Test summary from TripleA, engine version: 2.6.14470, time: 12:33:08 PM
Savegame
1914 - TGC (CP) vs. VF (Entente), oob, no bid
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updated with Africa. sorry about that. I edited +3 German PU.
G1.tsvg -
@the_good_captain
For some reason this file is not a forum game. If I click on play by forum, no settings are filled in, but in that other one, it does. -
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I edited your German moves in this file. I don’t mind about the mistakes. It can happen to everybody. I can remember that I played a game of G40 Balanced mod for the first time with someone, and I forgot about the ‘Chinese infantry spawning in each territory not covered by an Axis land unit’ rule. He had to edit a lot of my Japanese moves back! I was full of shame… :(
F1.tsvg -
@victoryfirst British are up now =)
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@the_good_captain
Lol, forgot about the turn order…I attacked your subs in sz # (the one up near Scotland) with two cruisers. I made a mistake, I thought your subs had to go through one round of combat, and then they are allowed to submerge, but that isn’t the case. You can submerge in any round of combat if you don’t roll for combat that round for your sub. I got no hits, and you got one hit. Then I thought you probably wanted to submerge, but I was mistaken about the rules. So, what now? I guess you wanted to forfeit your defense roll and submerge your subs after my two cruisers both missed?
And I thought I had a factory in Canada, but that wasn’t the case, so instead of buying a ship I saved the money.
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@victoryfirst My vote is you do with the cruisers what you would have done had you known exactly how the rules worked. Honestly, I didn’t even know that so no worries.
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this UK cruiser attack against the German subs is actually really interesting. First the rule:
“The submarine, although submerging rather than firing, is still
subject to the results of that round’s enemy combat die rolls. If they
roll a hit the submarine may be chosen as a casualty or must be the
casualty if it is the only target. If the submarine survives the die roll
and submerges, it is considered to have broken off from the battle
and may not fire or be taken as a casualty in any subsequent round
of the battle.” -page 20So the order of operations (as I see it) should be:
A) British cruisers move into the sea zone with the two German subs and declare an attack
B) The Germans must now decide if they will declare their subs “submerged” or not.
C) If the German subs submerge, UK cruisers each roll a die and apply casualties. There is no return fire from the German subs in this case.
D) If the German subs decide NOT to submerge, the first round is fought “normally” with both sides rolling a pair of dice: the British hit on “3” or less, the Germans hit on “2” or less.
E) Repeat until one side wins, the British retreat or the German sub(s) are submeged. -
I’m not sure what my personal decision would have been in this case - an open fight with both of those cruisers was only a 63% chance of UK winning since subs defend on “2” in 1914. Since this game is supposedly imbalanced in favor of the allies, I feel this would be a great opportunity to knock out one or both UK cruisers. Did you think subs defend on a “1”?
Maybe the best thing to do in this case is to keep your cruisers in the sea zone with my subs and we say that my subs declared a “submerge” before we saw your roll. In this case, mine never rolled back at you so we can ignore the hit. Chalk it up to inexperience on the part of both of us?
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@the_good_captain
Well yeah, I thought subs were those very bad-at-defence units, and I wanted to sacrifice a few ships to have a chance to destroy one of your submarines before they spread out or combine with your fleet. Apparently, they roll at a 2, and now I think about it, it was probably not that good of an attack, as there was a big chance I would at least lose one cruiser, and losing a cruiser against a sub is not a good trade. If I knew the rules, it was maybe worth it. I mean if you submerge, I have a chance to kill one or both of your subs without getting a hit.I guess the best thing to do is what you said, pretend you submerged and my cruisers missed.
Here is the save file with the edit:
B1.tsvg -
“If a major power moves units into a minor neutral power’s capital territory, the invaded neutral power will mobilize forces against the invading force. Serious consideration should be given to which power will represent the mobilized forces. It can be any of the powers that are on the opposite side from the power that is performing the invasion. For example if Germany (Central Powers member) invaded Holland, one of the Allied players would place his or her infantry and artillery. It should also be noted that if Holland ends up being controlled by the Allies, the ally who originally mobilized in Holland would most likely gain Holland’s 2 IPCs if the territory ends up in his or her control.”
I wasn’t sure this would ever really matter but the UK invasion of Persia meant that I was supposed to declare Persia to mobilize Austrian, German or Ottoman pieces. It sounds like this is done before the combat round not that that matters much. Anyway, I will turn them into Ottoman pieces before starting my turn. You probably should decide which country the Danish will be mobilized by too.
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@the_good_captain Good that you mentioned it. I would like to have the Danish join the Brits. But it does not matter that much actually, as most of the time these neutral’s territories will be contested, yielding no IPC for its major power (so Britain, unfortunately, does not get two extra IPC… :( , as I thought at first)
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Game History
Round: 1 Puchase Units - Ottomans Ottomans buy 1 fighter and 3 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; Combat Move - Ottomans 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Mesopotamia to Sevastopol 1 infantry moved from Constantinople to Bulgaria Ottomans take Bulgaria from Neutral_Central Combat - Ottomans Battle in Sevastopol Ottomans attack with 1 artillery and 2 infantry Russians defend with 1 infantry and 1 port Ottomans roll dice for 1 artillery and 2 infantry in Sevastopol, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 1.33 expected hits Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Sevastopol, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.50 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Russians lost in Sevastopol Ottomans win, taking Sevastopol from Russians with 1 artillery and 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry Combat Move - Ottomans Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Neutral_True from Persia: 1 artillery and 2 infantry EDIT: Adding units owned by Ottomans to Persia: 1 artillery and 2 infantry EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode 1 infantry moved from Syrian Desert to Mesopotamia 1 artillery moved from Persia to Mesopotamia 1 infantry moved from Smyrna to Syrian Desert 1 artillery and 6 infantry moved from Ankara to Mesopotamia 1 infantry moved from Persia to Mesopotamia 1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from Constantinople to Ankara 1 infantry moved from Constantinople to Ankara Place Units - Ottomans 1 fighter and 3 infantry placed in Constantinople Turn Complete - Ottomans Ottomans collect 21 PUs; end with 22 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Russians regular : -0.50 Ottomans regular : -0.33 -
@the_good_captain Hmm, that’s weird. I wanted to reinforce Venice, but the game engine started a battle there, while it’s possible to reinforce a contested area without initiating combat, or am I getting this wrong? (On top of that, I got diced really hard with no hits, and almost all your units got a hit xD)
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first, the rules:
“All movement is considered to take place at the same time, and must be completed in this phase.” -page 17 (I have been bad at this, I will make sure I’m not using the NCM phase going forward)
and most importantly, this:
“Combat occurs when your units share the same space with units belonging to one or more opposing powers and you decide to commit your units to an attack. Only enemy units may be attacked. When attacking, all units in the space belonging to your power must attack. You are required to attack only in territories that have become contested this turn due to your movement of units into them. Attacks in territories that were already contested at the beginning of the turn and in sea zones are always optional, even if you have moved units into them this turn.”
In short, if you did not want to attack, you did not have to.
The practical fix for this in TripleA is the following: If you do not wish to attack in a contested territory, BEFORE any dice are rolled EDIT your units in the contested territory and make them all neutral. After the Combat phase, turn them all back into units of your side. That’s the only way to keep things in good faith as far as I can see.
So what did “Previous Units Fight” do…?..? lol
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@the_good_captain
Game HistoryRound: 1 Puchase Units - Italians Italians buy 1 fighter and 2 infantry; Remaining resources: 2 PUs; Combat Move - Italians 2 artilleries and 6 infantry moved from Piedmont to Venice 2 artilleries and 6 infantry moved from Rome to Tuscany 1 infantry moved from Naples to SZ 17 1 infantry moved from SZ 17 to Albania Italians take Albania from Neutral_Allied 1 artillery and 1 infantry moved from Libya to Egypt 1 infantry moved from Somaliland to British East Africa Combat - Italians Battle in Venice Italians attack with 4 artilleries and 7 infantry AustroHungarians defend with 4 artilleries and 6 infantry Italians roll dice for 4 artilleries and 7 infantry in Venice, round 2 : 0/11 hits, 5,00 expected hits AustroHungarians roll dice for 4 artilleries and 6 infantry in Venice, round 2 : 6/10 hits, 5,00 expected hits 6 infantry owned by the Italians lost in Venice AustroHungarians and Italians reach a stalemate . Battle score for attacker is -18 Casualties for Italians: 6 infantry Combat Move - Italians Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Adding units owned by Italians to Venice: 6 infantry EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Place Units - Italians 1 fighter and 2 infantry placed in Rome Turn Complete - Italians Italians collect 14 PUs; end with 16 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Italians regular : -5,00 AustroHungarians regular : 1,00I guess Previous Units Fight only disables combat in territories that were contested from the start of your turn, given that you don’t move into them. If you do, combat automatically happens. Well, that’s annoying :)
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@victoryfirst the Americans are up now.
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@the_good_captain Oh lol, I forgot about the turn order again. My American turn wasn’t that interesting anyway :)
Game History
Round: 1 Puchase Units - Americans Americans buy nothing; Remaining resources: 20 PUs; Turn Complete - Americans Americans collect 20 PUs; end with 40 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
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Game History
Round: 2 Puchase Units - AustroHungarians AustroHungarians buy 2 fighters and 5 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; Combat Move - AustroHungarians Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by AustroHungarians from Venice: 1 infantry EDIT: Adding units owned by Neutral_True to Venice: 1 infantry EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode 4 artilleries and 5 infantry moved from Venice to Trieste 1 infantry moved from Serbia to Trieste 1 infantry moved from Serbia to Trieste 1 artillery moved from Serbia to Trieste 1 infantry moved from Serbia to Trieste 3 infantry moved from Galicia to Ukraine 6 artilleries and 25 infantry moved from Galicia to Romania 1 fighter moved from Vienna to Serbia 1 fighter moved from Vienna to Serbia Combat - AustroHungarians Battle in Serbia AustroHungarians attack with 1 artillery, 2 fighters and 3 infantry Neutral_Allied defend with 1 infantry AustroHungarians roll dice for 1 artillery, 2 fighters and 3 infantry in Serbia, round 2 : 1/6 hits, 2.50 expected hits Neutral_Allied roll dice for 1 infantry in Serbia, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.50 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Neutral_Allied lost in Serbia AustroHungarians win, taking Serbia from Neutral_Allied with 1 artillery, 2 fighters and 3 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3 Casualties for Neutral_Allied: 1 infantry Battle in Ukraine AustroHungarians attack with 3 infantry Russians defend with 1 infantry AustroHungarians roll dice for 3 infantry in Ukraine, round 2 : 0/3 hits, 1.00 expected hits Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Ukraine, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0.50 expected hits Russians and AustroHungarians reach a stalemate Battle in Romania AustroHungarians attack with 6 artilleries and 25 infantry Russians defend with 1 artillery and 6 infantry AustroHungarians roll dice for 6 artilleries and 25 infantry in Romania, round 2 : 14/31 hits, 12.33 expected hits Russians roll dice for 1 artillery and 6 infantry in Romania, round 2 : 2/7 hits, 3.50 expected hits 6 infantry owned by the Russians, 2 infantry owned by the AustroHungarians and 1 artillery owned by the Russians lost in Romania AustroHungarians win, taking Romania from Russians with 6 artilleries and 23 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 16 Casualties for AustroHungarians: 2 infantry Casualties for Russians: 1 artillery and 6 infantry Combat Move - AustroHungarians Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Removing units owned by Neutral_True from Venice: 1 infantry EDIT: Adding units owned by AustroHungarians to Venice: 1 infantry EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode 4 infantry moved from Vienna to Galicia Place Units - AustroHungarians 2 fighters and 5 infantry placed in Vienna Turn Complete - AustroHungarians AustroHungarians collect 31 PUs; end with 32 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Neutral_Allied regular : -0.50 Russians regular : -2.00 AustroHungarians regular : -0.83 -
@the_good_captain
Game HistoryRound: 2 Puchase Units - Russians Russians buy 1 artillery and 8 infantry; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; Combat Move - Russians 1 artillery and 3 infantry moved from Tatarstan to Sevastopol 1 artillery moved from Tatarstan to Sevastopol Combat - Russians Russians creates battle in territory Ukraine Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Turning on Edit Mode EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode Battle in Sevastopol Russians attack with 2 artilleries and 3 infantry Ottomans defend with 1 artillery, 2 infantry and 1 port Russians roll dice for 2 artilleries and 3 infantry in Sevastopol, round 2 : 4/5 hits, 2,33 expected hits Ottomans roll dice for 1 artillery and 2 infantry in Sevastopol, round 2 : 1/3 hits, 1,50 expected hits 1 infantry owned by the Russians, 1 artillery owned by the Ottomans and 2 infantry owned by the Ottomans lost in Sevastopol Russians win, taking Sevastopol from Ottomans with 2 artilleries and 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 7 Casualties for Russians: 1 infantry Casualties for Ottomans: 1 artillery and 2 infantry Battle in Ukraine Russians attack with 1 infantry AustroHungarians defend with 3 infantry Russians roll dice for 1 infantry in Ukraine, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits AustroHungarians roll dice for 3 infantry in Ukraine, round 2 : 0/3 hits, 1,50 expected hits AustroHungarians and Russians reach a stalemate Combat Move - Russians 1 infantry moved from Karelia to Livonia 1 infantry moved from Belarus to Livonia 1 infantry moved from Belarus to Livonia 1 artillery and 2 infantry moved from Moscow to Tatarstan 3 fighters moved from Moscow to Belarus Place Units - Russians 1 artillery and 8 infantry placed in Moscow Turn Complete - Russians Russians collect 19 PUs; end with 19 PUsCombat Hit Differential Summary :
Russians regular : 1,33 Ottomans regular : -0,50 AustroHungarians regular : -1,50A battle in a contested territory was resolved again. This time it was the battle in Ukraine. I didn’t move any units into it and had no intention to attack there, but the game engine still resolved combat. Is Previous Units Fight not secretly enabled or something? Nobody got any hits in that battle so I did not need to edit anything :)
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