Japan Tactic to help hold off america


  • That is all true.  Once again it is not the fight to get it back.  Its the diversion.  If US only sends transports they are gone by a Japanese sub.  Japan loses a transport  2 guys and a sub…19 ipc.  US loses 2 transports, effectively loses 2 inf and 2 art since they won’t be back for another 2 turns and has to repurchase the transports if they want to threaten anything again…42 ipcs.  Plus if they sent a destroyer or a sub to get the Japan sub then they lose that unit for 2 additional turns


  • gotta go for an hour or so.  Love the conversation, hopefully you will still be here when I get back:)

  • '12

    Japan probably doesn’t even need to cover SZ6 in this situation.  With the Hainan Naval base, you have your fleet down there to cover the DEI and threaten India.  If the US moves on SZ6 then you send up just what is needed to wipe them out.


  • @Eggman:

    Japan probably doesn’t even need to cover SZ6 in this situation.  With the Hainan Naval base, you have your fleet down there to cover the DEI and threaten India.  If the US moves on SZ6 then you send up just what is needed to wipe them out.

    Unless ANZAC or the US can block, but all true.

    If the Japanese took the Aleutians I would not bother fighting for it, but I would move a couple mechs/Inf to Alaska or Canada.  If Japan has its fleet in the south, than the US could go take the Aleutians if they wanted without fear of losing their fleet.  I see this as a mostly lose-lose for Japan.  In a face to face game this could be a psychological issue, especially if Japan talks some crap.


  • All the US needs is a strat bomber a a transport or 2, since aleutians are close to WUS, it really does not hurt him to send units to go after them.  Economically, US can afford a trade war in aluetian a lot better than japan can.


  • @ghr2:

    All the US needs is a strat bomber a a transport or 2, since aleutians are close to WUS, it really does not hurt him to send units to go after them.  Economically, US can afford a trade war in aluetian a lot better than japan can.

    True, but if Japan is large enough that they make 70 IPC’s/turn then the US is fighting over small potatoes when they need to be getting DEI/Phil/anything else back.


  • By the time japan is 70 ipc plus, the US already has a giant armada in queens or Caroline contesting the islands already.  And has the economy to keep sending units down there while simultaneously reclaiming aleutian.


  • @ghr2:

    By the time japan is 70 ipc plus, the US already has a giant armada in queens or Caroline contesting the islands already.  And has the economy to keep sending units down there while simultaneously reclaiming aleutian.

    Could be but it depends on where Japan’s fleet and airforce is.  It is very ‘cat and mouse’ if both fleets can annihilate the other if they get in range/are not blocked.


  • All the US needs is a strat bomber a a transport or 2, since aleutians are close to WUS, it really does not hurt him to send units to go after them.  Economically, US can afford a trade war in aluetian a lot better than japan can.

    A strat bomber in Western US.  Thats 24 ipcs just sitting there doing nothing other than covering the islands.  Is that really where america want to spend their money?

    It doesn’t necesssarily have to be a trade war.  even if it only happens once, Japan wins by a lot if US only sends transports.  If the us sends navy to protect the transports they lose 3 turns essentially which is huge for Japan.

    By the time japan is 70 ipc plus, the US already has a giant armada in queens or Caroline contesting the islands already.  And has the economy to keep sending units down there while simultaneously reclaiming aleutian.

    Japan can be at just under 70 ipcs on turn 4.  US can only place 3 units a turn in Western US for the first 3 turns.  Hardly enough to have a giant armada and definately not enough to have them in Carolines unless they bring the Europe navy over in which case Germany takes over the world.

    True, but if Japan is large enough that they make 70 IPC’s/turn then the US is fighting over small potatoes when they need to be getting DEI/Phil/anything else back.

    So you would accept only making 67 a turn, assuming that US took Brazil, to try to combat a 70 ipc Japan?

    Once again you can’t accept this as a strategy but I guarantee if you play against the allies and they don’t prepare for this (and who does?) it will be a huge thorn in the side of america and causes huge problems.

    Lets say on turn 4 america moves to the Carolines and takes it with 2 or 3 transports.  No transports available in hawaii or the Western US.  You sneak a guy to the islands.  That is very frustrating!!!

    The resources required to protect that start to add up.  Who wants to buy a loaded transport every turn with US and keep two strat bombers in the Western US just to stop a 13 ipc move by Japan.


  • If the Japanese took the Aleutians I would not bother fighting for it, but I would move a couple mechs/Inf to Alaska or Canada.  If Japan has its fleet in the south, than the US could go take the Aleutians if they wanted without fear of losing their fleet.

    That would be perfect for Japan. You only make 67 ipcs.  The mech and inf in alaska do nothing since you have to have transports to get to the islands and thats 6 to 8 ipcs doing nothing.

    They take their fleet to the islands, thats fine as well since they are 2 moves away from getting back to Hawaii to pose a threat.  Japan just blocks sz 7 so they can’t get to the capital.


  • @elevenjerk:

    If the Japanese took the Aleutians I would not bother fighting for it, but I would move a couple mechs/Inf to Alaska or Canada.  If Japan has its fleet in the south, than the US could go take the Aleutians if they wanted without fear of losing their fleet.

    That would be perfect for Japan. You only make 67 ipcs.  The mech and inf in alaska do nothing since you have to have transports to get to the islands and thats 6 to 8 ipcs doing nothing.

    They take their fleet to the islands, thats fine as well since they are 2 moves away from getting back to Hawaii to pose a threat.  Japan just blocks sz 7 so they can’t get to the capital.

    Well, with Japan putting troops in the Aleutians, they aren’t putting them in Asia, making things easier on India/China/ANZAC and the US.

    How do the US lose 3 turns if they send their whole fleet to the Aleutians?  They can hit Japan from there, Hawaii, and/or Carolines depending where they are.  You say you can block them, but you only block combat movement, they can send planes/bombers to his the Japan SZ and then Noncombat their fleet there (again, depending on what Japan has to counter with).

    I don’t think it is a terrible move, but typically I never have enough Japanese land units in Asia to beat both China and India (and Russia if they attack me turn 2 or later).


  • Well, with Japan putting troops in the Aleutians, they aren’t putting them in Asia, making things easier on India/China/ANZAC and the US

    We are talking about 2 inf.  Well worth the headache for US

    How do the US lose 3 turns if they send their whole fleet to the Aleutians?  They can hit Japan from there, Hawaii, and/or Carolines depending where they are

    1 turn to take the islands back, 2 turns to get back to Hawaii because it is 3 spots away.

    You say you can block them, but you only block combat movement, they can send planes/bombers to his the Japan SZ and then Noncombat their fleet there (again, depending on what Japan has to counter with).

    The block allows you to not have your capital threatened.  If us wants to move the navy into sz 6 thats fine since most of my japan navy will be placed in the Phillipines if US decides to move the whole navy over there.  China is mostly gone by turn 4 and with 8 or so transports in the south the UK will be mostly in turtle mode with very little offensive available to them.  If they have spent their money on offensive units than it makes it even easier to take calcutta and US can hang out in sz 6 all they want.  I just place guys in the capital to counter anything us can bring with the limited transports available.  If they have lots of transports they don’t have lots of navy.  Also by turn 5 the US can’t possible have that much stuff to threaten unless they bring Europe resources over.

    typically I never have enough Japanese land units in Asia to beat both China and India (and Russia if they attack me turn 2 or later).

    If russia attacks turn 2 then you could easily wipe them out.  I would actually want them to do that.


  • @elevenjerk:

    Well, with Japan putting troops in the Aleutians, they aren’t putting them in Asia, making things easier on India/China/ANZAC and the US

    We are talking about 2 inf.  Well worth the headache for US

    How do the US lose 3 turns if they send their whole fleet to the Aleutians?  They can hit Japan from there, Hawaii, and/or Carolines depending where they are

    1 turn to take the islands back, 2 turns to get back to Hawaii because it is 3 spots away.

    You say you can block them, but you only block combat movement, they can send planes/bombers to his the Japan SZ and then Noncombat their fleet there (again, depending on what Japan has to counter with).

    The block allows you to not have your capital threatened.  If us wants to move the navy into sz 6 thats fine since most of my japan navy will be placed in the Phillipines if US decides to move the whole navy over there.  China is mostly gone by turn 4 and with 8 or so transports in the south the UK will be mostly in turtle mode with very little offensive available to them.  If they have spent their money on offensive units than it makes it even easier to take calcutta and US can hang out in sz 6 all they want.  I just place guys in the capital to counter anything us can bring with the limited transports available.  If they have lots of transports they don’t have lots of navy.  Also by turn 5 the US can’t possible have that much stuff to threaten unless they bring Europe resources over.

    typically I never have enough Japanese land units in Asia to beat both China and India (and Russia if they attack me turn 2 or later).

    If russia attacks turn 2 then you could easily wipe them out.  I would actually want them to do that.

    You cannot attack everywhere-  China can be tough to take if you don’t commit serious troops to Asia;  8 transports?  How are they still alive?  Isn’t ANZAC/India/US hitting any undefended ones?  I’ve won and lost as both sides and never seen more than about 5-6 transports.  You have to be aggressive as the Allies against Japan.  If you left significant troops in Manchuria to guard against Japan then you aren’t taking China out in 4 turns.

    The US doesn’t have to take Japan, just convoy them, and/or take Korea/Manchuria, perhaps with russian help.


  • This is all based off a J4 attack.

    J1  3 tt 1 art.  Collect 42 in most cases taking Siberia, Far East, and the standard China territories.

    J2  2 tt 2 Inf (you have 2 left over from taking the rest out to Carolines with your initial 3 tt purchase)  4 art.  6 left to spend.

    that alone is 8 transports after turn 2.

    China can be tough to take if you don’t commit serious troops to Asia

    I didn’t say you take china out but you can close the road down and keep them at bay for a few turns pretty easy with what you have.

    If you left significant troops in Manchuria to guard against Japan then you aren’t taking China out in 4 turns

    Im not leaving troops in Manchuria.  If Russia wants to break the pact early, great, I take them out.  I keep guys in korea for the counter if they choose to do so.  If russia wants to put more than 6 inf in Amur, I break the pact and wipe them out and things may change a bit after that.  It is very easy to keep planes in range for that while just focusing on china.

    You have to be aggressive as the Allies against Japan

    US 4 is the first time they can do anything so its not really a consideration.

    Isn’t ANZAC/India/US hitting any undefended ones?

    US can’t do anything. If the UK/Anzac are able to take out maybe 1 unprotected transort to start the war and keep US out of the war till turn 4 no matter what, great.  Japan can take the islands even earlier along with kwantung and still collect the 10 ipc FIC bonus until the end of J3.


  • How does japan make 70 by turn 4 with out going to war by turn 2 or 3?  If the US is only making 3 out of western for 3 turns, japan would have to of waited untill j4 to attack.  Which means india/anzac are huge and dont require that much American aid right away.


  • US can also build planes out of central/eastern and land on carrier that came out of western after they move to hawaii.

    Bombers sitting in West US is a perfect place, they can go to queens, threaten sz 6, help reclaim aleutian, or move all the way to london/gib all in 1 turn.


  • How does japan make 70 by turn 4 with out going to war by turn 2 or 3

    To add to my last post.  You have 8 tt after turn 2 with 3 loaded transports and most all your navy at carolines.  This makes the US have to stay in sz 10 unless they want to get destroyed.  It also makes Anzac have to think about losing their capital.  It would be crazy to try and build transports at that point.  You have the one that probably went to Java to get the 4 ipcs on turn one but to buy more with Japan right there seems not smart to me.

    J3  Should have around 45 ipcs to spend.  Buy 2 more loaded transports for 28 ipcs and spend the rest on whatever you want.  I tend to buy another AC.

    Move half the caroline island navy down to phillipines and the other half (usually trying to include a couple of the AC’s in order to use planes on any islands that may have been stacked with more than 1 or 2 inf) down to Java with the 3 loaded transports.  You have to take into consideration where Anzac subs and navy may be, if any, and place navy accordingly.  You also have to account for the Combination of Anzac and India.  What can India send there?  BB, Cruiser, destroyer and some planes?  All of it can be accounted for.  Take the 5 loaded transports in sz 6 and send them to sz35 with half your navy.

    At this point america will probably move into hawaii because why wouldn’t they.

    Now your set up for a J4 attack.

    3 loaded transports in sz 42 (Java) with at least 2 AC loaded. 
    5 loaded transports in sz 35 (Phillipines).  Planes can come from Kwiangsi to fight the phillipines battle if necessary.  In our games its not usually necessary cause we fly the us fighter to Guam on turn one to get any stray transports.
    2 loaded transports in sz 6.

    2 in sz 6 can take out the Phillipines.  The 5 in sz 35 can go anywhere except sumatra (since you don’t own phillipines naval base yet).  The 3 in sz 42 can take Sumatra pretty easy unless Anzac/India put all available resources into it.  That would be pretty dumb since it would only stop japan 1 turn maybe from collecting the full DEI bonus.

    With the freedom you have at that point I am sure most people on this forum could figure out a way to get……

    Kwantung  3
    Malaya      3
    Sumatra    4
    Java        4
    Beorno    4
    Celebs      3
    Phillipines  2
    FIC          2

    25 ipc
    5 ipc  NO bonus
    26 ipc regular income
    2 ipc from russia
    8 if not more from china

    Japan can be at just under 70 ipcs on turn 4

    66 ipcs.  I didn’t say they would make 70.

    Just realized after typing this novel we kind of got off topic:)  Oh well, its been fun.


  • eleven I would really like to to see how this would turn out.  You should get on Triple A.


  • Turn 2, the US fleet can easily sit in hawaii without worry.


  • @ghr2:

    Turn 2, the US fleet can easily sit in hawaii without worry.

    Could also pull a block on the Japanese fleet at Carolines.

Suggested Topics

  • 26
  • 11
  • 9
  • 10
  • 5
  • 3
  • 7
  • 12
Axis & Allies Boardgaming Custom Painted Miniatures

25

Online

17.0k

Users

39.3k

Topics

1.7m

Posts