Aggressive Russian Strategy


  • 2018 2017

    Its an exceptionally hard game to learn, even though it is not among the most complex wargames.  We’ve play with a variety of different groups, a house group of 4, a local city group about 10 guys, the 30-40 national guys at Gencon.  This has helped with some of the burnout of seeing the same strategies over and over.

    I think that when some people get frustrated, they just kind of try different random and unconnected moves and buys but don’t seem to learn the overarching lessons of the game

    keep your stuff together
    don’t lose it piecemeal
    attack and defend in overwhelming force or refuse battle
    plan multiple turns ahead with your buys
    don’t repeat your mistakes
    don’t repeat other people’s mistakes
    don’t give up or get discouraged press on
    luck favors the bold
    know your specific opponents idiosyncratic habits and exploit them

    None of these lessons are like “buy 2 tanks and place them in X” or “never do X or Y with Japan”.  They are general rules that will lead you to victory.  If you ignore them, you’ll lose no matter how much you play the game.



  • @taamvan:

    Its an exceptionally hard game to learn, even though it is not among the most complex wargames.  We’ve play with a variety of different groups, a house group of 4, a local city group about 10 guys, the 30-40 national guys at Gencon.   This has helped with some of the burnout of seeing the same strategies over and over.

    I think that when some people get frustrated, they just kind of try different random and unconnected moves and buys but don’t seem to learn the overarching lessons of the game

    keep your stuff together
    don’t lose it piecemeal
    attack and defend in overwhelming force or refuse battle
    plan multiple turns ahead with your buys
    don’t repeat your mistakes
    don’t repeat other people’s mistakes
    don’t give up or get discouraged press on
    luck favors the bold
    know your specific opponents idiosyncratic habits and exploit them

    None of these lessons are like “buy 2 tanks and place them in X” or “never do X or Y with Japan”.  They are general rules that will lead you to victory.  If you ignore them, you’ll lose no matter how much you play the game.

    Some of those rules are not always applicable though.
    If the enemy has overwhelming force sometimes it is better to split your forces then to stay in 1 stack and be destroyed.
    If you find an opening you can abuse it by rushing tanks+mech through it and capture important areas, but this splits up your forces.
    If you use 2 or 3 attacks against a single force the first can be weaker then the defender ( US + UK + Anz  Vs japan fleet )

    Attacking/defending also is governed by the opportunity costs of the attack/defence. ( this is situational but can spiral out of control )
    If i got 1 inf next to an enemy fighter sometimes it can be usefull to attack it. Especialy french units in afrika can be like that.
    If you lose no big deal if you hit it costs the other a lot.
    Or attack with 1 inf vs 1 inf for egypt, if france takes it back ( low chance ) then the UK can get through the suez doing serious damage.
    1 italian bomber attacking a russian inf that blocks. If the bomber hits germany has a chance to take moscow. In itself it is a stupid attack 1 bomber vs 1 inf but the payoff can be huge.

    The rules you mention are good guidelines but you should also deviate if it really gives you a chance to make big gains.

    Some real-life situations i did. ( from memory so exact numbers might be different )
    Japan had a carrier + BB + cruiser + 2 destroyer next to java but failed to take it ( 2 inf vs 1 inf 1 art )
    UK pac attacked with 1 BB + 1 cruiser + 1 destroyer + 2 fighters + 1 tactical.  ( planned to save the planes )This would not win but would weaken the japan fleet enough for 3 fighters+ 1 cruiser + 1 destroyer from anzac to mop up the survivors.
    This is not a overwhelming attack but the 1-2 punch took out nearly half the Jap navy.


  • 2019 2018 2017 2016

    Wow, it is irritating how so many of you try to put some one else in a box.

    Think about it and ask your self if you want to be confronted like that, the way you suggested.

    Thanks for your Post CWOMarc this might be something for him.
    I made the experiance, that sometimes peoples just have different things in mind regardless of how many times you tried to convince them.
    If he doesn’t fit in in your group explain it nice and simple.
    Start positive, explain in a few sentences the problem, give at least one or two good alternatives
    (the link of CWOMarc in example) and finish positiv.

    If his World is Naval warfare try not to convince him into Aircombat.
    Like you cannot convince a Apple to be Orange.


  • 2017 2016

    @aequitas:

    Wow, it is irritating how so many of you try to put some one else in a box.

    Think about it and ask your self if you want to be confronted like that, the way you suggested.

    If his World is Naval warfare try not to convince him into Aircombat.
    Like you cannot convince a Apple to be Orange.

    I find it irritating that you don’t think people should try and help someone play A&A better… the person in question clearly has some issues that go far beyond “he just kinda likes playing with a navy”… this is literally a guy that tries the “Soviet Naval Strategy” from turn-1.  Just stop and think about that nugget for awhile.

    If I were that guy, and I was the one going “gee, I think some Russian Cruisers on turn-1 would be pretty cool, let me try that strategy”.

    After I got destroyed and lost Moscow in record-time, I would pray to the war gods that somebody would pull me aside and go “hey… about that Soviet Naval Strategy of yours… you might want to try something different, let me show you”.

    You seem to champion letting this guy have terrible strategies for all eternity.  People around here have all been offering helpful tips to try and improve his play so everyone can have more enjoyable A&A gaming, not leave him floundering hiding behind Soviet Cruisers in the Arctic Ocean.


  • 2018 2017

    The irony is that even if they are a total novice and they don’t learn anything, its better than playing with a group of 40+ year old men who crack playground jokes and act inappropriately tense when things don’t go their way or some kind of tension arises at the table.

    That’s why I’ve put considerable time and effort into meeting with and making new friends around the continent (through this website, local email list, local con attendance, and gencon attendance) so that I don’t have to play with grown children.


  • 2017 2016

    Finding ANYONE that enjoys the game is always a joy… in a world full of computers, cell phones, Netflix and instant gratification across the web, its hard to find anyone who wants to go to someone else’s home, break out a board game that can take hours and play some face to face.

    This guy with the obsession to build ships?  I’d love to invite him over for some rounds of A&A… at least its a fellow human being willing to do something other than a computer or console game… and who knows… maybe I could sharpen his game skills at the same time…



  • There are a large number of people who will not learn a strategy game, even a relatively simple one like A&A.  Since a game can stretch on for 6-12 hours, it can ruin a whole day to have someone at the table who is not only incompetent but will never progress.  You know the outcome of the match by the second round, but still need to grind on for the rest of the day.  Repeated failures with the same strategy but still expecting a better result is a definition of insanity.

    One of the players in our gaming group will only build infantry as Russia and will 100% turtle down in Moscow.  With zero desire for even the smallest Russian counterattack, it is a simple matter for Germany to sweep around the capitol, capturing Siberia and the Middle East.  If the Axis is patient, they are guaranteed eventual victory.  Making matters worse, he plays incredibly slowly.  Turns can last for 30 minutes before he concludes that once again he is not going to make any attacks.  Eventually Axis players get bored and decide to make an attack on Moscow, realizing that it is premature but unwilling to spend a few more hours before launching a more overwhelming conquest.  I personally would rather go home than participate in a match with him at the table.



  • @Wolfshanze:

    Finding ANYONE that enjoys the game is always a joy… in a world full of computers, cell phones, Netflix and instant gratification across the web, its hard to find anyone who wants to go to someone else’s home, break out a board game that can take hours and play some face to face.

    This guy with the obsession to build ships?  I’d love to invite him over for some rounds of A&A… at least its a fellow human being willing to do something other than a computer or console game… and who knows… maybe I could sharpen his game skills at the same time…

    Well even in the netherlands there are plenty of people to find to play boardgames with. The board is full of people in the US that want to play A&A. Ofcourse you cant do that every day or even every weekend but 6 - 12 times a year is doable i think.

    But it isnt about doing something different but the original poste described him as someone that keeps building expensive attack ships and just does not want to improve or learn the game at all. so no you would not sharpen his skills you would run right over him. And in a 3 player game nobody wants to team with him because he refuses to even listen to reason. At least that is how the Topic starter described him.

    But Axis&allies global isnt a casual game ( revised is ) it takes 6+ hours a lot of people will not want to commit to that. There is plenty that do want to commit though just a mather of finding them.


  • 2019 2017 2016

    30 minutes to decide not to attack is poor sportsmanship.

    Some turns can take a while but unless there is some really difficult and game changing decision, that is beyond the pail.

    Does anyone really finish games on the same day they start? Doesn’t seem likely to me.



  • @simon33:

    30 minutes to decide not to attack is poor sportsmanship.

    Some turns can take a while but unless there is some really difficult and game changing decision, that is beyond the pail.

    Does anyone really finish games on the same day they start? Doesn’t seem likely to me.

    Well if there are multiple attacks and the stacks are big you might need some time to do some math and calculate your odds. And that might result in no move because it is to risky.
    Some of my moves take more then 10 minutes to deside as they could result in an attack and counter attack and i need to know what would happen and what can attack.
    Especialy with planes and mobile units and multiple countries you have a lot to consider and account for.


  • 2017 2016

    @ShadowHAwk:

    Well even in the netherlands there are plenty of people to find to play boardgames with. The board is full of people in the US that want to play A&A.

    With the United States at 3.8 million square miles (9.8 million km2) and with over 324 million people, maybe there’s a few thousand that do play, but none are anywhere near Pensacola, Florida where I play (or at least they’re in hiding and I don’t know of them).  Yes, PB-mail/board whatever, but I’m talking face-to-face play, which is just super hard to find… I’m glad others on this board have face to face partners close by, but just because YOU do, doesn’t mean everyone has a bunch of people wanting to play face-to-face next door.

    I’m happy so many people have regular face-to-face people to play… but not everyone is in the same boat, so please don’t assume just because your situation is a certain way that everyone else is the same too.  I have one friend who’d like to play, but he’s the kind of guy who always has this or that going on and it’s always a “next weekend” thing that never happens.  I’m willing to work with someone who’s not so great at A&A over having nobody to play.

    Having said that, if anybody is passing through Pensacola Florida and wants a nice game of A&A, buzz me!  😄


  • 2018 2016

    typically only the first round should take any considerable amount of time. J1 attack go or no go. G1 assault on UK fleet and France, then the NCM position for attacking russia. UK deciding on its position in Egypt, etc.

    As far as your friend who won’t do what YOU want him to do,
    we draw tokens to see who is who. France and China are omitted of course. Randomize the player assignments and then your buddy will have to do something else eventually and maybe he will see USSR played as you want it or even better by someone else.

    This is a positive way to make it work without alienating your friend. He is your friend and it is only a game not worth losing a buddy for.


  • 2018 2017

    Simon33,

    Yes, we set up at the game shop at 10AM when it opens, and end around 5-6PM.  Game 111 is tomorrow at 10AM.

    At least 45 people were in that store a few weeks ago on Saturday, 2 pathfinder groups, 1 star wars rpg, 1 coed birthday party playing group games all day, 1 axis and allies crew (us), 3-4 painters, 1 star wars ttwg, 1 new homebrewed game demo, ticket to ride, 20+ shoppers at any given hour.

    It is a golden age of gaming in Kansas City.  If you build the game room, they will come.



  • Sean: Russia is the easiest country to play when ANZAC is combined with something else… if someone is struggling to master the tactics for this easy power, they will fail even more miserably when controlling anything else.  If it takes 30 minutes to think about moves for Russia, think how long it would take for a complicated country like Germany, Japan, or USA!

    There are some people who should find another game besides A&A since the game is not very enjoyable if one player is extremely weak to the point where the ending is a foregone conclusion given enough patience.


  • 2019 2018 2017

    @Wolfshanze:

    but none are anywhere near Pensacola, Florida where I play (or at least they’re in hiding and I don’t know of them)

    I found one!

    http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=32848.0



  • At least your guys problem is different from mine. The people I play with are smart enough to change tactics when needed but because I have spent 20 years playing with them, we all know each others plans and that gets boring. I actually forced everyone including myself to play a different country just to see a different game.


  • 2017 2016

    @Herr:

    @Wolfshanze:

    but none are anywhere near Pensacola, Florida where I play (or at least they’re in hiding and I don’t know of them)

    I found one!

    http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=32848.0

    Thank you Herr KaLeun… it’s a two year old post, but i’ll take a shot and see if he’s still around… sent him a PM and posted in his thread.


  • 2019 2018 2017 2016

    Wish you good luck Wolfsschanze, maybe there are more out there then you thought.


  • 2017 2016

    @aequitas:

    Wish you good luck Wolfsschanze, maybe there are more out there then you thought.

    Nope… heard back from him… unfortunately (as it was an old post), he has since moved out of the area… all alone in Pensacola with no A&A partners for face to face…  😞


  • 2018 2017

    See you in Indy, Wolf!

    Its a drive but its worth it…


  • 2019 2017 2016

    @taamvan:

    Simon33,

    Yes, we set up at the game shop at 10AM when it opens, and end around 5-6PM.  Game 111 is tomorrow at 10AM.

    Wow. How many rounds does such a game go for? Typically, the first round goes for about 1.5-2 hours in my experience. Later rounds might be under an hour but I can’t see getting to 10 rounds in this time unless you play significantly faster than my experience.



  • @simon33:

    @taamvan:

    Simon33,

    Yes, we set up at the game shop at 10AM when it opens, and end around 5-6PM.  Game 111 is tomorrow at 10AM.

    Wow. How many rounds does such a game go for? Typically, the first round goes for about 1.5-2 hours in my experience. Later rounds might be under an hour but I can’t see getting to 10 rounds in this time unless you play significantly faster than my experience.

    A few things help with this though.

    Deside before the game who gets what. That way the axis can already plan germany ahead of time, so germany takes like 10 minutes to play.
    Also since japan isnt affected at all by allies ( except russia ) you can also plan that 1 ahead.

    A laptop with excel and some setup so you can buy using that. Saves you calculating. Also allows the allies to plan their buys ahead of time without the axis knowing about it. Just not having to calculate what the total costs of you units is and easy swapping between buys without redoing all the calculations really saves time. Again even a 2-3 minutes saved each nation is already 20 minutes a round.

    Plenty of dice so you can throw a round in 1 go. Does not sound like much but saving even 10 seconds each combat adds up to about 1 minut saved the first round for germany. And with bigger combats the time saved goes up as well. Can easy save you 5-10 minutes each game round ( that is 1 hour in a 6 round game)

    Russia Far east movement goes before the rest of russia ( if there is only non combat play that part and then do the western front ) since russia is so vast your dice throws will not affect this area anyway and it allows the japan player to think while you are playing russia.

    Using these small things depending on the side i play i can either play the allies really fast 5-10 minutes each country maximum. I normaly buy and plan all the allies while japan is busy.
    UK-Eu isnt affected and once combat moves are shown you already know if USA and UKP and ANZAC are affected and how. Sure some non combat might affect it but using a laptop swapping a few units out for others takes seconds.


Log in to reply
 

Suggested Topics

  • 25
  • 17
  • 14
  • 6
  • 4
  • 39
  • 71
  • 2
I Will Never Grow Up Games
Axis & Allies Boardgaming Custom Painted Miniatures
Dean's Army Guys

55
Online

13.7k
Users

34.0k
Topics

1.3m
Posts