15L Dizzkneeland33 (+15) vs Gamerman01

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    Well, since you said that, I will have to say don’t expect it to go like last time.  And I think it’s a bad idea.  Radio silence doesn’t start until G1, right?

  • '12

    G1 radio silence.

  • '12

    If you sink dizzys  whole fleet it’s gonna be so epic.

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    Wait a minute – are you really counting that roll, even though you posted your turn and then I posted a turn after?

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    Absolutely.  You pointed out that the battle wasn’t over.  Then you protested that your turns were done, so I thought the best thing to do to placate you would be to keep attacking with the bomber.  The irony is very thick.

    Why wouldn’t I have a right to finish the battle?  You rightly pointed out that I forgot to roll the defense.

    You do realize this game is completely decided anyway?  If you have a big problem with this for some reason, man I don’t even care if you put that cruiser back and take my bomber off.  The Germans will clean up the fleet, and also take Moscow soon.  I don’t need to argue with you about a bomber or a cruiser.  Again, you’re the one that pointed it out.  This is getting more insane by the hour.

    Now what do you lose?  And I do think this is a good time to resign.

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    Did you notice that I didn’t finish the battle before playing ANZAC/France?  If so, then why did you play ANZAC/France?

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    You would have zero problem with this if you had hit back.  This is interesting.  Well, I have no reason to upset you.  Whatever you think is fair.

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    You know, it’s one thing to receive only one hit and then retreat since I didn’t hit two. �It’s quite another to keep the attack going after the French turn was posted, instead of retreating your remaining unit. �Had I been in your shoes, that would have been what I would have done – it’s sportsmanship, and it was your error to begin with.

    Sorry, but I thought this league was about sportsmanship? �Maybe I misunderstood… 😞

    The reason I played it out was because I don’t know what the hell you are doing rolling all of this on the forum.  I thought I just missed something.  You didn’t respond, so I went ahead with my turn.

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    I wouldn’t have had a problem with this if I had hit back?  Are you being serious??

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    I resign, and I’m very, very disappointed in how you ended this.

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    Here I am, just trying to play a game to learn something, and you keep telling me how much I should resign.

  • '12

    This is just a little misunderstanding guys clear it up and move on.  Nothing to argue about.

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    @DizzKneeLand33:

    You know, it’s one thing to receive only one hit and then retreat since I didn’t hit two. �It’s quite another to keep the attack going after the French turn was posted, instead of retreating your remaining unit. �Had I been in your shoes, that would have been what I would have done – it’s sportsmanship, and it was your error to begin with.

    You WANTED me to retreat???  I don’t understand.  You were complaining that you had moved ANZ/France already so it would affect them.  To minimize that effect and actually respond to your complaint, I did NOT retreat the bomber so that it would die.  What part of “do whatever you think is fair” do you not understand?  I do NOT need you to resign, I do NOT care, I just suggested resigning because that would clear up this little issue anyway.  I am a good sport, I don’t know why you think this is not sporting, and I DO think it makes a big difference that I hit and you didn’t, because had I hit or missed, and you hit me back, I really don’t think you would have any problem with this.

    Sorry, but I thought this league was about sportsmanship? �Maybe I misunderstood…. 😞

    You are misunderstanding several things here.  Take a deep breath

    The reason I played it out was because I don’t know what the hell you are doing rolling all of this on the forum.  I thought I just missed something.  You didn’t respond, so I went ahead with my turn.

    I rolled it on the forum because I misclicked.  I told you that up front.  Also, Triple A often doesn’t do fleet battles quite right.  No reason not to roll it on the forum.  You astutely pointed out that I did not roll my final defense.  The battle wasn’t complete.  You played ANZ/France anyway.  ANZ/France are quite insignificant, and really hardly significantly affected by the 96 battle anyway, so in my view you are being the bad sport.

    Whatever you want.  I thought the bomber and battleship were dead, and didn’t even realize to roll the final defense.  So reset it to where it was and act like this never happened.  I think I carried things out in a fair and sportsmanlike manner.  I see you protesting after the dice went against you, is what I see.

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    @Boldfresh:

    This is just a little misunderstanding guys clear it up and move on.  Nothing to argue about.

    Exactly.
    Don’t be offended at my suggestions for resignation.  I just honestly think this game was totally decided as soon as you went north to Karelia, because you completely lost Moscow for cheap at that point.  I would be happy to play until I meet victory conditions, if you don’t resign.
    The printed word is often misunderstood.

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    No worries.

    “I see you protesting after the dice went against you, is what I see.”

    Please quote ANYWHERE in these 10 pages where I in any way complained about my dice.

    That was like the 3rd time you said I should resign.  Do you think that’s a sporting comment to make to your opponent in the opening rounds?

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    No need to answer that question, it was rhetorical.  😉

  • '12

    I recommend continuing so dizz can learn why not to venture heavy into scandy.

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    My only complaint about the dice is this: they took away my opportunity to really learn something regarding Axis tactics as played by a Tier E player.  That’s my complaint.

    They didn’t change the ultimate outcome, just like the misplayed battle didn’t affect the outcome.  But what both things did was steal that opportunity away to learn the game.

    That’s all.  Peace.  :mrgreen:

  • '12

    Watch out when a tier e has hot dice.

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    @DizzKneeLand33:

    No worries.

    Great, thanks

    “I see you protesting after the dice went against you, is what I see.”

    Please quote ANYWHERE in these 10 pages where I in any way complained about my dice.

    No, I agree, you were AWESOME about the dice.  Most of the luck was going my way, for sure.  This comment was only, specifically, about the ridiculously lucky result I got when deciding to continue with the bomber in 96, and then after that you protested the way I handled it.

    That was like the 3rd time you said I should resign.  Do you think that’s a sporting comment to make to your opponent in the opening rounds?

    I thought it was 2, but I will believe you.  I understand you may not realize the extent to which you have already been defeated, and I don’t mean this in an offensive way.  I have won multiple games in round 1 and round 3 and round 4, so I do not really consider this necessarily “the early stages of the game”.  I also was not entirely serious when suggesting resignation - I consider it gamesmanship.  Now that I’ve learned you don’t take it that way, I can adjust accordingly.  We don’t know each other very well.

    What I do know is you have been a fantastic person to play with.  Compared to you, maybe I’m not the best sport, because you have been excellent.  No complaining about dice was impressive from G1.

    I invite you to continue, taking off my bomber and replacing your cruiser, but I think you will be giving up soon regardless.  I could teach you a lot from this game, but I am concerned that you might take offense.  I probably said too much already by saying you sealed your doom by going north from Novgorod when you did.

    Anyway, this is why I argue that it’s not really a problem if top tier players aren’t playing lower tier players much.  It’s really not competitive, and it’s over so fast and so lopsided that it’s hard to learn much, as you have already acknowledged.

    You’re a class act, Dizz, if you would like to get more experience playing veteran players, I again am available for a rematch, whenever you want, now or later.  I hope we are reconciled.

  • '20 '16 '15 '14

    Hi Gamer,

    First of all, I want to thank you for playing this game with me, and indeed we are reconciled in my view – you are also a class act, sir, and have done so much for this league and continue to do so.  I’m sorry for voicing my frustration about that sea battle – as you can see, my frustration was more about the “learning experience” aspect of our game, and again certainly not about the end result.  🙂  Looking back through the thread, yes, indeed, I don’t think you really meant anything about the “resign” thing, and in fact, I am probably prejudiced about that from my chess tournament days.  There are master and higher level players who expect their lower rated opponents to resign as soon as they are a pawn down (not all of them of course, just a choice few).  I always took exception to that (and tried to get that across to my students), letting them know that if they resigned in that way they would never learn how to win that same position.  In other words, they would learn more by playing out the loss and taking what they learned from the play of their master opponent and putting it to good use in the future.  I still do that to this day.

    And, from our game, I already have learned a lot with regard to both the G1 declaration and how to deal with it – all by first demonstrating in our game how not to deal with it lol.  I have already put a little of this Axis lesson to use in my game vs Shin Ji (still very early in the game, but a new take on Axis play for me).  So, our game was a great experience for me.

    I dare say my games with wheatbeer are on that level for me as well – all very educational losses (and that one win – Vive La France!!  :lol: ).

    I would rather that you and I be able to play a new game in the future than continue this bloodbath.  My goal this season is to really learn as many of the intricacies of G40 as possible – there was SO MUCH to learn in 2nd edition back in 1986 – so, we can all multiply that by like 100.  😉

    Speaking of which, that is something that I will note about the strategy boards.  Back in the days of the CD club (Spring1942 comes to mind), there were so many great strategy posts to learn from, some written by average players, but many written by the best players in the club.  There were even “GOA Corners” that were written about one aspect of strategy or another.  It would be great to have that here.  I’ve read through almost every strategy post on these boards, but it’s really hard to separate “fact” from “dreamland”, you know?  So, it still comes down to hard lessons one game at a time…

    So again, thank you for the game, and I will look forward to a rematch later in the season if you are still up for it (and if it fits with your master plan for league domination hehehe).  Once I get some more experience, I hope to give you a better run for your money.  Of course I will also be doing many training exercises for spinning better dice as well…  😄

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    You do need to improve your dice rolling technique  😉

    Thanks for the thorough response - I can sleep better tonight knowing we have ironed out a mutual misunderstanding

    Yes be careful reading most of the strategy advice and opinions on these boards - in my opinion most of them are crap unless they’re coming from me or Zhukov or someone like that.  I read them for laughs some times, and try really hard not to post.

    I understand your chess example with resigning, and do think this is very different, because a game of 2nd edition G40 takes countless hours.  I showed you respect by being nearly as careful with these moves as I would be in the playoffs vs Zhukov or Hobo next round.

    Looking forward to your continued contributions to this site, especially the snazzy standings and real ratings (compared to my Mickey Mouse style)

  • 2022 '15 '11 '10 Official Q&A Moderator

    Thanks for a fun game!

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