@toblerone77:

With all the new and old sculpts for marines available, the topic of marines came to mind yet again. The debate is old and many find the idea of marines unattractive.

One problem has been figuring out how marines should be represented in the game’s stats and mechanics. I think a good idea comes from the historical examples of the USMC during WWII. They frequently were undersupplied and had to make due with less than the army. Logistically they were a much leaner force so… **Why not make marines more logistically elite rather than upping A/D stats?** In other words let marines be transported as such:

Transports when **carrying marines may carry any one marine land unit + any two marine infantry units.**

**Transports may also carry one additional marine infantry unit in addition to it’s regular transport capacity.**

Interesting idea to solve the Marines cunundrum.

Marines Inf at 3 IPCs, why buying reg Inf?

Marines Inf at 4 IPCs, why bother to buy Marines since Art A2D2 is better?

As you said elsewhere:

@toblerone77:

Basically Baron the marines in the A&A series IMO have been crap and nonsensical. **A cost of four is too high in the mechanics of the game when it essentially has worse stats than artillery.** So you **have to give it an advantage that artillery does not have.** Its fire power, mobility or special ability. It HAS to be worth buying and apply to it’s historical role. The marines were powerful because they could respond rapidly via the USN. **Making a marine that can do the same thing for more money or less for more money just doesn’t work for me.** So I don’t know **they have to have an advantage that makes sense.** I can add marines for flavor from HBG which is fine. The OT was to design a marine unit which was cost effective and worth while. I personally don’t get overly hung up on absolute balance with this game. I try to go big picture.

Maybe Marines could worth 3.5 IPCs.

You must always buy them in pairs for 7 IPCs.

So, for 21 IPCs you will load up 2 transports with 6 units, working as a regular infantry.

But it is probably too low.

Maybe you have in mind a Marines **Inf unit at 4 IPCs ?**

Is it too much unbalancing?

If the case, then price must be adjusted accordingly.

For an amphibious assault, to be a 50% challenge against 2 Infs Def @2 at 6 IPCs, it requires

1 transport 7 IPCs

1 Inf @2 � 3 IPCs

1 Art @2 � 4 IPCs

14 IPCs/2 = 7 IPCs/ unit

It means on average that you can double the price of a unit to know how it worth giving it sea-faring capacity.

To be accurate, **2 Infs, (13 IPCs/2 = 6.5 IPCs/ unit)** / 1 Inf + 1 Tnk (9+7= 16 IPCs/2 = 8 IPCs / unit or 6 IPCs for Inf and 10 IPCs for Tnk)

Adding 1 Marines Inf at 4 IPCs (to 1 INf+ 1 Art+ 1 transp), make the whole at 18 IPCs, divided by 3 units, **gives a very low 6 IPCs/unit. And even lower 5.66/unit for 2 Inf + 1 Marines Inf.**

And, bringing 3 Marines Inf at 4 IPCs (or 2 Marines Inf+Art), cost 12 + 7 = 19 / 3 = **6.33 IPCs.** or 2 Marines Inf 8+Tnk 6 =21/3= **7 IPCs/unit**

So, inside the limit prescribe by your rules, I think that at 4 IPCs it is just a bit unbalancing.

Maybe you must **absolutly required that Marines Inf go along with Marines unit only** (to stay around 6.33, 7 IPCs / unit not lower).

However, for a more balance game, I would say that Marines transport (able to load 3 units) should cost 1 IPC (min: 6.66/unit) or 2 IPCs (min: 7 IPC/unit) higher.

For the first travel, it will be even (vs 2 units transports) and any additionnal transportation with the same marines boat will be really an advantage.

EDIT:

**The 4 IPCs and 7 IPCs Marines unit cost is relatively balance on the long run, when a player can used a second time some transports. After the first travel, where it is better for Marines unit, the transportation ratio is reversing toward regular units.**

**FIRST TRAVEL** / **SECOND TRAVEL, same transport**

**Cost ratio for Regular unit transportation:**

3 (transport + Inf + Inf) 3 (Inf + Inf)

3 *(7+3+3) = 39 IPCs /6 grounds = 6.5 IPCs/unit / 3*(3+3)= 18 IPCs +39 = 57 IPCs/12= 4.75 IPCs/unit

2 (transport + Inf + Tnk) + 1 (transport + Inf + Inf) (4 Inf + 2 Tnk)

2*(7+3+6) + 1*(7+3+3)= 45 /6 units = 7.5 IPCs/unit / 12 + 12 = 24 IPCs + 45 = 69 IPCs /12 = 5.75 IPCs/unit

**Cost ratio for Marines unit transportation:**

2 (transport + Inf + Inf + Inf) 2 (Inf + Inf + Inf)

2*(7+4+4+4)= 38 /6 units = 6.33 IPCs/unit / 2*(4+4+4)= 24 IPCs + 38 = 62 IPCs /12 = 5.167 IPCs/unit

2 (transport + Inf + Inf+ Tnk) 2 (Inf + Inf + Tnk)

2*(7+4+4+7)= 44 / 6 units = 7.33 IPcs/unit / 2*(4+4+7)= 30 IPCs + 44 = 74 IPCs /12 = 6.167 IPCs/unit

So, after a second travel, with the **same 12 units** the transportation ratio is improving for regular units compared to Marines ones:

for 12 Infs vs 12 Marines Infs = **4.75 vs 5.167 IPCs/unit.**

for 8 Infs+ 4 Tnks vs 8 Marines Infs + 4 Marines Tnks = **5.75 vs 6.167 IPCs/unit**.