• I am just wondering how people deal with Italy as the allies and prevent them from ever getting going.  I know Taranto raid is a popular move and if successful really sets them back. So assuming the raid is successful, what are the next steps in making sure Italy never controls the Med.  I know there are a lot of variables involved so this question might be tough to answer but lets just assume Japan declares R2 as well as Germany and that Germany goes full Barbosa.

    I would appreciate any insight for other situations as well.  For example if Germany does some sort of Sea Lion feint or Japan dow R1 or waits till R3 and how this would affect the strategy if any.

    Obviously subduing Italy is a job best fit for the US so I would like to hear what people feel is the best way to approach this.  Specifically, what you feel is the best buys and so on. Let me know what you think.

  • '17 '16 '15

    Hi csaw

    YG has a video on Italy and the other countries. You should find them helpful.

    http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=35946.0

  • '15

    In general, I believe the best way to keep Italy grounded is a strong US Atlantic presence.  If the US has 6-8 transports at Gibraltar by turn 3 (not difficult to do) then Italy can’t get too cute.

    There are certainly more tips on this and GH’s video covers them well.  FWIW, I don’t think you have to Taranto to keep Italy at bay

  • Customizer

    In our games, it is usually the UK that keeps Italy in check. The US rarely deals with the Italians unless it’s to launch a major invasion on Rome.
    In most cases, our UK player on round 1 will do the Taranto raid along with attacking the Italian force in Tobruk. Assuming British victories in both, Italy is left with less than half their navy, just 1 transport, and just a few guys left in Africa that can be mopped up easily enough.
    For Taranto, UK uses the following:
    Carrier, Cruiser, Destroyer and Tac from SZ 98.
    2 fighters and 1 bomber from London.
    For Tobruk, UK uses the following:
    1 fighter from Gibraltar and 1 fighter from Malta to hit Italian destroyer and transport in SZ 96.
    1 tank, 1 artillery, 2 infantry from Alexandria to Tobruk.
    1 Mech from Egypt to Tobruk.
    1 infantry and 1 artillery from Egypt via Transport SZ 98 to SZ 96 and land on Tobruk.

    Both of those battles should end up in British victories, it’s up to the dice rolls as to how much stuff UK has left afterwards.
    The French ships and RAF will be enough to dispose of the remaining Italian ships and probably keep them from building any more so Italy is stuck in Europe.
    The Infantry/Artillery in Libya will be chased down by British armor/mech left over from the Tobruk battle. Another possibility is if the French move their fighter from London and move the infantry from Morocco to Algeria, they might even take out the Italians from Libya.
    The 3 infantry and 1 artillery in Central Africa can be chased down with tanks/mechs from the South African factory. You may have to chase them around for a few rounds, but you will kill them soon enough and then there will be NO Axis presence in Africa. Italy will truly be shut down to just their European territories.
    Then their only choices will be to buy infantry to move along the coast to defend against Allied landings or buy tanks/mechs to run over and help back up the Germans in Russia. They might buy some planes, but since they will only be making about 10-13 per round, only 1 plane per turn is all they can get. UK can easily overpower that, not to mention when the Americans show up.

  • 2021 '18 '17

    Nothing is required to suppress Italy;  it starts with 10 income.  You Taranto him and he loses all his mobility.  If he scrambles and loses his air force as well, then he is all the more paralyzed.

    With its navy, Italy can invade through Syria and look for Oil money, but if your navy is reduced to scraps, there is not much of a point in rebuilding it because its not going to be able to survive.

    Unless your opponent has Italy take France, Italy’s job is to provide a few armored units to the Russian front so that you can Blitz/Break their lines at the critical moment and let a big stack of German mechs through the lines.    Africa is pretty much a lost cause and my best opponent actually takes the pieces off Africa (the armor) because eventually the Americans will come and bust up your bonuses.

    Even if Italy does get ahold of some real money, I’d use that money to build infantry and protect Rome and the Atlantic Wall so that Germany doesn’t have to do it.

    Besides attacking Taranto, there really isn’t much you can do to stop the Italians UK1-UK5 besides mop up all their guys.  Building an air base on malta or Gibraltar makes your Allied fleet stationed there pretty much impervious to any Italian counter…Don’t let Italy hold Gibraltar obviously…


  • What I came up with is what I like to call the METT Principle. (For UK1)

    M- Malta, hit the Italian Fleet of Malta
    E-  Ethiopia, use troops from India to take Ethiopia before those troops become a pain
    T- Tobruk, use numerical advantage from Alexandria and Egypt to take the region
    T- Taranto, use your Naval Fleet and land based aircraft to wipe out the Italian Navy (and possibly their Air Force!)

    Even if one of these fails, Italy is just about done to start


  • @SJS063:

    What I came up with is what I like to call the METT Principle. (For UK1)

    M- Malta, hit the Italian Fleet of Malta
    E-  Ethiopia, use troops from India to take Ethiopia before those troops become a pain
    T- Tobruk, use numerical advantage from Alexandria and Egypt to take the region
    T- Taranto, use your Naval Fleet and land based aircraft to wipe out the Italian Navy (and possibly their Air Force!)

    Even if one of these fails, Italy is just about done to start

    This does make india weaker from the start. By using indian forces for europe you are basicaly committing to europe first approach and you give japan a lot more room to move.

  • 2021 '19 '18 '17 '16

    But it is still a nice short name for all UK Med. Op’s.


  • I also sometimes use India forces to kill off Italians in Africa. It´s ofcourse a one time action. The rest of Indian Brits are needed against Japan. But I mostly make up for that by building an IC in Persia to help out India with European Brits.

    I also sometimes use my Indians to transport units straight into Persia so I can build an IC there UK2.

  • '15

    Agreed that I like to use some India troops to help out with Africa.  It makes a huge difference over there.  The one or two units you bring over aren’t going to have a significant impact in the Pacific (the Allies aren’t winning or losing the game over it).


  • It’s not the two units that India would be missing.  It’s the 4 ipcs not received from Java because you no longer have a transport.  I understand both arguments, though.  UK’s options in the Indian Ocean are interesting.


  • The only problem I usually have by using that TT for taking a DEI Island is that in round two that TT is lost and the two inf you stationed there are but a marginal headache for Japan.

  • '15

    @Tavenier:

    The only problem I usually have by using that TT for taking a DEI Island is that in round two that TT is lost and the two inf you stationed there are but a marginal headache for Japan.

    It’s a fair point Drummer but I agree with the above poster.  The transport can be of use the London in the Africa campaign.  I used to take an island with India but the gain of 4 for a loss of 10 or 13?  Doesn’t make sense.

    Now, if for whatever reason you’re confident Japan is waiting for J3 to attack?  That’d be worth it.


  • Depends on the Allied strategy. If the anti-Japan plan includes stopping up DEI with blockers and resistance, then you need to add the UK transport. Otherwise, it can be of good use combined with the other transport to move units between India and Africa.


  • Well you put 2 inf on an island there and anzac takes another 4 ipcs island.

    It prevents japan from just walking over and if they dont go J2 because they are out of position for instance you gained another 4.

    Also good chance those 2 inf take another 1 with them in defence. Inf for japan is hard to replace all the way down there.


  • @ShadowHAwk:

    Well you put 2 inf on an island there and anzac takes another 4 ipcs island.

    It prevents japan from just walking over and if they dont go J2 because they are out of position for instance you gained another 4.

    Also good chance those 2 inf take another 1 with them in defence. Inf for japan is hard to replace all the way down there.

    my thoughts exactly.  the tiny battles every turn in any of the DEI are good scratches to keep Japan from spending IPC’s to take a capital.

    Also, I just realized this has gotten off topic.  Supposed to be about stopping Italy, which I believe it is to hit 97 with almost everything you can, attack Tobruk, and either pin/chase the Ethiopian contingent.


  • Hey thanks for the replies.  I understand that it is possible to set them back.  However, I feel like a good axis player will use the German air to clear the med early and then the Italians still have the strongest naval presence in the med early game.

    If the Germans then commit their air force to helping Italy in Africa there is little England can do alone to stop Italy from getting to the point to where they are earning close the same ipcs.  Maybe I am wrong but once it gets to this point if the US doesn’t get involved,  most of England’s effort is focused on Italy.  Which is a win for the axis.

    The US can tip the scales and make sure the Italians stay in Europe but I am just wondering what the most cost effective way would be.  Thanks again for the insight.  I really appreciate it.


  • @csaw:

    Hey thanks for the replies.  I understand that it is possible to set them back.  However, I feel like a good axis player will use the German air to clear the med early and then the Italians still have the strongest naval presence in the med early game.

    If the Germans then commit their air force to helping Italy in Africa there is little England can do alone to stop Italy from getting to the point to where they are earning close the same ipcs.  Maybe I am wrong but once it gets to this point if the US doesn’t get involved,  most of England’s effort is focused on Italy.  Which is a win for the axis.

    The US can tip the scales and make sure the Italians stay in Europe but I am just wondering what the most cost effective way would be.  Thanks again for the insight.  I really appreciate it.

    German air can be used to destroy the UK fleet there. But that does not mean the end of UK presence, Sure italy gets 5NO bonus.

    A minor factory on egypt and the use of the south afrika factory can really make a difference in the med. I even started experimenting with a airbase on egypt and then using air cover to build a small fleet there. It can double to protect your transports in the red sea just 2 transports can put 2 extra units on egypt from SA every turn, so a 5 unit production on egypt ( effectively ) makes it hard to capture by the italians that have to rebuild their fleet and transports.

    UK cant do much else for the first few rounds better use it to destroy italian ambitions and to get a strike force ready in north persia, if UK defence caucasus and stalinggrad then russia does not have to.

  • Customizer

    @csaw:

    Hey thanks for the replies.  I understand that it is possible to set them back.  However, I feel like a good axis player will use the German air to clear the med early and then the Italians still have the strongest naval presence in the med early game.

    Okay, excuse me if I am missing something. I think you are saying the Germans should use their Luftwaffe to hit the British and French ships in the Med so Italy has more of a free hand down there. If so, that would have to be done round 1.
    So are you not attacking the British ships in the Atlantic?


  • Usually Italy clears the French ships and Germany clears whatever targets are left in G2.

Suggested Topics

  • 46
  • 13
  • 13
  • 14
  • 26
  • 15
  • 25
  • 4
I Will Never Grow Up Games
Axis & Allies Boardgaming Custom Painted Miniatures
Dean's Army Guys

67
Online

15.8k
Users

37.4k
Topics

1.6m
Posts