• Giving me the benefit of the doubt, such a force could number 17 tanks[edit : 16 tanks - no way west russia tank survives], 13 infantry + 10 artillery, 10 fighters and 1 bomber. Most likely it will be less than this, but still larger than the force provided in your example (only 5 fighters?)

    Infantry only builds mean his entire force attacks on a one, and can only defend one area. You can easily take his IPC producing territories since he can’t move out of Russia in any significance.


  • @Robert:

    I like your idea on the germans key to victory.  I have found it very effective to buy a bomber a turn and use all of them to bomb the IPC’s right out of the russians.  I also buy bombers with the japenese and bomb the russians with that.  I really find now need for africa but if possible I could use the IPC’s.  I really need some tips in africa because I find it hard to hold of the russians for the first few turns and I don’t have enough money for Africa.

    I understand the pressure that the Russians can put on you.  More than likely they will go after you with 90% of their forces.  However, to put pressure in africa only really takes 1 inf 1 armor a turn.  With my proposed plane a turn that adds up to 18 IPC which means that 22 IPC can go after Russia.  The Russians will have to do something about the Japs encroaching on their territories, they make 24 IPC and I don’t think it is out of the realm of possibility that they will spend more than 2 IPC (not even an infantry) a turn to fight the japs.  At worst you see a stalemate on the eastern front.  I am basing this on the starting out $ each country recieves because there is no way to know exactly how the game will evolve turns into it (the game is a dice rolling game, and things change).  However, any $ the Russians gain against the Germans, will be lost to $ lost to the japs.  Conversely, any $ lost in Eurupe will be gained in Africa.  So for simplicity sake I am using the starting out IPC.

    As to how to stop the Russians, the game has not changed so much as to not have the same “territory swap” that was in the original game.  The Germans or Russians will only move up when they have an overwhelming force to hold the territory taken.  To go 1/2 a$$ed means that the forces spent there will be destroyed at great cost to the original attacker.

    In most of my games 90% of allied forces go against Germany.  The people I play against do not really spend any IPC in the pacific, or against the Japs in general barring the few Infantry the Russians buy to delay the Japs.  So playing Germany most times I have to be able to fight all 3 allied powers, and hold out for the Japs to gain enough power to make their move.

    That was the way to play in the old game, and the people I play against refuse to adapt to the new game thinking that is the only way to play.  I have played the other countries and showed how diff. strategies can be effective, but they just chalk it up to me being lucky or what not, and never really consider doing these things themselves.

    Suffice to say, I am used to having the whole burden of the allied attack come on me when I play Germany.  I know I can’t win against those odds, but it has taught me to pick and chose my fights (which is why I like a strong German airforce so much - versatility).

    I would love play a game (online, or whatever) with someone who has a different strategy other than kill germany first, and pay little attention to Japan.  That is my biggest shortcoming in the game.

    Any takers?


  • This sounds like a real viable first turn buy, but eventually you really need to replace those fighter losses you suffer from attacking the british navy, or if he builds fighters to at least match him when he makes carriers.


  • I’m not a fan of buying any airforce with Germany. I find I need every single IPC in land troops and some basic navy first turn. Germany has a lot of territories to defend from many angles and seazones. I need 3 infantry rather than 1 fighter to shore up the border territories. If the Allies want control of the sea they will have it. Building some fighters delays this a bit but has the negative effect of having less forces to defend against Russia.


  • Zooey- I agree with your assessment of the value of a strong Luftwaffe- to an extent.

    To me it depends on how you philosophically approach the interplay between Germany and Japan. If the allies are using a KGF strategy, then you find that trading territories, playing defense on your flanks, and harrassing allied shipping are all critical. A fighter a turn, with mostly infantry (sprinkle in an artillery, armor, or both each turn) will provide you with the ability to cash out a little over 40 deep into the game, while simultaneously providing defense for your flanks with fighters that return from the front (landing in France, Italy). If, however, the allies are distracted in any way from KGF, then a heavier purchase of armor is necessary to take and hold land on the Ost Front, to maneuver in such a way as to either knock out Russia or deal them a crippling blow.

    The question is, as Germany, are you the hammer or the anvil? The hammer needs armor, the anvil fighters.Â


  • Men & Tanks win the war!

    Firstly the allies really only have one chance at winning KGF.  The faster they do that, the sooner they can get on with japan! knowing that your gonna be the put into the meat grinder what to buy? first turn 10 men two tanks… attack Russia where you can… don’t make any foolish attacks, destroy as much of the allied navy as possible and for gods sake don’t go getting foolish with the 6 fighters you start with… and close down the Suez canal!!! the very last thing you need is the British AC in the Mediterranean, and that Baltic fleet… well do what you can with it, while you can… usually it becomes a focus of the British by turn two even if you don’t move it… Non combat fortify western Europe so the greedy Brit’s can’t get their hands on it… 4 fighters and  5 men should hold for this round…
    fortify in easter Europe, it’s connected to karelia, belorussia, and Ukraine so you can keep in close contact for a counter strike…

    Second turn 10 men two tanks maybe 3 if you have the money… just depends on how lucky you got… keep sparing / bleeding the Russians, keep your ipcs above 40 and keep running wild in Africa while you can even if the Americans have already landed there you should still be able to take some of it this turn… karilea is a strong point. i like to go over the top so i can keep norway in the long run… secondly it off balances the Russian player … making that IC in the Caucasus kinda useless … your just gonna ignore it… for the first few rounds… Cause i am not saying you don’t want it… i am just saying you don’t wanna have to fight their battle for it…

    third turn and every turn after fifty fifty split men and tanks… you should be well fortified along the Atlantic at this point … you should consider maybe even all tanks if the Russian player is making dumb attacks or all men once in awhile if the dice aren’t going your way or the allies hit you hard on a front… anyway at this point you should focus entirely on Russia… keep sparing in the Ukraine belorussia but fortify hard in karelia and push on archangel… next turn fortify hard there… usually that starts the stagnation of Russia… which leads to the Russian player abandoning/sparsely defending that IC in the Caucasus at which point you take it… hopefully the japan player gets to the back side of Russia… in which case you have won…

    men and tanks win the war… let the allies have naval superiority not much you can do about it… you can pop transports with your planes given the chance… i love to eat unguarded transports for breakfast, they taste good…

    lastly I would highly suggest against ever buying planes with germany for the basic fact that 2 tanks equals a hit on offense and defense, cost 10 ipc… sadly one plane equals 50% chance of a hit on offense and a 66% chance of a hit on defence, cost 10 ipc
    so regardless of how you use them offense or defence they just aren’t as good… because your fighting a land war… and inviting them all to come and fight it your way…


  • I fully disagree with geramany not buying planes. Yes men and tanks win the war. I know that. But one fighter a turn can save from many naval threats. If you don’t buy one a turn, at least replace them so you always have six. That works well also.


  • 6 is a great number to have… but five is min… ahh just don’t squander what you start with and you shouldn’t have to replace them… I just feel your very limited when you are under the allied gun… and fighters are generally a luxury you don’t have


  • If Germany makes no aeronaval purchases, the axis will almost always lose the game. If you agree to let the allies have naval superiority and refuse to purchase fighters, how will you stay above 40? You mention running wild in Africa… R2 the allies will have alot coming at Algeria. Say first round purchases, America uses it all for the Pacific, 2 CV + 1 ftr, and UK makes 1 CV 1 TP 2 inf. R2 that is 4-6 ( depending on if you used the atlantic sub to sink the TP, or if you used it to help sink BB or something else ) inf, 1 armor, 1 artillery, + 2 fighters ( from UK CV.) Then the Americans come with 2 inf, 1 artillery, 1 armor. Their fleet strength off Algeria will be 1 BB 1 CV (2 ftr) 1-2 DD 3-4 TP. If you didn’t take Anglo-Egypt you could counter-attack with 1 BB 1 TP 6 ftr 1 bmb.

    Axis
    4+12+4
    20/6 3.33 3
    Allies
    4+3+8+3+3 (using lower fleet estimates.)
    21/6 3.5 4

    Axis BB is damaged, 1 TP (empty) destroyed, 2 ftr. destroyed.
    4+6+4
    14/6 2.33 2
    Allies’ BB is damaged, 3 TP (empty) destroyed.
    4+3+8+3
    18/6 3

    Axis bomber and 2 ftr. destroyed.
    4
    4/6 .67 1
    Allies’ DD and 1 ftr destroyed.
    4+3+4
    11/6 1.833 2

    Axis BB destroyed.
    Allies’ 1 ftr. destroyed.

    This leaves 1 BB 1 CV (using lower fleet estimates) in the Allied Atlantic fleet to be moved back to the transport and 2 fighters on the following turn.
    This leaves Germany with no airforce and its baltic fleet ( if it has not been reduced by air attack )

    edit: Although T2 you may collect 44-46, I don’t see how you can have 45 at the begining of the second turn, for 10 inf 3 armor. I also realize you only meant staying above 40 for second turn, but the fact remains that while you might be ok on T2, you won’t be able to reinforce Africa without any TP. Then the UK will probably spend a couple turns ferrying men while the US 'shuck shuck’s troops over to England. Also, you dont even need that many ground units at first… you can leave more in England to defend it if you’re worried about an invasion.


  • firstly you don’t have to agree to let the allies have naval superiority… THEY HAVE IT… you can delude yourself but they are making 72 (england and us) the first turn more than your income of that was probably devoted to the navy and next turn probably more will be spent that way, next turn as well… they can build navy till the cows come home and they probably will

    secondly its easy to stay above 40… you start at forty Africa is only worth 2 in a loss 38 and well with the tactic that i am playing your going after Russia which is worth 18… anyway, your only chance when the allies are playing KGF is men and tanks mostly, men… you can’t take all three allies on all fronts… you can’t wager a decent land war while trying to wager a naval battle the units just cost too much… you can however be a juggernaut and have 15 men and 5 tanks on all coastal territory and make the cost of landing sooo high that the allies will have to play your war and will never catch you, cause the longer the game goes the larger your standing defence gets and you have been building since the beginning. the allies have been loosing money steadily due to a Japanese player left alone the entire game so with or with out planes you win…

    personally i will hardly ever buy a plane… unless i have Russia pinned / captured… and i have the main land well fortified, then i may turn around buy all fighters one turn and perhaps some subs the very next turn… cause i sure as hell don’t have to worry about buying men late in the game… cause i took care of that earlier

    PS- i have won many games without any fighters left… and with Bobo the retarded Japanese player…(shrugs and cringes) gawd i hate playing with Bobo he sucks… and lastly i hate this style of play… all men and a few tanks is hard and boring work… but it does work… it also drags the hell outta the game and is not for some. last time we played it took 10 hours to crack russia in half because of this but it did keep the allies from one successfull landing on western europe, germany, and southern europe (also 10 hours in germany still had 6 fighters and had eaten a few transports, no bomber though)… they did take norway a few times though… but germany always took it back with high casualties from them

    other things i don’t do, research… waste of money… your odds of getting it are 1 in 6 the same cost as a 10 stack of men… and well ain’t no ability worth that in my humble opinion


  • Most likely, not all 72 is going to be devoted to fighting Germany. 2CV + 1 ftr. in the Pacific is a great T1 buy for US, and its not too unlikely that UK sends a few infantry to India.

    Just because you ignore the Western Allies and Africa doesn’t mean you are going to capture Russia’s 18 IC. Secondly, you can’t stop an Allied landing by only buying infantry and armor, and also capture Russia. How much IC will be spent on units to guard coastal territories (Norway, Western Europe, Germany, Italy, Balkans, Ukraine, Eastern Europe) and how much IC will be left over to fight Russia?

    As far as your KGF strategy… How long would it take you to get 15 infantry and 5 armor in every coastal province?

    edit- By buying ~1 ftr. each turn, you can help your ground force at the same time you create a real threat to the Allied Navy in your theater.


  • muhahahaha

    this tactic works well against the group i play with… they go after germany with a vengance… they retreat everything from all the corners of world for the most part and pull to the atlantic just to put a wrench in the works for germany… they buy nothing without germany in mind… its 100 % devotion… it took 5 turns last game before i felt i could even make a real run at russia because i had to hold strong while japan got going…

    Edit: holding strong meant staying at 40 or above… i fell to 37 one turn but rebounded back after a little regrouping…

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