Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB



  • Ok, guys, ideas for the US/Ch/UK-superturn?



  • For the US in EU I’m considering mainly 3 options: a) Land in Normandie, b) land in Greece and stacking fleet in z97, c) neutral crush.

    I’m leaning towards b, although it does put the fleet rather out of play.

    In the Pac keep stacking by the Carolines. The USN doesn’t yet have the strength to take on the full japanese wrath.

    China hits 1-3 territories.

    UK follows suit. Maybe putting some fleet in z80.



  • Maybe it’s possible to do both a and b?


  • 2020 2019 2018 2017

    @trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

    Maybe it’s possible to do both a and b?

    If you do both of these, how will your setup be long term? Can you sustain both offensives after this turn?

    -Midnight_Reaper



  • My preliminary, sloppy analysis is that a landing in Greece needs max effort, but perhaps putting some of the fleet in z97 while landing in Normandie could be possible. Fleet in z97 will be out of place for anything but obliterate the italian fleet.


  • 2020 2019 2018 2017

    I wouldn’t suggest neutral crush unless you think you are in a position to start ferrying substantial US units to Europe. If you are mostly spending on Japan (which I think you have to given their income) than I think the neutral crush becomes harder to sustain.

    Assuming you can hold them, I would seriously consider going all in for Greece and 97. Greece is a great launching pad for taking Italy (so German units can get tied up protecting it) and air from Greece can reach Norway (with an AB) and Moscow.

    He may have enough German land units to take it back before you can properly set up but if so, that is pressure taken off of Moscow or Norway. And you should be able to drop a lot of air there and have a lot of British inf that can be landed. So it would be a challenge for him, especially if you are strat bombing germany.

    Normandy is also a good option and he is not that well set up at the moment to take it back. I’d also wonder if you have enough air between Normandy and Greece to hold both. This probably would require a UK naval build in 110 (which might not be the most efficient thing to spend on at the moment) and the UK/Fr air from the mid east would be needed Greece and the US air from EUS might also need to come east to 110.
    (And don’t forget about his air in Novgorod. The bombers can hit you in 97 and 110 and the other air can hit 97 if Italy builds a carrier)

    In the Pacific, Carolines is a good option and probably I would stick there for now. Down the road, Marianas with a naval base would be another. Air is in reach of Tokyo but you are just as close to Philippines and the money islands. This probably means that you need to take Palau (with ANZAC) and Iwo Jima with the US to deny his air landing options. Given that he just spent money on two carriers though, I might want to spend on units rather than a naval base this turn.

    And maybe it is worth putting the UK fleet back in 80 (which would mean that Normandy is the better option in Europe). I’d probably go for Greece first and then bring it back, but maybe that gives too much time to Japan to secure its position?



  • I think a landing in Greece looks like the best option. Joined by brittish land, it should be easy to hold and create an atleast on the short term stable outpost.

    If the US-carrier gets damaged in z97, the 2 UK-figs can’t leave it and won’t be able to take part in eventual defence, right?

    Looks like we will need the UK ac in z97, but can build another one in z80, together with 1 des, 2 cr that move there. Idea is to bring in all subs and take out the IN next turn.

    I’m keen on blocking in z77 so that J won’t be able to disrupt the nice russian income-boost.



  • This way there’s no need for an ab in Norway, I think. 2 UK-figs may move down to the US-carrier. Will only need 2 figs in Greece to hold against the italian onslaught.



  • One bonus with this move is that we won’t waste the russian sub.



  • If Italy scrambles and it fizzles, we may as backup move in more fleet than originally intended, securing z97 against german air.

    See though that we may bring in an sb from Norway, so the landing in Greece should be secured.



  • Another idea I consider is to move down to z54 in order to pressure the DEI more and being able to take out the tr in z42 without having to waste a sub. What do you say? The fleet is still very flexible from there, may for instance go to Marianas next turn or perhaps make a solid landing on some island. Presume it will be contested, but that ties J up a bit in the south-east.



  • TripleA Manual Gamesave Post: Americans round 7

    TripleA Manual Gamesave Post for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 4.0

    Game History

    Round: 7
    
        Purchase Units - Americans
            Americans buy 3 artilleries, 1 carrier, 1 destroyer, 2 fighters, 5 infantry, 1 submarine and 1 transport; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 
    
        Combat Move - Americans
            1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from Morocco to 92 Sea Zone
            1 infantry, 1 mech_infantry and 1 transport moved from 92 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from 97 Sea Zone to Greece
            1 carrier, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer and 2 fighters moved from 92 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from Norway to Finland
            2 fighters moved from Norway to Finland
            1 bomber moved from Norway to 97 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Norway to Germany
    

    Combat Hit Differential Summary :

    Savegame



  • @trulpen said in Tutor game: AndrewAAGamer (X) vs trulpen [and everyone else] (A+50) OOB:

    Another idea I consider is to move down to z54 in order to pressure the DEI more and being able to take out the tr in z42 without having to waste a sub. What do you say? The fleet is still very flexible from there, may for instance go to Marianas next turn or perhaps make a solid landing on some island. Presume it will be contested, but that ties J up a bit in the south-east.

    At the same time the Carolines is a better position and 1 des, 1 sub, 1 tr is able to join up with the USN. Perhaps worth 1 aussie sub? Another idea is to move down only one ac with aussie figs on it, hit the tr, land the other fig in Queensland and be happy. If J goes after it, anything that does will likely die. Unless J is able to stack in the vicinity of z54.



  • Oups, forgot to build in Norway. Will adjust.



  • TripleA Manual Gamesave Post: Americans round 7

    TripleA Manual Gamesave Post for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 4.0

    Game History

    Round: 7
    
        Purchase Units - Americans
            Americans buy 3 artilleries, 1 carrier, 1 fighter, 6 infantry, 1 submarine and 2 tactical_bombers; Remaining resources: 0 PUs; 
    
        Combat Move - Americans
            2 infantry moved from Morocco to 92 Sea Zone
            2 infantry and 1 transport moved from 92 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            2 infantry moved from 97 Sea Zone to Greece
            1 carrier, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer and 2 fighters moved from 92 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Norway to 97 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Norway to Germany
            2 infantry moved from Norway to Finland
            2 fighters moved from Norway to Finland
    

    Combat Hit Differential Summary :

    Savegame



  • Not completely sure about this. Normandie already has a mIC and is a lot easier to hold with brittish reinforcements. Also it’s closer to Norway.

    I will try to look closer at achieving both Normandie and Greece instead. Then Germany is pressured from all four fronts, which is a very good thing.

    Can’t let Japan to rein free in the Indian Ocean though.

    Needs enough fleet in z80, z92, z97 and z110. An option for z92 is to sacrifice the french des, which however may move to z97 and help out during the german turn.

    If not Normandie, the 3 tr in z91 will go back and pick up 4 inf, 2 art from EUS. Those land units could be fleet and air in the Pac.



  • I don’t think that you are ready to yet take Greece. Normandy is a far easier place to hold since you can easily move UK fighters there to protect after an American invasion. Italy can be far more easily crushed with 6 Mediterranean subs convoy raiding them to death.



  • Problem is the italian fleet. It will kill the subs, so need to stack fleet in z97 in order to crush the fleet next turn.



  • Btw, it’s possible to move in 3 fig, 1 tac to Greece, if I remember correctly. And Italy has many units, but not much offensive strength.


  • 2020

    Sure, we can hold Greece with Brit air. But moving the fleet to SZ97 saves the Russian sub, but loses the French DD. More importantly what are we doing with the units in SZ91? Can’t move them in without the Italians pouncing them. Unless planning on a AB in Gibraltar. Also, moving all the Red Sea fleet to Med for protection leaves S. Africa for quick jaunt from India.

    I don’t know that Greece is a good play at this time. It’s hard to bring in reinforcements, but perhaps the Middle East is strong enough to start pumping troops in. But the Axis can build a strong counter over a few turns.
    I like SZ97 because because it allows time to build up the Allied fleet strength and sink the Italians permanently. But Greece is a hard long term hold at this time.

    I would attack Normandy. Bring 1 CV, the US troops to take Normandy. Bring Brit DD + Brits buy CV. The US lands 2 ftrs in London, and 2 ftr land on CV in SZ110. 2 Ftrs from Norway can land on Brit CV. That will defend the transports and then invasion is a go.

    I don’t understand the island hopping campaign. In OOB, there is minimal advantage to taking many of these islands, and they tie up units for 3 turns, 1 to take, 1 to get back, and finally 1 to be offensive again. But since we are here and have a “dead” move for the Marshall islands group, I would take Iwo, since J cannot take it back for at least 1 turn.

    In general, this is the part of the Pacific war that I call the “harassment” phase. I take any money island + any convoy opportunity that has a good trade in IPCs, while I wait for the US fleet to build. I’m not strong enough to attack J, so I really don’t know what else to do…

    I mention this to find out what a better strategy entails. As I see it, trading evenly for islands is ok if I’m doing it with the ANZACs vs. J because ANZAC forces regenerate quicker.
    I would take every opportunity to kill J subs+ transports, maybe wait until ANZAC and Brits to kill SZ42 and 79 SS so the US can keep its fleet as an offensive force.


  • 2020 2019 2018 2017

    @surfer the islands have less value in OOB than BM3 but they still can be used as landing zones for Japanese air (and can mean that Japan can attack the US fleet with twice the number of air than its carriers woud normally allow). Caroline Islands is safe from that now, (although I expect on the next turn he will need to take Paulau to keep the the fleet there) but Marianas isn’t. I don’t think Trulpen is opting to go to Marianas this turn, but down the road it can be a good option for the allies to threaten Japan. With a naval base it has the same reach as Carolines into the money islands, but air on carriers there can support an attack on Japan.

    I agree though that as much as possible you want to use ANZAC units. Always better to trade them rather than US units.

    And Normandy is a good option as well and maybe a safer one to hold (because of the support from the UK and Norway. But as long as Greece and 97 can be safely taken and held this turn, they have some advantages though. 1) It threatens Italy more while going to Normandy takes pressure off. 2) Air can reach Moscow (and vice versa) whereas the air needed to defend Normandy can’t. 3). German factories are further away.

    The US carrier in 91 is protected by the French DD in 92. But you are right that if you pull that fleet away from 80, than South Africa is a concern and probably means that the UK build and plan NCMs need to keep UK in a position to deny a Japanese attack there.



  • One important factor in this is the ability to send air to Moscow if there’s a pressing need. If G builds 3 tac, 3 tank, 1 sb next turn and stacks in Bryansk, we would need an extra 12 figs, 1 tac in order to feel safe. Of course 2 sb will be in the mix as well, which more or less relieve us of 2 figs.

    That definitely speaks for a landing in Greece.

    If I remember correctly an effort in Normandie will need 6-7 figs to secure z110, since G may hit it with 1 sub, 2 fig, 2 tac, 4 sb.

    We can simply not afford the Normandie endeavour. Sad, but true.

    With Greece, UK may land a shitload of figs there and in EP as well, also keeping serious pressure on J.

    Ok, this will be the plan to go forward.

    If we can hold Greece or not as an outpost is not the critical issue here. Keeping Russia alive is key. Especially with that yummy extra 12 IPC every turn.



  • Think I missed 1 mech, 1 tank, so that means likely 14 air needed and we have access to 20.



  • TripleA Turn Summary: Americans round 7

    TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 4.0

    Game History

    Round: 7
    
        Purchase Units - Americans
            Americans buy 2 bombers, 1 carrier, 1 destroyer, 4 infantry and 2 tactical_bombers; Remaining resources: 2 PUs; 
    
        Combat Move - Americans
            1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from Morocco to 92 Sea Zone
            1 infantry, 1 mech_infantry and 1 transport moved from 92 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from 97 Sea Zone to Greece
            1 carrier, 1 cruiser, 1 destroyer and 2 fighters moved from 92 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Norway to 97 Sea Zone
            1 bomber moved from Norway to Germany
            2 infantry moved from Norway to Finland
            2 fighters moved from Norway to Finland
    
        Combat - Americans
            Strategic bombing raid in Germany
                    AA fire in Germany : 0/1 hits, 0,17 expected hits
                Bombing raid in Germany rolls: 6 and causes: 6 damage to unit: factory_major
                Bombing raid in Germany causes 6 damage total. 
            Battle in Greece
            Battle in Finland
                Americans attack with 2 fighters and 2 infantry
                Germans defend with 1 infantry
                    Americans roll dice for 2 fighters and 2 infantry in Finland, round 2 : 1/4 hits, 1,33 expected hits
                    Germans roll dice for 1 infantry in Finland, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Germans lost in Finland
                Americans win, taking Greece from Italians, taking Finland from Germans with 2 fighters and 2 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 3
                Casualties for Germans: 1 infantry
    
        Non Combat Move - Americans
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
            Turning on Edit Mode
            EDIT: Turning off Edit Mode
            2 fighters moved from Finland to Norway
            1 bomber moved from Germany to Norway
            1 aaGun moved from Algeria to 92 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from Algeria to 92 Sea Zone
            1 aaGun, 3 infantry and 2 transports moved from 92 Sea Zone to 97 Sea Zone
            1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from 97 Sea Zone to Greece
            1 aaGun and 1 infantry moved from Morocco to Algeria
            2 transports moved from 91 Sea Zone to 92 Sea Zone
            1 transport moved from 91 Sea Zone to 101 Sea Zone
            1 carrier moved from 91 Sea Zone to 92 Sea Zone
            2 fighters moved from Eastern United States to 92 Sea Zone
            2 fighters moved from 91 Sea Zone to Malta
            1 bomber moved from Eastern United States to Norway
            1 bomber moved from 97 Sea Zone to Malta
            1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 3 submarines moved from 26 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
            1 destroyer and 1 submarine moved from 32 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
            1 infantry and 1 mech_infantry moved from Marshall Islands to 32 Sea Zone
            1 infantry, 1 mech_infantry and 1 transport moved from 32 Sea Zone to 33 Sea Zone
            1 infantry moved from 33 Sea Zone to Caroline Islands
            1 infantry moved from 33 Sea Zone to Caroline Islands
            1 infantry moved from Caroline Islands to 33 Sea Zone
            1 fighter moved from Wake Island to 33 Sea Zone
            1 carrier, 1 destroyer and 2 submarines moved from 10 Sea Zone to 26 Sea Zone
    
        Place Units - Americans
            3 infantry placed in Norway
            2 bombers placed in Eastern United States
            1 infantry placed in Central United States
            2 tactical_bombers placed in Western United States
            1 carrier and 1 destroyer placed in 10 Sea Zone
    
        Turn Complete - Americans
            Americans collect 59 PUs; end with 61 PUs
            Objective Americans 1 Homeland: Americans met a national objective for an additional 10 PUs; end with 71 PUs
            Objective Americans 3 Defense Obligations: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 76 PUs
            Objective Americans 2 Outer Territories: Americans met a national objective for an additional 5 PUs; end with 81 PUs
    

    Combat Hit Differential Summary :

    Germans : -0,33
    Americans : -0,33
    AA fire in Germany : : -0,17
    

    Savegame



  • TripleA Turn Summary: Chinese round 7

    TripleA Turn Summary for game: World War II Global 1940 2nd Edition, version: 4.0

    Game History

    Round: 7
    
        Purchase Units - Chinese
            Trigger Chinese Loses Burma Road: Chinese has their production frontier changed to: productionChinese_Burma_Road_Closed
            Chinese buy 3 infantry; Remaining resources: 1 PUs; 
    
        Combat Move - Chinese
            1 infantry moved from Kweichow to Hopei
            1 fighter moved from Kweichow to Hopei
            2 infantry moved from Kweichow to Hunan
            2 infantry moved from Kweichow to Yunnan
    
        Combat - Chinese
            Battle in Hunan
                Chinese attack with 2 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 infantry
                    Chinese roll dice for 2 infantry in Hunan, round 2 : 1/2 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Hunan, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Japanese and 1 infantry owned by the Chinese lost in Hunan
                Chinese win, taking Hunan from Japanese with 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
                Casualties for Chinese: 1 infantry
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry
            Battle in Hopei
                Chinese attack with 1 fighter and 1 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 infantry
                    Chinese roll dice for 1 fighter and 1 infantry in Hopei, round 2 : 0/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Hopei, round 2 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    Chinese roll dice for 1 fighter and 1 infantry in Hopei, round 3 : 1/2 hits, 0,67 expected hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Hopei, round 3 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Japanese and 1 infantry owned by the Chinese lost in Hopei
                Chinese win with 1 fighter remaining. Battle score for attacker is 0
                Casualties for Chinese: 1 infantry
                Casualties for Japanese: 1 infantry
            Battle in Yunnan
                Chinese attack with 2 infantry
                Japanese defend with 1 infantry
                    Chinese roll dice for 2 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 0/2 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Yunnan, round 2 : 1/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                    1 infantry owned by the Chinese lost in Yunnan
                    Chinese roll dice for 1 infantry in Yunnan, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0,17 expected hits
                    Japanese roll dice for 1 infantry in Yunnan, round 3 : 0/1 hits, 0,33 expected hits
                1 infantry owned by the Chinese retreated to Kweichow
                Japanese win with 1 infantry remaining. Battle score for attacker is -3
                Casualties for Chinese: 1 infantry
    
        Non Combat Move - Chinese
            4 artilleries and 17 infantry moved from Kweichow to Shensi
            1 fighter moved from Hopei to Shensi
    
        Place Units - Chinese
            1 infantry placed in Szechwan
            2 infantry placed in Shensi
            Chinese undo move 1.
            1 infantry placed in Shensi
    
        Turn Complete - Chinese
            Chinese collect 7 PUs; end with 8 PUs
    

    Combat Hit Differential Summary :

    Chinese : -0,17
    Japanese : 1,33
    

    Savegame


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