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Can Soviet Union attack Finland (a pro-axis neutral) prior to Turn 4?



  • In the Global rules, under the Soviet Union Political Situation section it says, “The Soviet Union may not declare war on any European Axis power before turn 4…”.  I would interpret this to mean that they can attack Finland if Germany is careless enough to not activate it on Turn 1.  Agree/Disagree?



  • No, neutral nations may not engage any country until they are at war. There is no reason for Germany to not claim Finland unless you’re doing something insane like letting Italy get it.


  • 2018 2017 2016 2015 '14 Customizer

    Thats too bad that Russia and Germany cant fight over Finland without declaring war on each other.  Could make this another NO in game.



  • Not really true, Russia cannot attack finland as long as germany or italy did not declare war on russia.
    Once that happens it can attack anywhere it likes


  • 2018 2017 2016 2015 '14 Customizer

    @ShadowHAwk:

    Not really true, Russia cannot attack finland as long as germany or italy did not declare war on russia.
    Once that happens it can attack anywhere it likes

    Im  talking about starting on first turn.



  • @SS:

    Thats too bad that Russia and Germany cant fight over Finland without declaring war on each other.  Could make this another NO in game.

    I agree, and it would be historical too. I also think Russia being allowed to move into certain territories before at war was talked about during the Alpha project, but didn’t make the cut. It would be cool if Russia was able to invade/activate any pro axis/allied neutral that borders original Russian territory before at war, and there are only 3 territories that fit this criteria (Finland, NW Persia, and East Persia). This would also allow the Russians to move into NW Persia before at war w/Euro axis (which they also did historically). I don’t think that the Russians moved into what is Eastern Persia but I don’t see that as being a bad thing because it has no IPC value. Although movement through E Persia would allow Russian mobile ground units access to India on R3 with a simple DOW on Japan (that could suck for Japan and/or Russia lol).

    As far as NO’s go you could add Finland to Germany’s Denmark/Norway NO. This would allow the Russians to take IPCs away from the Germans if they choose to fight. You could also allow the Russians to get the 3 IPCs for pro-axis-Finland before at war w/Euro axis. Still not sure if it would be worth it for the Russians to lose units fighting for Finland, but maybe ? Would force the Germans to think about securing the region, or at least counter measures.

    As for the middle east I think that the Euro Axis getting up to 6 IPC for the oil NO’s is a good thing, and promotes fighting in that region at times which is good for the game. I feel that the allies should get something for locking down the same territories though besides the printed IPC values (NW Persia, Persia, and Iraq). I know that the allies are much better suited to claim these territories as they did during the war, however what if these same 3 territories gave the allies who control them a 1 IPC bonus each for oil. Something like that could be done for balance instead of a bid for the allies. I realize that Russia gets a 3 IPC bonus for taking Iraq once at war w/Europe, but that NO should be for continental Europe/Finland, not for some Russian excursion into the Middle East, Africa, or island hopping in the Med IMO.



  • This would not be realistic. By the start of the game, the Soviets had recently concluded a disastrous war with Finland already. They “won” the war but suffered hugely. The territory called “Vyborg” on the map represents the territory the Soviets won from Finland in that war. The Soviets knew at the start of this game that it’s military was a disaster due to Stalin’s purges, and would NOT risk another war, especially to provoke the Germans.

    But the game starts with 'Vyborg" in Russia’s hands…so this was their prize for already fighting the Finnish…and the entire world knows about their humiliating status of their armed forces.



  • Besides if we’re going to add that kind of history too. Then USSR going back into Finland will surely p�ss off France and UK again.



  • In 1940 based on the board it is assumed that Russia did attack Finland and took Vyborg, that is why they have it to start the game.

    From a game mechanic the Russians cannot invade Finland until they are at war with the Axis.



  • @-Savage-:

    This would not be realistic. By the start of the game, the Soviets had recently concluded a disastrous war with Finland already. They “won” the war but suffered hugely. The territory called “Vyborg” on the map represents the territory the Soviets won from Finland in that war. The Soviets knew at the start of this game that it’s military was a disaster due to Stalin’s purges, and would NOT risk another war, especially to provoke the Germans.

    My bad, you are right Savage. The Winter War was over before the game starts, and Vyborg being the spoils of that war starts off as Russian.

    @Caesar:

    Besides if we’re going to add that kind of history too. Then USSR going back into Finland will surely p�ss off France and UK again.

    Yep another “Phony War” but this time vs Russia. Get out or we will shit our pants



  • @WILD:

    @-Savage-:

    This would not be realistic. By the start of the game, the Soviets had recently concluded a disastrous war with Finland already. They “won” the war but suffered hugely. The territory called “Vyborg” on the map represents the territory the Soviets won from Finland in that war. The Soviets knew at the start of this game that it’s military was a disaster due to Stalin’s purges, and would NOT risk another war, especially to provoke the Germans.

    My bad, you are right Savage. The Winter War was over before the game starts, and Vyborg being the spoils of that war starts off as Russian.

    @Caesar:

    Besides if we’re going to add that kind of history too. Then USSR going back into Finland will surely p�ss off France and UK again.

    Yep another “Phony War” but this time vs Russia. Get out or we will ���� our pants

    One can image if France and UK helped Finland during their war.


  • 2018 2017 2016 2015 '14 Customizer

    @-Savage-:

    This would not be realistic. By the start of the game, the Soviets had recently concluded a disastrous war with Finland already. They “won” the war but suffered hugely. The territory called “Vyborg” on the map represents the territory the Soviets won from Finland in that war. The Soviets knew at the start of this game that it’s military was a disaster due to Stalin’s purges, and would NOT risk another war, especially to provoke the Germans.

    But the game starts with 'Vyborg" in Russia’s hands…so this was their prize for already fighting the Finnish…and the entire world knows about their humiliating status of their armed forces.

    Ya my bad too. Nov. 39 - March 40 war.  40 OOB starts in spring of 40. Too bad.

    Hey Wild Bill we must play a lot of 39 games !!! 😄


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