Massive Japanese carrier buys


  • 2019 2018 2017 2016 2015

    This becomes more and more popular. In the first rounds Japan buys a lot carriers so they have like 8 or 9 by J5 orJ6

    It becomes “impossible” to take this down for USA while Japan also can protect more of their transports. F. eks in some situations you can place your fleet in sz 42, maybe even buy a naval base at Java which allows you to move to carolines if needed. You put like 2 fighters 2 tac on philiphines and like 3 fighters on celeb (maybe with an inf or two in both places)

    How to counter this?



  • Well I think building submarines and focus on supporting china on the mainland. Carriers don’t help them on the land war and Japan needs to keep HongKong and Shanghai to win. They also have less troops available for invading India.


  • 2019 2018 2017 2016 2015

    I think the goal is to avoid fighting for the DEI, or at least make it extremely less favourable for the allies to engage. Sure, it may come at a cost at the mainland but +5 for the DEI is worth it. In any case the game is pretty much normal until (J2) J3



  • I have seen it work okay in some games… it is not as powerful as you would expect.  The Allies ship block for the first few rounds to prevent the Japanese Navy from directly engaging with the much smaller fleet next to Queensland.  Eventually, Japan will need to pull back the fleet to the sea zone adjacent to FIC so that the carrier-based planes could support operations in Mainland Asia.  At this point the Allies have more opportunities to strongly contest the money islands.

    I won’t call it a bad plan, but it is not as strong as you would initially guess based on the ability to spend a mere 16 PUs and have an extra loaded carrier in your fleet.  America spends 4 subs and gets roughly the same performance, albeit at a slightly higher price.  Account for the opportunity cost of needing more planes on the Japanese carriers and the Allies have a method to approximately match the strength.

    The hidden benefit from a fleet with 8+ carriers is that Japan can decide to exit operations in the Pacific and drag a massive strike force to help out in the European/African theater.  If the Allies succeed in a costly KJF effort, with China out of control and the Money Islands too difficult to dominate, load up some transports and sail West to allow victory on that side of the board.



  • How does Japan keep control of the mainland when buying so many carriers?



  • With 6 carriers bought in the first few rounds you are not building factories or land units.
    This is 1 carrier a round with some rounds 2 carriers. That leaves you with about 40 ipcs of ground forces for the first 5 turns. Even china will outproduce you on the mainland.
    Nice to have transports but they are worthless without the troops inside them.

    While carriers are nice on defence the first attack they suck the 2nd attack when they are damaged.
    What prevents Anzac from building a bunch of 10 subs, the US from attacking that carrier fleet basicaly suicide on it and then anzac attacking with 10 subs.

    With that investment on carriers you will not have any destroyers/subs fodder, after taking the soaks and the fodder units with US anzac is attacking against damaged capitals with subs only. And each hit will not return fire.


  • 2018 2017 2016

    @ShadowHAwk:

    With 6 carriers bought in the first few rounds you are not building factories or land units.
    This is 1 carrier a round with some rounds 2 carriers. That leaves you with about 40 ipcs of ground forces for the first 5 turns. Even china will outproduce you on the mainland.
    Nice to have transports but they are worthless without the troops inside them.

    @oysteilo:

    I think the goal is to avoid fighting for the DEI, or at least make it extremely less favourable for the allies to engage. Sure, it may come at a cost at the mainland but +5 for the DEI is worth it. In any case the game is pretty much normal until (J2) J3

    As Oysteilo stated, the game is pretty much Standard until J2, J3 the latest.

    Assuming a 1x IC plus 2x TT’s on J1 followed by a 3x Mech for IC in Kiangsu plus whatever assets you may now choose.

    All Japan has to do is building CV’s from there on with a couple of Inf.
    The advantage J has is that it doesn’t have to buy a whole pack like the US has to do (1 CV with 2x Ftr’s).
    Japan starts off allready w. 21 Planes.

    Another huge advantage for J is that it also starts with two BB’s.
    Japan is able to easily split her IJN into two later even three equal groups.

    Having BB’s is different to have to buy them.

    I think a good approach against the massive CV build up is to build as well CV’s but lend them to Anzak. Focus on sub and dd buys and a few Bmbrs and try to outproduce Japan with them.
    India crush should be held off or even prevented.

    What approach did you choose Oysteilo?


  • 2019 2018 2017 2016 2015

    Thanks for your post AeV, you nail my point 100%. Assuming 5 rounds of japanese income: 26,40,40,60,60. This is fairly conservative and totals 226IPC. Lets say japan buys 5 carriers, 1 IC, 4 transports, 2 destroyers and 2 subs. This totals 148 IPC. So Japan has plenty of IPC (78) for men (and other stuff). In addition you fly two German bombers over and land them on philiphines. can be done by G6. Now Japan sits there with its 8 carriers, 2 BB,2 Cruiser, say 4 destroyers, 2-3 subs and 21 or so planes. Facing this the queensland fleet has to leave

    What approach I choose/chose. I try to compensate with carriers, fighters and subs, but the obvious problem is as AeV touch on, Japan does not need to buy planes. Meanwhile Germany has a pretty good time on the european side


  • 2018 2017 2016

    Maybe we should think about a different approach on Japan.
    Stack Havaii but also Wake with one DD, 3x Ftr’s and 2-3 Bombers.
    That way Japan needs to step back going Full throttle towards the South and has to guard all purchases on sz6.
    As long as the US keeps buying a blocker for Havaii USN should be safe there and send empty CV’s down  Queensl. for Anzak Ftr’s plus assets (Subs, loaded TT’s, DD’s).

    If Japan leaves new bought ships not well defended. KILL IT.
    Hack the line of support!

    Built CV in FID means less troops on India.
    Anzak should take chances to IJN on Java. Dented Carriers can’t hold Planes.
    Anzak purchases should be adapting to this wear down tactic (Ftr’s, SS).

    What you think?



  • @aequitas:

    Maybe we should think about a different approach on Japan.
    Stack Havaii but also Wake with one DD, 3x Ftr’s and 2-3 Bombers.
    That way Japan needs to step back going Full throttle towards the South and has to guard all purchases on sz6.
    As long as the US keeps buying a blocker for Havaii USN should be safe there and send empty CV’s down  Queensl. for Anzak Ftr’s plus assets (Subs, loaded TT’s, DD’s).

    If Japan leaves new bought ships not well defended. KILL IT.
    Hack the line of support!

    Built CV in FID means less troops on India.
    Anzak should take chances to IJN on Java. Dented Carriers can’t hold Planes.
    Anzak purchases should be adapting to this wear down tactic (Ftr’s, SS).

    What you think?

    What prevents japan from blocking your shipds access to SZ 6.
    Now you got only air to attack it with, and that air needs to land on a carrier pulling you into a risky position where attacks on the carriers will sink planes.

    Not that its a bad thing just an observation i like the rest of it though.


  • 2019 2018 2017 2016 2015

    @aequitas:

    Maybe we should think about a different approach on Japan.
    Stack Havaii but also Wake with one DD, 3x Ftr’s and 2-3 Bombers.
    That way Japan needs to step back going Full throttle towards the South and has to guard all purchases on sz6.
    As long as the US keeps buying a blocker for Havaii USN should be safe there and send empty CV’s down  Queensl. for Anzak Ftr’s plus assets (Subs, loaded TT’s, DD’s).

    If Japan leaves new bought ships not well defended. KILL IT.
    Hack the line of support!

    Built CV in FID means less troops on India.
    Anzak should take chances to IJN on Java. Dented Carriers can’t hold Planes.
    Anzak purchases should be adapting to this wear down tactic (Ftr’s, SS).

    What you think?

    Well, I think if you position “everything” in hawaii, wake and send lone carriers down to queensland and fill them with anzac fighters I think the main japanese fleet can sit in sz 6. A smaller fleet with 2-3 loaded carriers a couple of subs and couple of destroyers as well as a BB is probably sufficient to deter the combined anzac american fleet of queensland. From my experience I never make any significant progress by threatning sz 6 with USA.


  • 2018 2017 2016

    Sorry, i meant Wake as suggested in my post.
    Havaii gets stacked each turn with buys from previous round.
    Of course you send the USN down to Queeny.

    It should look like:

    Wake 1xDD, 3x Ftr’s, 2-3 Bmbrs

    Pearl 1-2 CV’s, 1-2 DD’s, 3-4 Ftr’s on Havaii

    Queeny BB, CR’s DD SS and Anzak units

    San Fran. Previous buys like CV DD 2x Ftr’s (44ipc) or add a loaded TT.

    You should be able to DZ sz6 and Queeny…
    If necessary to destroy new builds from Japan and reinforce Wake/Pearl.

    You also should be able to send down a loaded or loaded CV with an accompanying DD and replenish Pearl from S.F. with that.

    You should be able to Strafe sz6 every now and then. And react in no time if necessary.

    Unless i made a mistake in my thought process you should be fine.



  • @aequitas:

    Sorry, i meant Wake as suggested in my post.
    Havaii gets stacked each turn with buys from previous round.
    Of course you send the USN down to Queeny.

    It should look like:

    Wake 1xDD, 3x Ftr’s, 2-3 Bmbrs

    Pearl 1-2 CV’s, 1-2 DD’s, 3-4 Ftr’s on Havaii

    Queeny BB, CR’s DD SS and Anzak units

    San Fran. Previous buys like CV DD 2x Ftr’s (44ipc) or add a loaded TT.

    You should be able to DZ sz6 and Queeny…
    If necessary to destroy new builds from Japan and reinforce Wake/Pearl.

    You also should be able to send down a loaded or loaded CV with an accompanying DD and replenish Pearl from S.F. with that.

    You should be able to Strafe sz6 every now and then. And react in no time if necessary.

    Unless i made a mistake in my thought process you should be fine.

    So you can strike SZ6 with 4 fighters / tacticals.
    Japan can scramble 3 by default so anything bigger then a destroyer and it will be a 50/50 battle.

    No way you are deadzoning SZ6 ill buy a carrier land 2 planes on it and you can do nothing against that.

    And what will you do if i buy 5 subs and a transport, you cannot hit the transport with just 2 planes since i can scramble 3, if you attack with 4 i dont scramble and your 2 carriers will be in an empty SZ full with planes and next to my 5 subs. Combined with some extra planes on japan itself you either risk 2 full carriers for 1 transport or let it go.


  • 2018 2017 2016

    4 Ftr’s  and 3 Bmbrs.


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