RIP Amanda Todd

Yeah… man, how awful. I don’t even know how some people can be such scum.

Here’s an article on it:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/i-have-nobody-teen-who-posted-haunting-youtube-video-on-bullying-anguish-found-dead-in-her-home/

uhh wow…

FYI This is Extremly close to home.

Both of my roomates who work for me went to school with her, and my boss’s kids went to day care with this chick - as this was their nieghbour.  I was out to dinner with my boss when his wife phoned him to tell him that this girl had killed herself (Firetrucks were in his cul-de-sac).

That said, I have opinions on suicide, and as far as most people are concerned have nothing nice to say about it.

I know for a fact this girl had other options, and if anything is clear, her choice to commit suicide is -exactly- what she wanted to do.  It was her choice everyone gets stuck with.

Obviously it would be better if things were different. But they aren’t, and now everybody suffers.

This action is dissappointing and disgusting, as is the parenting involved, and the actions of those who bullied and contributed to this tragedy.

But three wrongs and more don’t make a right.  They just make a stupid.  And calling your mom to confirm she’s not going to be home until 8, so you can hang yourself in her closet is a cowards move I refuse to feel sympathetic for.

@robbie358:

Wow.  Blame the victim, doesn’t get more classy than that.  “Coward”, eh?  I’m tempted to tell you to sit 'n spin, but I’ll take the high ground here.  Noone deserves what she went through.  Have you even seen the garbage they put on facebook about her?  Signs saying “Drink Clorox, Amanda Todd does”.  That jerk that slept with her derserves a fist in his face, not to mention the guy that flashed her tits all over the net.  If you were half a man you’ld hold him for me.

Sorry for your loss, a death like this is tragic, especially when someone so young dose it. That said, I do have to agree with Gar, suicide is the cowards way out. I’m not saying that what happened to this girl was right and that other peoples actions played a big part in this, but i’m sorry, we all have our crosses to bare in life, we all have our sob stories, but suicide is never the answer.

What I will grant you is this, perhaps now is not the best time to ask the difficult questions that will inevitably rise from this, like what warning signs were there that she was going to do this, why were they ignored, where were her parents and other adults in her life in all this, and what could have been done to prevent this.

@robbie358:

I’ll be praying for her and her family while you shrug it all off.

Not everyone handles grief in the same way

Gargantua,

I have always respected the opinions of others, and totally support the canvas in which all may speak freely on their views (and trust me when I say that I have been ridiculed for my own beliefs many times). However, that doesn’t mean that I can’t disagree with someone, and in this case I strongly disagree with you. Suicide leaves a lot of pain behind, I know… my father committed suicide, and I once had your perception that those that throw away life, are not worth the life that they were given in the first place. However, I no longer feel that way, and for my own reasons… I now believe something different about suicide. I’m not declaring one opinion right or wrong, because our different opinions are right for each of us at this point in our lives. The fact is, you just called a young tormented girl a coward. It’s OK if you don’t have sympathy, but what about empathy for those that do? I love your edge, and controversial philosophies, but a loss is a loss… and everyone in this forum has been effected by suicide. Would you wave a Muslim flag at ground zero the day after 9/11?

Think about the act.

The people who suffered from the suicide are the people who cared about her. Her parents, her friends (some of which are also my friends).

Like I said - I’m privy to more information that the media is releasing.  The warning signs were there for a long time, and many people tried to make things right for this individual.  Obviously it didn’t happen fast enough.  But the people who tried to help are the ones left with the tragedy now. I take issue with that and that is the way I see it.

For the records

1. I acknowledge this is a tragedy

2. I acknowlege that amanda was tormented by people who make me sick.

3. I don’t see how striking out at the people who love you, by hanging yourself in their closet so they can find you helps.

4. I conclude that my sympathies and prayers are with her family and friends - people who didn’t deserve this.

Robbie358,

Like YG (though not to the same extent) I’ve been here before with a friend who I knew was on the ledge of killing themselves.  I did absolutely everything I could possibly do to avert this disaster - and so did other people.  Hell I slept in their bedroom on suicide watch on several occassions.  But it happend anyways. Leaving all the innocent people along the way hurt.  Hence my bitterment with this process.  Atleast I wasn’t the one that discovered them in the basement.

At the end of the day the right response to -suffering- isn’t to lash out at the people trying to help you? Is it? That is a despicable and cowardly act IMO.

My sympathies and prayers are with Amanda’s family and friends - IMO those are victims.  Amanda’s choice has put some of them (Her mother in particular) at risk of suicide as well. The suicide is quite literally an act of bullying in and of itself - and targets the wrong people.

Thus I vomit at the thought of anyone who defends this act which has led to the misery of the innocent.

How can I have sympathy or respect for that?  Other options were available for Amanda. Lots of them.  She didn’t conciously didn’t choose them. :S  and now we all suffer the tragedy.

To make matters worse the next criminal act is the promotion of the event by the premier, who’s using this as a political token to attempt to get re-elected.  Disgusting.

Each and every person on this site probably knows that if anything happend to them -regardless- of whatever it was that I would support them 100% and do whatever I personally could for them. Help them get a job, or give them advice, or fly out and see them if that is what it took.  That’s just a fact. And that is how I choose to treat people everyday.

Right now in a small way I have to clean up my part of the mess that Amanda has left emotionally on my roomates who are taking this toll pretty hard.  Her problem is now my problem - and my friends are hurting for it.  Am I supposed to feel sorry for that?

Am I still going to have to feel sorry for Amanda, if this leads to her mother killing herself? Because it might?  And then how are we all supposed to feel for Amanda’s brother. Do we let him kill himself too and say it was ok by giving our sympathy?  Answer me that question Robbie? Personally I think the answer is NO.

@Young:

Gargantua,

I have always respected the opinions of others, and totally support the canvas in which all may speak freely on their views (and trust me when I say that I have been ridiculed for my own beliefs many times). However, that doesn’t mean that I can’t disagree with someone, and in this case I strongly disagree with you. Suicide leaves a lot of pain behind, I know… my father committed suicide, and I once had your perception that those that throw away life, are not worth the life that they were given in the first place. However, I no longer feel that way, and for my own reasons… I now believe something different about suicide. I’m not declaring one opinion right or wrong, because our different opinions are right for each of us at this point in our lives. The fact is, you just called a young tormented girl a coward. It’s OK if you don’t have sympathy, but what about empathy for those that do? I love your edge, and controversial philosophies, but a loss is a loss… and everyone in this forum has been effected by suicide. Would you wave a Muslim flag at ground zero the day after 9/11?

YG thank you for your comments and support of open expression, I feel for your loss :S  you’ve dealt with this issue on a level I cannot begin to imagine, so I’m going to put -alot- of thought into everything you have said.  To begin though, I will say I also felt no sympathy for 9/11 suicide bombers.  People who’s suicide also led to the suffering of the innocent (though in a much different and almost uncomparable way)

Clyde I also appreciate where you are coming from, you’re also probably 100% right.  I shouldn’t be so directly honest with people for their own emotional protection. Especially so close to such a tragic event.  But as the person probably closest to it on this site, it’s important to acknowledge which lessons we should choose to learn here.

This event started as despicable and disgusting bullying/torment.  It was wrong, and it was being combatted (though not enough).  But this event was not a tragedy -until- Amanda killed herself.  On tuesday night, another beautiful life in this world was still ahead of us - with so much potential.  Amanda chose to take that life from everyone. :S I will not sympathize with this kind of self-murder.

I believe Robbie may have misunderstood my first post.

And as this is an incredibly serious conversation, I’ve PM’d robbie with my personal information so that if it’s needed, we can process this event as effectively as possible.

I’d rather deal with this discussion head on.  And if someone wants to take me to task on my stance for whatever reasons - they deserve every oppurtunity to do it, and be treated with respect.

Thanks for expressing yourself honestly, although I am disappointed that you choose to call Amanda cowardly for the second time. Reguardless, if I were you, I might argue that she was selfish instead, because you can’t begin to presume the horrible degree of the life circumstances amoung all suicide victims, giving you the insight to call even 1 of them a coward. I understand your stance to side with the loved ones left behind, hell…. my brother has never been the same since my father’s death 27 years ago. However, some suicides take tremendous courage, not saying that’s the case with Amanda or my father, but isn’t it a little early to be pissing the word coward on her grave? Thats exactly what your doing, cause the thread is called RIP Amanda, and you have written coward here twice. Perhaps a new thread discussing opinions on suicide and the effects of those left behind would be more respectful. I’ve met you face to face Gargantua,  you may be opinionated, but you’re not disrespectful. I know what it’s like to stand alone and be surrounded by conformists that call you sick and demented because of your beliefs, and you are as brave as you are unapologetic, but I think your pinky toe is over the faded line. I do however, welcome you to be as different as I am in all our beliefs and opinions, it’s the only way to truly except people for what they are, especially if we can’t agree.

@Gargantua:

I believe Robbie may have misunderstood my first post.

And as this is an incredibly serious conversation, I’ve PM’d robbie with my personal information so that if it’s needed, we can process this event as effectively as possible.

I’d rather deal with this discussion head on.  And if someone wants to take me to task on my stance for whatever reasons - they deserve every oppurtunity to do it, and be treated with respect.

Good on you, when ever someone has passed, respect is the foundation all conversation must be balanced on.

Ok I’m going to chime in here.  I’ve run into a few suicides in my day and seen it from a few angles.  What I think we should remember is to look at the situation from the point of view of this little girl.  To us as grown men, if we were to be ostracized we would probably just tell the people picking on us to piss off and move on.  But to a teenager who hasn’t formed a solid sense of her own identity yet, being the outsider can seem inescapable and unbearable.  The cutting behavior and any drug or alcohol abuse would be typical escapes.  We are left to wonder how much of her decision to do it was a) well thought out or impulsive, b) motivated by her need to escape her situation, c) meant to inflict pain or vengeance on her tormentors, and/or d) meant to inflict pain on her family and those who cared for her.  One more thing: the behavior of the young man who took advantage of her is really bad and his father should take him out to the woodshed for that.  Its a very very sad outcome all around.

I recommend watching “Once Were Warriors”. The young girl in that film had very few options.

YG,

I take your comments to heart. Coward probably is the wrong word. I apologize for using it.

I don’t know that selfish is the right word either though…?  I’m going to need to think on it.

That jerk that slept with her derserves a fist in his face, not to mention the guy that flashed her tits all over the net.  If you were half a man you’ld hold him for me.

Robbie, from a few things I heard last night I believe this just came true…

You’re a big man G.

@Gargantua:

YG,

I take your comments to heart. Coward probably is the wrong word. I apologize for using it.

I don’t know that selfish is the right word either though…?  I’m going to need to think on it.

Maybe desperate is the word?

I would submit, misguided. She was too young to understand the broad sweeping ramification of her actions, and based on what she had perceived from culture, she felt that suicide was the only option. It was hardly right, but she didn’t know of any other option, so she was misguided in her solution.

GG

I hear now that the bullies continue to torment her even in death, by posting rude comments on her memorial face book page, comments like “I’m glad she’s dead”. Seems like Amanda wasn’t the only one misguided.

Glad to see you’re coming around a bit G. I hope you continue to.

@Gargantua:

Am I still going to have to feel sorry for Amanda, if this leads to her mother killing herself? Because it might?  And then how are we all supposed to feel for Amanda’s brother. Do we let him kill himself too and say it was ok by giving our sympathy?  Answer me that question Robbie? Personally I think the answer is NO.

This quote made me pretty sick though. Because my answer is absolutely yes. If this tragedy lead to her mother or her brother killing themselves, I would feel a lot more fucking sorry, for everyone involved. It would never make me turn on her because she has no control of what they do with their lives. Would those be cowardly and reprehensible acts as well? Or would they be the fault of Amanda? If in the turmoil of this her mother commits suicide will you call her mother a coward too? Think about what you’re saying.

I get your point about suicide negatively affecting others but COME ON! Let’s try not to loose sight of the fact that a little girl DIED. Some people will deal with grief in their own ways but it is insane to think that anyone else suffered as much as she did. Someone lost a daughter, someone lost a sister, SHE LOST HER LIFE.

And clearly no-one has yet been affected as much as SHE was.

God-willing, no one will.