Air Supremacy

yeah #3 is better than #2 and #1
its also what we are using in AARHE rules

anderson its been like 2 months?  read the current draft under Tekkys name for the rules.

Uhm, how about Air Supremacy:

Defending fighters fire in the opening fire phase of combat and then may choose to retreat or remain for normal combat (giving them a second chance to fire in the first round.)  Choice has to be made in the first round.

Justification:  Are infantry or armor or artillery actually gunna STOP a fighter from running away?  Common.  Seriously guys…other then an enemy fighter, who can keep up with a yellow bellied zoommie running home to mommy???

@Jennifer:

Common. Seriously guys…other then an enemy fighter, who can keep up with a yellow bellied zoommie running home to mommy???

yeah we made it so only air units can kill air units in land combat
so it doesn’t matter
enemy land units won’t hurt your fighters

however what you said bring up a strategic redeployment aspect in my mind from DAS (defensive air support)
the rule lets fighters defend in its own territories or alternative in an adjacent friendly territory

I would clarify it further to:
you may alternatively “defend” in an adjacent friendly territory X, even if X is not being attacked

Since I wrote this topic the first time many things have happened. However I have now used this rule for about five years since I invented the idea in this forum. Now I am interested in if anybody use the house rule “Air supremacy” and how you play it. My way to play it is:

Air Supremacy
Fighters attack or defend in the opening fire step of combat if no enemy fighters are present or remain in combat.

Personally I’m kicking around the idea that in general ground combat all hits by fighters must be assigned to enemy fighters.

Excess hits can be assigned elsewhere and are not wasted.

Once the skies are cleared of enemy fighters then fighter kills can go to ground targets. It might be harsh but that’s the fighter jock’s job…. unless your house rules have a specialized ground-attack fighter.

Mr Andersson:

Is this the Game Master i presume?

Co-contributor of AARHE?

Also, IN AARHE thats what we do. Plane hits go on planes till one side no longer has planes ( fighting at dogfight values) , then hits go against land targets and land hits cant go against planes. However, some restrictions of ratios of land units and planes are also presented.

For example you can do that thing where 6 planes and 2 infantry go in and kill a bunch of stuff, knowing the planes wont be hit. Thats like sending in a division to fight an army, supported with 10,000 fighters…which is silly.

hmmm [picturing: air units roaming invincibly over head while land units just lie down and die.]

Naw I’d think any land unit 1s should be “assignable” to aircraft representing the AA batteries on a Div TO&E.
As well as stopping fighters from becoming the “God Guns” of the game

I still think that my rule is more balanced and playable; fighters attack or defend in the opening fire step of combat if no enemy fighters are present or remain in combat. I have not seen any better rule for this yet. :?

Defender should always be able to pick is casualties in order to get more strategy in the game, i.e. be able to use cannon fodder. For you who have not red my article about Tacitcs, se below.

TACTICS

Tactics are an art, not a science. There’s no way to absolutely quantify them, no way to define secret formulas for victory. There are rules a good tactician follows, but they aren’t absolutely binding. The ‘secret’ to winning lies not in trying to manipulate the enemy, but in creating general situations in which you know the available menu of maneuvers and the balance of firepower will favor your force.

Superior Combat Power
If one add up the combat capability rating and divide by 6 you get an average number of hits that force will inflict on a round.
Mixed Force
A force of mixed combat capability will gain advantage after each side takes a casualty since it reduces their combat power by a smaller amount. If one attack a territory defended by a better mixed force, one will need a larger initial advantage.
Cannon Fodder
If one can take casualties in cheap units while the enemy has to take casualties in expensive units, one will come out ahead.

I devised my own rule for air superiority that was the exact same thing as rule 2, so I chose that.

The issue is control of the air

In World War II, pure naval firepower didn’t mean a thing unless one have the planes to back it up. Surface ships without air protection were simply vulnerable to air attacks. The Japanese gave a very convincing demonstration of this early in the war, sinking two armored British warships (Repulse and Prince of Wales). And unlike Pearl Harbor, The British ships were at sea and underway, capable of maneuver and prepared for air defense. And yet they were sunk … quickly.

Carriers themselves were vulnerable to air attack – though they proved more durable than many expected. But they could also deliver offensive blows from hundreds of miles away, long before heavy ships had closed to within range of island objectives. So one of the primary tasks assigned to the fast carrier forces was the destruction and suppression of enemy air forces. The fast carriers would sweep in ahead of the landing and bombardment forces, seize control of the air, and maintain control of the air until local ground-based forces could take over. This kind of offensive strike was the best possible defense, both for the carriers and the heavy ships.

Carriers and battleships were fundamentally different weapons. A heavy ship could only throw its ordnance a few miles; a carrier could strike targets hundreds of miles away. A heavy ship had to stay in close proximity to its objective. A carrier 200 or 250 miles out had thousands of square miles of sea to disappear into, and would still be in striking range of its targets. The fleet carriers held the edge in terms of raw speed and maneuverability. And they were more difficult to put out of action than anticipated. A ship that’s hard to find, hard to hit, and capable of delivering heavy blows from hundreds of miles away is a formidable weapon.

Moreover, the Allies won battlefield air supremacy in the Pacific in 1943, and in Europe in 1944. That meant that Allied supplies and reinforcements would get through to the battlefront, but not the enemy’s. It meant that the Allies air power could support land forces in their immediate combat, as a form of “flying artillery”. In Europe the Allied fighter-bombers seemed everywhere, and it was difficult for the Germans to move in daylight. Close airsupport might attack the tank or artillery piece that is actively attacking friendly troops.

The quick fix for these facts is the optional rule “Air Supremacy”:

Air Supremacy
Fighters attack or defend in the opening fire step of combat if no enemy fighters or AA-guns are present or remain in combat. Any casualties are removed from play without being able to counterattack.

yes thats great!

makes air power as important as it should be. Also makes them great against lone warships which now have less chance to destroy planes unless they have some air support.

Id like to use that for land as well.

@Imperious:

…Id like to use that for land as well.

Well, the rule is not just for naval battles. It is for both naval and land! I wrote this rule for like five years ago. At that moment noone was talking about air supremacy, now it is common. Nice to see! Remember that the rule does not say that fighters hit figheters first or anything about dogfights.

@Game:

The issue is control of the air

The quick fix for these facts is the optional rule “Air Supremacy”:

Air Supremacy
Fighters attack or defend in the opening fire step of combat if no enemy fighters or AA-guns are present or remain in combat. Any casualties are removed from play without being able to counterattack.

I like it because it gives another reason to buy AAA in this game.

Question:
In 1942.2, does AAA blocks all aircrafts for Air Supremacy or only 3 aircrafts?

Other question: if someone uses the house rule Cruiser get 1 AA shot, will you use it in a way to block Air Supremacy for all aircrafts or only 1?

Thanks anyone to tell me about how you use this rule in your games and how it affect the balance between Axis and the Allies.

@B.:

@Imperious:

Yes i second that… air fights air untill one side has so air and following that hits go against land forces as preemtives. Thats very simple.

One need to think more than once before engage an enemy force of figthers and how to protect those bombers. By your rule fighters will be a very important unit, maybe too important and hence become a game breaker. However I will try it in my next game. Another variant would be what I suggested before, air-to-air combat for the first cycle of combat where only air units may be taken as casualities. If no side has got air supremacy after the first cycle of combat, the fighters attack as normal. If air supremacy then fighters attack/defend during opening fire step of combat!

I would like to know what kind of rule you use.
Is it like 1942.1 : Fgt A1/Bmb A0  vs Fgt D2?
Is it like 1942.2 : Fgt A1/Bmb A1 preemptives shots vs Fgt D2?
Is it like Global 1940: Fgt A1/Bmb A1 vs Fgt D1?
And if it’s neither, maybe you have an idea on wich one among these three is better for tactical and balance.

Great idea:
“If air supremacy then fighters attack/defend during opening fire step of combat!”
Air Supremacy
Fighters attack or defend in the opening fire step of combat if no enemy fighters or AA-guns are present or remain in combat. Any casualties are removed from play without being able to counterattack." :-)
By fighters, you mean any aircraft probably?

Thinking about AAA role, maybe it could be a more active unit during the rest of the battle and not limited only to the opening fire phase:

@crusaderiv:

AAA - Always Active Antiaircraft
Every round of combat they get a roll @ 1, against each plane.
Geez…that’s a strong AA! I’won’t take the risk to fly over your territory!
OK against 1 plane each round but not each plane.

New rules for AAA:
On first round, AAA get a preemptive antiaircraft strike (as per OOB rules):
3 Att @1 against up to 3 aircrafts, limited to one roll per plane.
After first round, each AAA get 1 Att@1 against 1 aircraft but as regular strike, not in the opening fire phase.
If Air Supremacy Rule: 1 AAA can block up to 3 planes from striking on the opening fire phase.

This will somewhat reduces the advantage of AirSupRule and did’t let the AAA be a lame duck for the rest of a ground battle.
What do you think? Did someone ever try this combination of two house rules?