Hi dcafnf5,
Refer to the 5.0 rules and 4.1 set-up. It states that Japan declares the intent to use the sneak attack and ollect the 35 IPCs at the beginning of their turn.
I hope this helps,
Koba.
For Paratroopers/flying commandos what are the guidelines.
Don’t think so.
We fly over hostiles and the limit is the bomber’s range.
2a) Are you allowed to para-drop on Paris w/o first capturing the hostel territory(s) in between (say Normandy). Same for Berlin, do they have to first take W Germany (first hostel tt), or can they just attempt an all airborne attack on Berlin w/o holding a territory on the continent? Russian territories could also be interesting if Germany builds an AB in W Ukraine or Romania and can drop on Stalingrad w/o first taking Kharkov for example. They could also drop deep into the Russian back-lands, landing bmr in Japanese held territories.
Fly 'em in and take what you will. I have seen no restriction on using them the way you mentioned. If the limitations you mentioned existed an operation like Market Garden would not be able to happen. The airborne raids you mentioned are very possible on Global 1939.
If you are attacking the first hostel territory via land or sea, you’re allowed to para-drop into the next territory making the assumption you will win the first battle, and follow through with the airborne mission regardless of if you do or not. All combat is set-up at the same time. This would allow paratroopers to go deeper into enemy territories, or get caught behind enemy lines but still have some restrictions not being able to fly over 2-3 hostel territories, then attack/drop. The first hostel territory would have to be attacked by land or sea (no multiple airborne missions to get deeper into enemy territory). You could also treat it like an amphib were you have to win the first battle or else the airborne battle is called off.
Example 3a:
Would allow you to amphib Normandy, and also Para-drop on Paris in the same turn
Example 3b:
Germany blitzes into Kharkov (first hostel territory), and also Paratroops into a weekly defended Stalingrad in the same combat move from an air base built earlier in Romania.
Example 3c:
The UK storms W Germany via amphib, and then does an all air commando raid on Berlin. Would force the Germans to defend both the coast, and the capital.
Just looking at some of the scenarios like London could be invaded w/airborne only (unless #1 is ruled in) which is ok w/me. Berlin and Paris are land locked, but I don’t think you should be able to bypass the coastal territories and do Airborne only missions (allowing both the coast and inner capital to be attacked in the same turn might be ok). Same for Russian land grabs.
Good questions for developers but I like being able to air drop anywhere and everywhere without restrictions. Causes a lot of consternation among the enemy when it’s pulled off right.
Bombers do also get to roll in the battle too when dropping airborne units at its attack value of 8 or less right?
No. Bombers are used as transports or bombers, not both.
If there is an AA gun protecting the territory, does it fire at both the bomber and airborne unit separately, or just the bomber, and the airborne unit is cargo at that point, and lost if the bmr goes down to AA fire. I think I would like it better if it was assumed the airborne unit jumped, and the bmr & trooper were fired on separately, but IDK. Should you be able to kill two units with 1 shot if you hit (bmr & trooper), or get twice as many shots firing at them separately?
I believe AA kills them both. Hit the bomber, troops die too (like a transport at sea).
Have not seen a rule about this but I think it would be a good idea to be able to intercept.
Thanks for your input koba as always your a lot of help. Below is how paratroopers (tech) was played in the Anniversary Edition which is the game we played the most until G40 came out. This is what we are comfortable with, so that’s what we’ll use as a base line for now. Although because the creators didn’t put any restrictions in to begin with, I think how you play it is probably their intent. Maybe that will change, or get refined in the 5.1 rule update (soon).
Think we may only allow the bomber to fire in the first round of battle (more limited role), and may reduce its attack value to 6 (more like a battleship doing bombardment). We will probably also allow for a conventional attack on the first hostel territory, allowing the airborne units to attack deeper like I mentioned before (more of a coordinated attack). May also cut the last line from below making airborne no retreat (like ampib units). I think I prefer airborne to be more of a supplement, instead of the whole battle. Maybe we will experiment with no restrictions later, but that would be a bear to try to see all the possibilities (there is already so much going on in this game).
Copied from the AA50 rule book
3. Paratroopers. Each of your bombers can act as
a transport for up to one infantry, but it must stop in
the first hostile territory it enters during a turn and
drop off the infantry, ending its combat movement.
The bomber may still attack during the Conduct
Combat phase, but it cannot make a strategic
bombing run in a turn that it transports an infantry
unit. The infantry unit may retreat normally to a
friendly adjacent space during combat.
Edit:
BTW it says in the Global War 1939 rules (pg31-32 under Strategic Bomber) quote:
"They (bombers) can be used to transport 1 paratrooper or inf as long as both units start their move in the same territory with an (operational) air base. Bombers can drop paratroopers into an attack but can only transport inf in NCM etc… "
So I’m confused does this means that you can’t bomber transport any special units inf in NCM (including airborne or commandos), or does it just refer to the paratrooper as part of the larger group (inf) because in NCM it isn’t doing anything special like attacking (hope it is the later, that’s how we’ve been playing, and special units follow the guidelines of the regular units in every other way I can think of). Can you say use a bmr to fly airborne units to a territory with an air base (or build one there in the same turn) to launch an airborne attack in your next turn. Can the US use a bomber to transport paratroopers to London, then do an airborne attack on Normandy next turn? Or would they have to load the paratroopers on ships, get them to England then airdrop w/bmr? Can’t see being forced to load US airborne on transports to get them to a useful place, so I guess its more of just a clarification issue. (interesting)
Your assumption is correct. Bombers non-combat airborne just like regular infantry. So, yes, you could carry your ariborne to the UK on the non-combat move of one turn and then do the assault drop on the next. Pre-requisite of air base applies to both moves.
I treat airborne like regular infantry for all instances except combat.
Figured it had to be that way. All the special units are still considered part of the base units, they just have modifications to their values.
I have some concerns about the Russian navy. First I found it strange there aren’t any Russian ships in the eastern Baltic (even G40 has a couple there), thought at least a destroyer, or cruiser for bombardment/blocking reasons if nothing else. I also didn’t notice any restrictions on the rather large White Sea Russian Navy before the Russians are at war in Europe. In our game R1 it moved west towards the English coast and now its on the back side off the coast of Ireland. It just seemed like something out of the twilight zone for the large Russian surface navy to be off the coast of the UK, as they were not exactly buds before Barbarossa. If the Russians sent a navy of this size towards England in 1939-1940 wouldn’t they have seen it as a threat?
In the game it appears that the Russian navy will be used to restart the Royal navy, because the Germans aren’t going to attack it until probably the 3rd turn or so when they go to war w/Russia. By then it will be either out of reach, or be merged with the UK/French navy and quite untouchable. From what I’ve heard the Russian navy was quite large, but was bottled up for the most part, and restricted to coastal defense. Some ships were even dismantled and the big guns mounted on shore etc…
Just though this might be an area of concern, and maybe a similar restriction as the US navy should be looked at. Keep it coastal until Russia is at war in Europe? maybe give them a small fleet in the Baltic?
One quick question, if in say the 3rd turn Germany DOW on Russian started Barbarossa, and attacked the Russian navy off the coast of England, would the UK be able to scramble fighters to defend the Russian navy? At that point I don’t think the Russians & English are allies yet.
Edit: I didn’t see any restrictions for the Russian navy in the Russian political rules, but after looking through the rule book again there is a one liner on page 28 at the end of the strict neutrals.
*While nations are not at war, units that are moved must end their turn in their own territories or in sz next to an original territory.
So I guess that applies to Russia (think it should be repeated in Russia’s political situation though). So it is safe to say we played that wrong, so most of my post is irrelevant. Still wouldn’t mind seeing a Russian surface ship in the Baltic.
BTW at least the Russian sub made it on the board. Everyone knows that if the Russian sub survives the allies will win the war LOL
Quick clarification, I would think axis powers can use an air or naval base in a territory that goes Vichy. Are the Germans allowed to build a fort or base on a Vichy territory? I know they couldn’t build an IC (not orig German territory). My gut says yes to forts, and bases, but I’m not sure being that the Germans aren’t allowed to take them over (unless the allies capture them first).
Hey guys,
Keep the information coming! Variable and I are working on the 5.1 revision and want to really clear up any issues that are out there. Don’t get discouraged if we don’t answer right away or at all, we are listening!
No problem,
I’d really like to see the pages numbered in the table of contents. Also, chapter three in 5.0 only includes the title not the subjects.
I like Wild Bill’s questions regarding Vichy territories and think some clarification on that would be good.
Question about production and going to war.
I know you have to roll 2 12d dice for Russia to ratchet up war time production each turn (48). My question is that only dice count for this right, and if you capture territories like East Poland, or save IPCs you must keep a separate tab each turn.
Example: First turn Russia rolls 8 w/dice, and takes East Poland (worth 2) and Baltic States (worth 1 IPC). Russia’s war production total is 8, but their spending income is 11 IPCs for the next turn (8+3=11). Any income saved would also track with spending income.
Another question to clarify with US production.
I know the US must roll dice to increase their production at the end of each turn. They need 80 to declare war, and they also get to include other event along the way. If the US is directly attacked, or London is captured (event) US war production automatically ratchets up, and they can declare war at the beginning of their turn (when it rolls around). My question is do the other events listed increase US production when the event happens (move the US production up before US turn), so when their turn comes up if they have 80 (or more) they can declare war at the beginning of their turn.
Say the US has 75 production at the end of their last turn. If Germany attacks Russia (event) US production goes up 10. If this is counted at the time of the event then by time the US turn comes up they would have what it needs to DOW in the beginning of their turn.
BTW in the rules on page 26 it says "Once an event takes place, add the income to the US production level until the US reaches 80 etc… It really doesn’t say to do this immediately (which would be before US’s turn), or to wait until the end of the US turn (when they would be rolling dice).
One last production question again in the wording of the events:
It lists an unprovoked Japanese attack on UK would increase the US war production by 25 (I get that). The other events don’t specify if provoked or not. Like the Japanese attack of Australia main land, or NZ. The UK/Anz could be at war (even if UK attacked first), but if Japan attacks Australia mainland the US production goes up 25. How about the Russians, could they attack first (provoke war), and if the Japanese retaliate (attack Russia) then the US production goes up 10?
Wild Bill,
Here’s how we do it with Russia and U.S. income:
Territories taken while Russia is not at war are added to her full production value. So, for instance, if East Poland is taken, Russia would be making 50IPCs per turn once at war.
Her spending money is arrived at exclusively by the rolls until she is at war.
With the U.S., the events push her income up immediately as they happen.
I would say if the German attack on Russia happens as you mentioned it, the U.S. and Germany will be at war at the beginning of the U.S. turn.
Ok, yeah that is how we played it. We gave the US the bonus at the time of the event, so when its turn came up they had enough production to go to war (didn’t need to wait until the end of their turn). It should be mentioned in the events part of the rules in 5.1 as to when you add the events bonus. Either at the time of the event (like we played it), or in the collect income of the US. Also a clarification of if the US gets the +10 production bonus if Russia starts the war w/Japan. If Russia provoked/attacked first, not sure the the US should get +10.
Agreed,
If the Soviets attack Japan there should be no increase toward war for the U.S.
Couple more clarifications regarding activating strict neutrals (some are triggered by events).
Are air units allowed to land in neutrals that are pro your side? (sorry if you already went through this).
2a) Can you fly in air units to defend a pro to your side neutral before you activate it
2b) Can you fly in air units to reinforce a territory the same turn you activated it?
2c) If you NCM an inf w/bomber transport to activate a pro neutral, can the bomber land there too (same question as above really)?
I also assume you aren’t allowed to move the newly activated units the turn you activated them. So you just swap them out and they are stuck there until your next turn (so the enemy gets a chance to kill them). It would make a considerable difference BTW if you could NCM units out of harms way the turn you activate them especially if navy is involved (but I think that might be out of line and cause problems).
Something else that needs clarification is that when certain events take place to trigger a strict neutral to go pro one side or the other, it takes place immediately right.
4a) Take Spain for instance, certain events triggers Spain to become pro axis. After Paris falls (G1 normally), and one of the 3 Russian victory cities is captured, then Spain becomes pro axis.
Paris falls G1 normally, then if Leningrad is captured later in the game (during Germany’s combat phase) Spain would become pro axis immediately right (in the middle of Germany’s turn). Germany would then be allowed to NCM into Spain to claim it, along with any units there in the same turn that it captures Leningrad right. Oh BTW I would imagine that Germany could also bomber transport an inf into one of the Spanish territories in NCM to activate it. Will be looking above to see if the bomber can also land there too).
Just wanted to make sure that the above could happen, and that you can’t move neutral units the turn you activate them.
Of coarse both the axis and allies need to be aware of when Spain (or other neutrals) are activated so they can be prepared to claim them, or kill them ASAP.
Got some more?
Target aircraft:
I know that naval ftrs can target at 1, and torpedo bmrs can target at 4 (or less). It says you choose targets before you roll dice, not sure what this means. Does each plane target different ships (can send up to two planes at capital 2-hit ships). Or are you allowed to send 3-4 of these air units at say 1 battle ship (could over kill it, and maybe all your hits won’t count?). Say you send 4 torpedo bmrs at one battleship, and two of them rolled 3’s (can choose target so b-ship is dead), but the other two rolled 5’s (hits but can’t choose). Do you loose the the two hits at 5’s (because you chose to send them all at the B-ship), or do you count their hits in the normal battle for the enemy to choose more causalities.
We have been rolling the dice, and if you roll low enough to target then you choose (but this is obviously wrong).
Both target planes say surface ships can be targeted (torp bmr can also target detected subs). So I guess transports can be targeted, but would get to fire at the planes (transports fire at 1 vs air units)?
If targeted ship is sunk (say torpedo brm hit 4 or less), does that ship return fire, or is it removed immediately. If the target was a battleship, and it takes one hit does it now return fire as a damaged battleship at 3 or less.
kamikaze clarification:
Carriers that take a hit:
I see that a damaged carrier can retrieve planes, but can’t launch air units. I know you wouldn’t be able to launch an attack, just wanted to make sure that “can’t launch air units” also includes defense. So if a damaged carrier retrieves planes they would be considered cargo, and can’t defend in the air if the carrier is attacked before it is repaired right.
Couple more clarifications regarding activating strict neutrals (some are triggered by events).
Yes, I do it in non-combat.
Are air units allowed to land in neutrals that are pro your side? (sorry if you already went through this).
I don’t play it like that. No landing until neutral is activated.
2a) Can you fly in air units to defend a pro to your side neutral before you activate it
I don’t believe so.
2b) Can you fly in air units to reinforce a territory the same turn you activated it?
No. Must hold it for one turn to land. Same as axis and allies rules since day one.
2c) If you NCM an inf w/bomber transport to activate a pro neutral, can the bomber land there too (same question as above really)?
I don’t believe so.
I move them when they are activated in the non-combat phase. Don’t know if this is right, but that’s the way the group has agreed to play it.
Immediate is how we play it.
4a) Take Spain for instance, certain events triggers Spain to become pro axis. After Paris falls (G1 normally), and one of the 3 Russian victory cities is captured, then Spain becomes pro axis.
Paris falls G1 normally, then if Leningrad is captured later in the game (during Germany’s combat phase) Spain would become pro axis immediately right (in the middle of Germany’s turn). Germany would then be allowed to NCM into Spain to claim it, along with any units there in the same turn that it captures Leningrad right. Oh BTW I would imagine that Germany could also bomber transport an inf into one of the Spanish territories in NCM to activate it. Will be looking above to see if the bomber can also land there too).
All as you say, except for bomber landing I believe.
Just wanted to make sure that the above could happen, and that you can’t move neutral units the turn you activate them.
Of coarse both the axis and allies need to be aware of when Spain (or other neutrals) are activated so they can be prepared to claim them, or kill them ASAP.
Got some more?
Target aircraft:
I know that naval ftrs can target at 1, and torpedo bmrs can target at 4 (or less). It says you choose targets before you roll dice, not sure what this means. Does each plane target different ships (can send up to two planes at capital 2-hit ships). Or are you allowed to send 3-4 of these air units at say 1 battle ship (could over kill it, and maybe all your hits won’t count?). Say you send 4 torpedo bmrs at one battleship, and two of them rolled 3’s (can choose target so b-ship is dead), but the other two rolled 5’s (hits but can’t choose). Do you loose the the two hits at 5’s (because you chose to send them all at the B-ship), or do you count their hits in the normal battle for the enemy to choose more causalities.
There is a contradiction in the rules here. On one hand it says roll first and pick targets hit on 1 or 4 repsectively, on the other it says pick targets before rolling. We use the rule as it is listed under the national advantages (we roll and pick depending on the dice).
We have been rolling the dice, and if you roll low enough to target then you choose (but this is obviously wrong).
I think it’s right until a clarification stating otherwise comes along.
Both target planes say surface ships can be targeted (torp bmr can also target detected subs). So I guess transports can be targeted, but would get to fire at the planes (transports fire at 1 vs air units)?
Transports can fire against all attacking air.
If targeted ship is sunk (say torpedo brm hit 4 or less), does that ship return fire, or is it removed immediately. If the target was a battleship, and it takes one hit does it now return fire as a damaged battleship at 3 or less.
I don’t see anything in the rules about the aircraft with targeting ability having the first shot attack like submarines do. I believe targeted ships fire back as normal.
kamikaze clarification:
This is correct.
Yep.
True.
Carriers that take a hit:
I see that a damaged carrier can retrieve planes, but can’t launch air units. I know you wouldn’t be able to launch an attack, just wanted to make sure that “can’t launch air units” also includes defense. So if a damaged carrier retrieves planes they would be considered cargo, and can’t defend in the air if the carrier is attacked before it is repaired right.
We play it that planes on damaged carriers cannot defend in the air. They are cargo and will sink with the carrier.
I hope I was of some help to you and that my assumptions are correct. Man, I can’t wait until the revised rules come out. Again, I’d like to see more marker rules and a revised set-up.
I hope I was of some help to you and that my assumptions are correct. Man, I can’t wait until the revised rules come out. Again, I’d like to see more marker rules and a revised set-up.
Koba, you have been a great help. It is good to know that others have had similar questions and came up with the same results in their own sidebars. Much of the stuff I have brought up we had questioned or debated, then played through already doing what we thought was right at the time. Sounds like your group does this too, it’s kinda just make it up as you go in some cases, then check to see if you were right LOL.
I comment about those things here just to make sure our assumptions were right, or at least get a consequences from other players like you. I know they are revising the rules, and set ups as we speak. They are also checking this site often, so I feel it is up to us to let them know if we find something that needs clarification, or maybe even minor suggestions. It will make it easier as more people start to play this awesome game. I am also looking forward to these revisions, hopefully soon. I was thinking that maybe they might do any changes in red so they are easier to pick out.
It’s good to have others to bounce things off of.
This is an awesome game and really worth the investment of time, effort and money. Honestly, I’ve put all my resources from my other AandA games into this one.
We have a game coming up in a little less than two weeks. I’ve ordered more assessories from HBG. After this one, I think all my airfields, naval bases will be HBG acryls. I got more mine fields too as they are a big hit. We’re going to try flak towers too (I think they will operate as original AA did).
I’ll post on that game as well.
