@david-06 sorry but no thanks.
Netherlands Fight Back
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In the Netherlands Fight Back expansion, the (v 3.) rules mention that :
(NFB 4.5) “The Dutch may build Colonial Infantry in territories with a point value just like the British. A maximum of one unit per turn may be built. It must be placed in a territory with a point value.”
First question : The cost for Colonial Infantry is not listed in the (v.3.0) Netherlands Reference Sheet. Do they cost 4 IPP “just like the British”?
It also mentions that :
(NFB 3.2) “You may build 1 commando per turn at a factory location. The Dutch may build 1 commando on Sumatra as if it were a militia.”
This seems to limit the Dutch West Indies builds to either Militia, 1 Colonial Infantry per turn and a sigle commando unit on Sumatra “without a factory location”.
However, the game rules only allow building a minor factory “in any land zone with a IPP-value and in Supply Path to Major Factory in Home Country” (as per Table 12-2 of the 1936 v3 Rules).
Since the Dutch Home Country is limited to the Netherlands (as per the Reference Sheet), this would be the only possible location to build a Major factory (as per Table 12-2 of the 1936 v3 Rules).
If Germany and Japan both leave the Dutch alone, this will never happen. With a peacetime IPP of 1, it would take 9 full years just to build the Major Factory (at a cost of 6/6/6) and 4 more to build one minor factory in the Dutch East Indies (at a cost of 8).
Even with most part of the 12 IPP Wartime Economy available, any sensible player probably will have more urgent priorities than to build a shiny new Major Factory right on the German Border…
Taking all of this into consideration, aside from having distinct orange battle pieces for the Dutch, this expansion only seems to divert much needed IPP from the British Economy, since it now keeps the Wartime Economy as a separate income (NFB 4.2).
In light of the above, the full build table on the reference sheet seems very theorical and an impossible achievement.
For those who play with the NFB expansion, how does it affect your game?
I also notice that the (v 3.0) Reference Sheet is not adapted to the v.3 Rules, with 4-turn builds for example. It also does not list the turn order for the Dutch, but I saw this issue mentionned in an older post also.
Bedankt!
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@Noneshallpass To your first question, the Colonial Infantry cost the same as the British, French, and Italian Colonials, 4 IPC’s.
To your “second” question as to what the Netherlands can build in the DEI, I’d say you’re correct that initially all they can build are those units you mention.
To your overall point on the Netherlands’ limited potential, I guess my first response that’s probably specifically by design. The Dutch are certainly a minor player in this game. I suppose in that sense you could compare them to the FEC in that they aren’t even allowed to build a Major Factory. I think this is realistic considering the size of the country. I think limiting their potential is the right move. But let’s not discount the affect being able to build Militia, Commandos, and Colonials in the DEI will have. These are areas that otherwise would sit stagnant until at war. This way some reinforcements can be pumped in from turn one to help defend there. So yeah, I agree with you that it’s probably an impossible achievement to build Factories of any kind for the Dutch.
But, I think you’re discounting something: Other Allied powers could Lend Lease the Dutch a Minor Factory once they’re at war, if you so deem in necessary to have. If that’s something you truly wanted, and thought could be held, have the USA, or UK send one via Lend Lease to whatever DEI island you desire.
To your other overall point of negatively affecting the British Empire, while I agree with you in part in theory, I’d have to disagree in practice.
True, this is money that the British Empire would theoretically receive and be able to divvy up amongst the UK, FEC, and ANZAC. It certainly takes away that potentially.
However, I think in practice for most games, it’s just that, potential. I think a lot of smart Axis players are coordinating their attacks on the Dutch so that the Germans are taking the Netherlands, thus triggering the Dutch entry to war and maximizing income, without coordinating with a Japanese assault on the DEI to occur on the same turn and/or the turn preceding Germany’s move. With this assumed coordination, this isn’t money the British Empire is going to receive anyways, as it will be in Axis possession. Or at least a good chunk of it will be on the first turn of war, with the rest of it probably to follow the next turn. So I don’t think this truly hurts as much as it might seem on paper.
True, the Allies could liberate those territories later in the game, and then the argument can be made that it’s negatively impacting the British Empire. Though, to play devils advocate, that might mean things are already looking bleak for the Japanese anyways if they can’t hold on to the DEI, making that extra money for the British superfluous anyways.
But maybe those are just my games. I personally never declare war on the Netherlands until I know I can make a concerted effort to hit the DEI first or at the same time as the Netherlands itself. I specifically want to prevent exactly what you’re describing: giving the British extra income they otherwise wouldn’t receive.
But then, let’s go back to how it affects the game. In addition to my thoughts above on how it affects the game for the British, I also think this can still actually make the Allies stronger. Again, you can pump in some immediate reinforcements in Militia, Colonials, or Commandos that you couldn’t otherwise. Plus, I think in a lot of games that money is wasted away to Axis occupation almost immediately. At least this way that money can go to some use for Dutch forces. Might also allow for more immediate troops to the front lines too. Maybe the USA continues to pump a Lend Least unit to the Dutch "home country"of London, if we assume the Netherlands has been taken.
My overall point being, I think there’s a lot of ways to get creative to keep the Dutch as a bit of a thorn. But I also don’t think it ultimately affects the British in as great of a negative way as it might initially seem on paper!
Can’t speak to the Reference sheet issues. I’d probably just ignore those and just use what’s on the main/new “Facilities” reference sheet for the game.
Yeah, if I remember correctly, it was though/decided that the Dutch turn would happen either directly after the British Empire, or at the same time. But I don’t think either of those were technically “official” responses/answers!
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