ABH and Crockett36, (A+100) tutor game


  • Japan 1.tsvg
    I was torn on the strategy for Japan as I have not faced this level of bid before. If there had been just a little more spending on the Asia side, I would have abandoned mainland China completely and done a J1 DOW, taking Philippines and pushing towards the Money Islands on J2.

    Instead, I think I have enough forces to force a retreat from Yunnan this round and perhaps be able to hold it on J3. It is quite a costly push to get that single territory.


  • With so much bid, Russia plus China should have been able to hold on to Yunnan on J2. That would have been a devastating blow to the Axis as Japan’s economy would have matched by China+India+ANZAC, freeing up the United States to focus 100% on Germany. It would likely have been game over as the overwhelming spending makes finding a winning strategy impossible. A few more Russian tanks and fighters bought in the bid and on R1 would have ensured an early surrender.


  • @crockett36 I noticed that my Germany infantry/Arts/AA guns failed to move to SlovakiaHungary on G1. I need them to reach Bessarabia on G3 so this blunder is quite impactful. Is it okay to edit them?

    No problem if you want to change any of the Russian forces in response or redo R1/J1 if this is going to be very impactful.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    @arthur-bomber-harris go for it. I assumed an error.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    USA is up peeps. I assume 2 carriers 2 destroyers and an infantry for purchase. Split placement?

  • 2022 2021 '20

    I prefer to buy 2 CV + 1 DD + SS. Place everything but the DD on the Pacific side. The DD protects the Atlantic fleet from the lone German sub.

    Probably, the Axis will wait as long as possible to bring the US in the war since Japan did not DOW. Thus, expect 3 turns of nothing for the US. The Pacific is a bigger theater and will take more time to move units out. So buying everything over there now will allow us to be be in a fighting position sooner.

    In Europe, the US will be focused initially on the Med, Italy (if weak) and Normandy. All are close and easy to engage from the EUS.

    Move sb to WUS as it can hit all targets from there. Move all fighters and ships to Hawaii. Let the Hawaii transport go back to bring 2 more units to Hawaii next round.

    Run from the Philippines. Since all of J Fleet in SZ36, the US forces can stack in SZ54.
    In fact, because no threat on SZ54 nor Hawaii, we could take the transport with 2 inf to SZ54 as well to have invasion force. But leaves Hawaii less defended, and since planning on J3 DOW, it doesn’t really gain anything.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    I like all that with a caveat: what if we do pure air builds in Australia and put them on the 3 US carriers As soon as we have both a three plane scramble and six for the US flat tops. US air can ferry back to Hawaii as needed.

    What I’m proposing is what I’m calling extreme integration or extreme cooperation. We could do the same in the Atlantic, providing carriers for the British. Just a small innovation.

    The key is to never spend an ipc on an Australian ground unit


  • updated with German edits Japan 1b.tsvg

  • 2022 '19 '18

    PROPOSEDUST1.tsvg debate ends Sunday after church e s t


  • To clarify for your partners, are you proposing to have the India force stack in Yunnan to prevent a J2 attack, or do you plan to have those units get sacrificed to hurt the Japanese air force?

    Without additional support besides three more russian units, I likely would lose 6 of the 22 planes that would participate (+44 TUV swing for the Axis), although dice could swing it drastically one way or another.

    With the UK India units stacked in Yunnan, I would opt not to attack Yunnan on J2 and instead focus on other opportunities in the region as the unprovoked DoW keeps the US out of the war for a while longer.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    I’m open to that. I don’t see a downside


  • @crockett36 Open to which option? Declaring war on UK1 or UK2 means that Japan can attack UK and Anzac forces/territories and the United States cannot issue DoW until the end of USA3 when they calculate income. It is a significant Allied disadvantage.

    If you had plans to have held Yunnan on turn 2, you should have had enough Russian bid and R1 purchases to have held the territory without need for assistance from India.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    @arthur-bomber-harris I have incorporated trulpen s idea for keeping yunnan t1. I will need advise since I haven’t done this before but was responding to community input.


  • @crockett36 Definitely a tough choice in this situation and good to get the advice of our partners. Holding on to Yunnan on J2 makes it almost impossible for Japan to over conquer China until the very late game as China will have a massive stack that contains artillery.

    The downside is that a UK1 DoW to reinforce Yunnan means that Japan can focus 100% of their attention on crushing UK and ANZAC for two turns with no worry about American retaliation. India becomes difficult to hold without sending Russian planes to assist, and that makes it easier for Germany who doesn’t have to worry about an Allied invasion of W Europe until at least turn 5 and hence can focus 100% on heading towards Moscow.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    @arthur-bomber-harris Sunday 2pm.

  • 2022 2021 '20

    I don’t see the need to hold Yunnan to the death this round. We can buy artillery for the Chinese which makes their ground forces a threat. Retreat to Szechwan this round. Even if J pushes every ground troop into Yunnan J2, he won’t have them to take the DEI, and the Chinese would be strong enough to destroy them–tragedy for J. So, he will put a token force into Yunnan, we can take back C2, get bonus, and wait until UK joins the war.

    The important point is we do not UK DOW. The only way that I’ve seen that ever be useful for the Allies is when the Crazy Karl works or J makes a blunder that the UK /ANZAC can takeout transports or a carrier.

    Buy artillery. Retreat. I would consider attacking Chahar with 1 inf + 1 plane. Every dead inf for Japan is hard to replace once deep in country. If this happens, land plane in Shensi and cover with enough troops + russians to avoid 2 sb attack.
    Other consideration is leaving an inf in Yunnan so that J cannot simply blitz to take. However, if he does that then C2 will be a cheap recapture, because of that I would suggest just vacating Yunnan…it’s worth more to us than him.

  • 2022 2021 '20

    are you expecting UK inputs by Sunday 2PM? Or just comments on US+Chi?

  • 2022 '19 '18

    @surfer let’s wrap up us/ china by Sunday afternoon. Then I’ll present Britain’s combat moves.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    @surfer sounds good. I prefer a fade strike move against the monsterously large Jap Air Force. Garrisons generally don’t work.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    I didn’t do chahar. Seemed too complicated. I ll pick him off next turn.

  • 2022 '19 '18

  • 2022 '19 '18

  • 2022 2021 '20

    @crockett36 Why not takeout Ethiopia? Then you don’t have to reinforce Sudan and Kenya. Use 2 trans bring 1 inf + 1 tank from Alexandria and 2 inf from S. Africa + 1 in Sudan + 2 CA for bombard and this is a 95% battle.

    Leaving Egypt rather open. I’m concerned because I’ve lost SZ96 1 ftr + 1 tac vs DD…destroyed my game in the Med for a long time. I would leave more behind, and attacking Ethiopia will allow that.

    Now there is a wrinkle to the Taranto attack. Bring the transport with 1 guy to take Greece. That way when/if the Germans attack the fleet, and we had to bring up the CV to land the planes (since the UK ftr didn’t die), they have a place to land that is safe. We can “max defend” the SZ97 fleet. But pulls a transport from Ethiopia. Except that the Indian transport should bring 1 inf + 1art to attack. The transport in SZ96 can do double duty. If the attacks go ideally and the CV is not needed, then that transport can run 1 art + inf to Persia. If Greece is needed, then Persia waits a turn (using the guy in W. India to get there in on T2). Not critical because Italy will be contained.

    For SZ112, I would pull 1 ftr from the attack to ensure the SZ106 sub is dead. Sure he could scramble… and thus maybe we just avoid that by using only subs, still a 75-25 attack 3:1 odds pretty good. The thing is that killing the German BB is a nice to have, the sub in SZ106 must die so that the transport can be useful. If we don’t use all of our fighters in the BB attack, then we could send the home fleet to Scotland + 2 ftrs and ensure it is safe.

    Sealion is a general loser, but we have to ensure we are ok. Too cheap, and Sealion can be a winner. With the 2 ftr bid, and the transport able to bring in tank + inf we should be ok. But that just highlights the importance of SZ106 vs BB.

    Overall, I’m surprised we can’t do much better with the UK given the bid. Part of me thinks we should just hunker down in SZ109 with the 2 subs + fleet + ftrs. Kill SZ106 with DD + ftr. Let the extra sub go to SZ96 so that we don’t have to possibly trade a ftr for DD. And wait.


    1. Agree that Ethiopia is far better option to cripple Italy in Africa on turn 1.

    2. I am concerned about the adequacy of the Taranto SZ976 force without the CV. Scrambling becomes very tempting with the current forces as the TUV swing is favorable. I would need to do more analysis.

    3. Scrambling in SZ112 is tempting as the TUV swing is also favorable. I definitely would scramble with 1 fewer UK plane. 3 subs alone is a better choice than 3 subs 3 fighters, but either option gives me a 24% chance of having my Battleship survive.

    4. SZ 106 is also a risky fight. An added fighter would be so helpful

    5. DONT do non-combat moves until the combat is resolved. If SZ112 fight goes poorly you might need to move your Atlantic fleet to a safer spot.

    6. I agree with Surfer that you should have been able to do better given the UK bid. The Europe map doesn’t look much different than if you had 1 fighter in Scotland and 1 art in Sudan that would have accomplished the same objectives for 14 PUs. There was 67 PUs spent without much more advantage gained. I should be looking at the map now and saying “I am in huge trouble” but instead I am thinking that I have a reasonable chance to win the game.

  • 2022 '19 '18

    @arthur-bomber-harris so you’re saying that adding units to the Atlantic is useless given the mobility and availability of the German starting position or units were not placed in the Atlantic correctly or the wrong units were chosen AND placed incorrectly.

    Having played several bid games my early opinion is that we ought to let 40 happen and worry about 44.

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