Russia - North or South?

  • I just thought I would get a general strategy thread going about killing Russia. The primary question is, do you, as Germany, push south towards the rich territories of Caucasus and Volgograd, or do you head North towards Leningrad? Or, do you go in both directions?

    Here’s my view:

    -Easy capture of Leningrad
    -Closer to Major IC in Germany
    -Reinforcements can be ferried from the Baltic
    -Quicker route to Moscow after Lenningrad

    -Not a lot of valuable territory, besides Leningrad
    -As such, not a huge net gain for Germany

    -Very valuable territories
    -Big net gain for Germany
    -Possibly reinforced from the Black Sea

    -Hard to reinforce initial army
    -Stalingrad is deep in Soviet territory
    -Easier for Russians to Reinforce

    -Same as above
    -Splits Russian army

    -Very hard to protect both armies from counterattacks
    -Splits your own army
    -Requires IC in Romania, or expensive mechs to reach the Southern army from Germany

    I tend to head both directions, but I feel that I don’t have enough strength once I get to the Ukraine/Belarus area. Where do you guys head? Also, how many IPCs are you spending in Russia each turn, and where are those units going?

    Lots of questions, answer as best you can. Thanks!

  • I split too. Does it work?

    Really, it’s dependent on Russia like everything else Barbarossa.

  • usually i go north, havent seen it matter though. Russia dies so easy.

  • i generally split cuz its more of a slow n steady strategy

    but id say going south would throw USSR the most off balance

    a dedicated southern push forces russia to pull back FAST or else risk getting units cut off from moscow
    once this retreat happens, leningrad is basically a done deal anyway

    whichever direction you choose as germany, EASTERN POLAND is your ticket to moscow
    makes russia make the tough decisions about when and where to defend

  • that sortof depends on what the russian does.

    if defending against split, the russian should (imo) stack in bryansk, that way he will be able to stop the german from being able to stand next to the stack since he is split. so the german will acheave almost nothing in south. The russian can also keep his mobiles and a few inf in smolensk (as long as germany can’t blitz there in a good way), so that it is not that simple for germany to take and keep leningrad without essensially chaning his strategy to going north, in which case the main stack can move north too,

    going north is probably best if the german is doing a limited barbarossa, so the goal is to just capture leningrad, keep norway safe and support italians in africa. probably a good option after a cheap sealion.

    south is where germany should go if barbarossa is the main plan for how the axis are supposed to win the game. all those moneys in cauc and iraq/iran that can be taken cheaply when italian canopeners are in place is ridicolous,

  • Customizer

    I try to build up 4 main forces: South in Romania, Center in Slovakia/Hungary, North in Poland and a far North up in Finland. The Finland force will usually be more infantry heavy with maybe a couple of artillery so it will require more air support than the other 3 armies. If things go right, the Finland force will be sufficient, along with heavy air support and maybe additional troops from any transports in the Baltic, to take Leningrad. Then the North force can move on to Belarus, Center force goes on to Western Ukraine and Southern Force goes on to Ukraine. Southern Force may need to take some of the armor from Center Force to overcome usually heavier defence of the Minor IC in Ukraine.
    Now, if Russia manages some successful counter attacks, they may possibly wipe out one or two of those armies. In that case, I have to change my plan accordingly. I basically try to keep a solid front all the way across, although sometimes that can be very hard. Sometimes due to Russian attacks, I have to resort to a couple of dedicated thrusts rather than a solid front. If the Russians are really lucky, then I may have to settle back and wait for reinforcements to come up, which of course also allows Russia to build more. If this goes on too long, then the Western Allies may be able to complete landings in France which you have to deal with. If they get too strong, it may mean doom for the Reich. I’ve had some games where as Germany I finally manage to take Moscow but it took so long that the US and UK beat me in Europe.

  • Both.

    Merge in Bryansk from the Ukraine territories and also from Belarus.  Use Smolensk as your buffer to protect the northern march from a Russian Counter Attack on your split stacks.

    Baltic / Belarus
    W.Ukraine / Leningrad
    Belarus / Ukraine
    Merge in Bryansk

  • '15

    I like letting Italy handle the South while Germany attacks North.  They then combine when you get to Moscow.

  • How does Italy handle the south alone? Or do they have german assistance? Is it even possible to say that you ignore Africa in your games until russia becomes axis?

  • If italiansarecoming says the Italians can’t do something; they surely can’t.

    And honestly, Italy can’t. With German assistance, perhaps but that’s a split force. They should can-open.

  • @techroll42:

    If italiansarecoming says the Italians can’t do something; they surely can’t.

    That’s what I am saying.  Can opening would be okay though

  • i always invade north, as its easier to reinforce, leningrad always falls very quickly and gives a nice cash bonus.
    it also sways the soviet player from trying to invade finland and norway…
    but i also send a lot of infantry south and keep my planes in range in case i need to attack…

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