    1In  13%
    1 ftr 2%
    1In 1 ftr 14%
    2 ftr 1%
    1In 2 ftr 17%
    1In 3 ftr 12%
    1In 4 ftr 7%
    2In 4ftr 29%

    Assuming no possible counter that’s an expectation of
    -26.83 Japaneese losses
    +10.5 British losses
    +4.38 expected territory gains
    = -11.95 IPC for the Japaneese

    And that doesn’t  include forgoing Pearl Harbor which is something like ~+20 for the japaneese. I would be more than happy to give up any strategic advantages India has for such a huge economic windfall.

    Better use for the carrier would be to save it to eventually be used to carry the fighter to maybe go island hopping when japanese fleet is distracted by the US. and i dont know wut yur numbers mean exactly but 3 ipcs is one less infantry that britain can build and 1 more that japan can build so if -11.95 IPC is wutever u say it is it will pay for itself in 4 turns but there is also the luck factor and everything which is the reason why you can’t only go by math



  • Always remember any defense of India means UK is giving up 6-9 IPC in Africa, with a potential loss of up to 11 IPC’s if you add Madagascar and Trans-Jordan.

    Madagascar usually is not worth the cost to Germany, but Japan often claims it in Domination games.



  • 1)I got the numbers by multiplying each expected casualty percentage by its value.
    2)But Japan can overwhelm any defense of India (if they feel like it)  in three turns so you never get five extra turns out of it. (One turn of profit is built into the calculation)
    3)Island hopping is a lot easier if Japan does India over pearl on turn one.
    4)If the dice hate you all your endeavours are doomed anyway

    Of course for me it’s a moot point since I agree with ncscswitch and leave India with 2 men in order to recapture Egypt.


  • 2007 AAR League

    I recapture Egypt too i’m just saying



  • @ncscswitch:

    Always remember any defense of India means UK is giving up 6-9 IPC in Africa, with a potential loss of up to 11 IPC’s if you add Madagascar and Trans-Jordan.

    Madagascar usually is not worth the cost to Germany, but Japan often claims it in Domination games.

    Depends what you are doing with your US troops. IF you land them turn 1 in afrika they can start to threathen german holdings there from turn 1. OR land above the desert and cut germany off and you reduced that possible +9 to +2.

    Also depends what type of game you play. 8VC you cannot hand over india. Without VC (or anything above 8 )you can ignore india.


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    Actually, it all depends on what happens with Germany’s turn.

    If they fail to sink your submarine AND cannot close the canal.  What the heck, bring it into the Med!  Make yourself a nuissance!

    I have found, in this game, that the allies have to suicide everything they got every round against Germany to prevent them from ever keeping the units they make.  Cost them 1 or 2 a round and you’ll bleed them out like a stuck pig.  (Allies as in England/America, not Russia.)  Then use Russia as a bolstering agent.

    Germany only gets 40 a round.  You can easily knock that down to the low 30’s which means England is tit for tat with Germany.  America is coup de grau and Russia is just iceing.

    Germany: 35:
    England: 25
    America: 25
    Russia: 25

    75 to 35.  Even on defense, that’s 75 to 70, allies favor.  (Doubling since infantry defend twice as good as they attack…usually safer to figure it that way.)  I also assume America’s only putting 50% in since it takes time to get up to full capacity.  And that England got knocked around a little by Japan. (No India, no Persia, no Trans-Jordan.)

    Then again, if Germany does average or well, then put it up in Bury.  Make those Japs keep something, or make something to protect those transports of his.  Heck, at the very least it means Russia won’t loose Bury on round 1, right?  That’s gotta count for something.



  • Hm if they fail to take egypt turn 1 you can make japan pay for it big time.
    Bolster the fleet off india and reinforce it even adding an IC to it will make short work of early japan expansions. And you can step back 1 move and next turn take on egypt with full force again.
    Germany is losing afrika anyway and their Med fleet is not more then a nuisance. Having your fleet being a pain to japan expansions is worth a lot more. If you can combine it turn 2-3 with the US main fleet you basicaly have naval superiority in the pacific, with limited US involvement knocking japan out of the game and taking 2 extra VC’s


  • 2018 2017 2016 '11 Moderator

    But iwth a significant fleet in the Med for England, you secure Africa and, if you put an IC in Africa, you can harass the southern border.  If you want too.  Or just build up to invade Europe by way of Caucasus



  • Dont think it is worth it to build an IC there.
    You can only produce 2 units a turn there.
    You are then better of trying to merge your 2 fleets in round 3 or later.

    I always preferr keeping japan busy and with a fleet of 2 destroyers 1 full AC and 1 trannie he will have his hands full trying to destroy that 1 and do a pearl attack and attack on the mainland with sufficient forces.


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