Mixing units?



  • I have read quite a few strategies that call for a mix of units, X infran, X art, X mech infr, and X tanks.  However in the majotiy of the strategies I have read, they call for a minority of tanks.  Lets say 5infran, 5 arty, 3 mech infran, and maybe 2 tanks.

    I have a bad habit of buying straight tanks, I only really purchase infran to act as cannon folder.  I can remove them as causalities instead of the tanks.  Saves IPC’s.

    However, what is the purpose of throwing in arty and mech infran?  The coast is almost that of tanks with a 33% hit probability instead of 50%.  I do not mean to criticize any particular strategy, I would like to make my own more dynamic and flexible.  Throwing in a mix of units would help me do this, but I am simply questioning to logic behind it.

    Thanks.



  • Well, artillery make infantry a lot more effective at attacking.  Essentially you’re purchasing a unit with 3 attack and 2 defense for 4 IPCs (assuming you have extra infantry).  Mech. infantry are good for getting places quickly - they’re more situational but they can be useful under some circumstances.



  • Lets say you already have a lot of Infantry.

    Building a new Tank for 6 adds +3 attack value and 1 more unit.

    Adding an Artillery for 4 adds +3 attack value and 1 more unit.

    Now lets say you have a lot of units heading towards Moscow, but you’re still three rounds away.  You know that in three rounds Moscow will have 24 new infantry, and you’ll be outnumbered…you need some extra units there quickly.  You buy 10 MECH which can get there quickly.



  • Hmmmmmm…… so the purchase of arty is cheaper than the purchase of tanks assuming you have the infantry to utilize it?

    I hadn’t thought of that.


  • Liaison TripleA '11 '10

    A few things to remember aswell wolverine…

    Your Army doesn’t just have an ATTACK value, and a DEFENCE value.  It also has a HIT POINTS value.

    Just like the real conflict, you need a little bit of everything to win well.  Otherwise, everything has it’s counter, or, has no purpose.

    I used to be AGAINST buying artillery as well,  but their counter attack capabilities cannot be denied, and I also don’t have to leave tanks behind on the front lines, if I can use artillery.

    Most A&A units DEFEND better than they attack, and it’s important to remember that to move an army forward, you want to be in such a position, that your enemies counter attack won’t destroy you.

    in building defensively, which you will have to consider if you ever want to win a game,  a tank for $6, rolls at 3,  vs 2 inf take two hits, and rolls 2 dice, collectively for $4.

    For the SAME money, this gets exponentially worse…

    2 tanks = 12,  2 hits, 6 defence power.

    4 inf = 12, 4 hits, 8 defence power

    See where this is going?

    If you are GERMANY, with $48, and I am Russia with $36…

    Germany has 8 tanks * 3 attack  for 8 hits.  24 damage,  roughly 4 hits

    Russia has 12 infantry * 2 defence  = 24 damage, roughly 4 hits.

    Don’t even make me calculate what happens to your tanks in the second round…

    For 75% of the cost, the Russians can kill just as many units as you, whilst losing infantry to your tanks.

    There’s no denying that tanks are good, and you want some… and you also want to mix in some mechanized units, in case you get a chance to BREAKTHROUGH the enemy lines.  Artillery is good, but too much is no good, you’ll run out of infantry…  it’s all a balance my friend.  You’ll figure it out as you play the game 😛



  • Awesome, thank you.



  • inf are the best, trade them against other inf (attacking lone or groups of inf with inf and sufficiant fighters)
    artillery are the best offensive power, but you need a core (i like 20, some like 30 and my brother like 50) of tanks, coupled with tacticals. those are the units who will fight to the last, your core, essential offensive power of the army.
    Mechs are good to race troops to eastern front coming from berlin.



  • True, and another advantage of mechs that Garg touched upon is their ability to exploit flanking attacks.  If Russia offers a gap, shoot a few mechanized units through to draw him away from his captial, their ability to blitz with tanks means he has to kill those units.  Most Russian players leave their gaps on the flanks, so be watchful.

    I like to purchase mechs and armor for Italy just for this purpose.  Then their ‘can opener’ can remain strong and be able to ‘can open’ all along the front.


  • Liaison TripleA '11 '10

    I love it when the Chitlins make a breatthrough on the Russian frony, and my German Armored/Mechanized units break through to the CAPITAL! 😛


  • Liaison TripleA '11 '10

    LOL Canuck 12 in F2F games…  and once online I think.



  • I’ve got another good point to bring up about arty in general.  I love them and have used them from the beginning.  I prefer a 2-3 ration art to inf provided that my lead stack can be reinforced with captured IC’s.  Any other shortfalls in inf can be made up with mech inf.

    Russia is uniquely positioned to take full advantage of arty guns.  They have a long vulnerable front, lots of inf and few ftrs to allow for attritional battles.  When fighting as Russia you might be able to contest locations and keep the attritional war up by parceling out a few arty guns to go with inf to capture border territories.  Arty are cheaper than aircraft and allow the Russians to purchase flesh for the meat grinder instead of ftrs for defense/attrition battles.


  • Liaison TripleA '11 '10

    I wish I was that lucky.

    BTW!

    Luck is when PREPARATION meets OPPURTUNITY!



  • One of our players likes to buy lots of Tanks and sometimes he has hot rolls and he’ll do well and it can look intimidating 10 or 15 Tanks sitting on your door step, but when he has to loose Tanks because of lack of defense that can really take the wind out of his sails. He has had some victories that way but not many.
      Always buy enough Inf to back up your Tanks  and then a few more to make up for bad dice. When you have enough Inf on there way Tanks can move fast
      30$ is it better to have 10 Inf or 6 Inf and 2 Tanks or 4 Inf and 3 Tanks or the 2 Inf and 4 Tanks or go for the 5 Tanks
          I think it depends on what round it is and where you are (on the doorstep of Moscow or on the border)


  • Customizer

    One nasty little trick our Russian player likes to pull against Germany is to pull his forces back, leaving open territories.  The German player (often me) will have a good supply of infantry with tanks but gets fooled into blitzing with the tanks/mechs and leaving the infantry/artillery behind.  Then Russia counterattacks and Germany loses all or most of his tanks while the infantry/artillery are still too far behind.  By the time they get to the front, they have no supporting armor punch.
    As Germany, I fell for this a couple of times before wising up.


  • Liaison TripleA '11 '10

    Every formation in the game was weaknesses and strengths…  It’s how you use BOTH of those to your advantage, that is the difference maker in winning or losing.

    A VERY good understanding of the rules helps here,  when you know things like if you send just aircraft at an opposing navy, your enemy can’t use his subs and so on.  Or knowing when to give up an aa gun to stop a blitz.

    It’s all those things that help… and experience.

    The only thing you can’t beat, is dice.  But you can fight em! Or fight with em!



  • I really like what Gargantua said, “The only thing you can’t beat, is dice.  But you can fight em! Or fight with em!”

    When I play I always keep in mind probabilities. Here’s an example. I once got caught in a naval arms race with the U.S., while playing as Japan. My opponent was buying nothing, but battleships, but rather then try and match him Battleship for Battleship, I chose to invest in cheaper units, that would allow me to roll more die than him.

    If you pit 2 Battleships vs. 2 Battleships there is a 33% chance he will win, a 33% chance I will and 33% chance we destroy each other(on average). However, if I take my 40 IPCs and spend them on 1 Battleship, 2 Submarines and a 1 Destroyer, suddenly his odds of winning are reduced to 30%, mine increase to 60% with a 10% of mutual destruction. I’ve given my 40 IPCs more bang.

    Just some food for thought.


  • 2017 2016 '13 '12

    @BlynderOG:

    I really like what Gargantua said, “The only thing you can’t beat, is dice.  But you can fight em! Or fight with em!”

    When I play I always keep in mind probabilities. Here’s an example. I once got caught in a naval arms race with the U.S., while playing as Japan. My opponent was buying nothing, but battleships, but rather then try and match him Battleship for Battleship, I chose to invest in cheaper units, that would allow me to roll more die than him.

    If you pit 2 Battleships vs. 2 Battleships there is a 33% chance he will win, a 33% chance I will and 33% chance we destroy each other(on average). However, if I take my 40 IPCs and spend them on 1 Battleship, 2 Submarines and a 1 Destroyer, suddenly his odds of winning are reduced to 30%, mine increase to 60% with a 10% of mutual destruction. I’ve given my 40 IPCs more bang.

    Just some food for thought.

    Battleship builds are a dream come through for Japan, as Japan, buy 6 submarines and save 4 bucks. After you sink the steel cans you can go interdict as needed.  :evil:



  • @BlynderOG:

    I really like what Gargantua said, “The only thing you can’t beat, is dice.  But you can fight em! Or fight with em!”

    When I play I always keep in mind probabilities. Here’s an example. I once got caught in a naval arms race with the U.S., while playing as Japan. My opponent was buying nothing, but battleships, but rather then try and match him Battleship for Battleship, I chose to invest in cheaper units, that would allow me to roll more die than him.

    If you pit 2 Battleships vs. 2 Battleships there is a 33% chance he will win, a 33% chance I will and 33% chance we destroy each other(on average). However, if I take my 40 IPCs and spend them on 1 Battleship, 2 Submarines and a 1 Destroyer, suddenly his odds of winning are reduced to 30%, mine increase to 60% with a 10% of mutual destruction. I’ve given my 40 IPCs more bang.

    Just some food for thought.

    Yes, I remember that battle not going so well. <_<



  • A navy with 2 or 3 battleships will always fair better than a navy without.
    Something that people often fail to consider is the 2 hits accredited to these ships.
    The same applies to the carriers. Carriers should not have 2 hits, only battleships should.


  • '10

    @cts17:

    Carriers should not have 2 hits, only battleships should.

    Not so sure about that, but i must admit : 2 hits Carriers = the end of Battleships purchases in most of the situations…


  • Liaison TripleA '11 '10

    I still buy the odd battleship.

    Besides… it’s not about when you buy battleships as much as it is about how you use the ones you start with.

    And yes, 2 or 3, with a carrier mix are great,  I LOVE the Strafing Navy…  Carriers can’t do that aswell, because the fighters can’t land on them after for the retreat! And you can only scramble up to 3! :S


Log in to reply
 

Suggested Topics

  • 17
  • 30
  • 5
  • 3
  • 3
  • 4
  • 24
  • 53
I Will Never Grow Up Games
Axis & Allies Boardgaming Custom Painted Miniatures
Dean's Army Guys

52
Online

13.7k
Users

34.0k
Topics

1.3m
Posts