More German Subs



  • How would it affect the game if the Germans started out with 1 or two more subs in the Baltic?  Submarine warfare is something Germany can really use, but since it seems to often lose its starting subs and then need to focus on Russia it doesn’t happen too much.



  • Check out the thread “Das Boot”. It goes over alot about U-Boats and may have what your looking for  🙂



  • Build 2 to start, and attack SZs 106 and 109 with two subs each.
    With luck, you should kill both the destroyers there, and have one or two subs near canada, that the UK cant kill on UK1.

    Run them all around the globe.

    Allow the two UK battleships to survive your G1 attacks, keep the bulk of your airforce in West Germany

    If the UK player wants to keep that fleet, he will put it in 109 and build more ships….good for italy in africa
    If the UK player fears an attack, well there is little they can do besides run “some” ships to gibraltar

    In any event, the UK fleet becomes a liability. No UK player will crash it into you, and they cant run it all away, so if they try to save half, the other half will just die.

    Also, subs near canada  :-D, which are super annoying



  • Lol copy and paste right oztea  :-D?



  • So no one actually has any thoughts on giving Germany more starting subs.



  • Well I personaly think it’d be nice. To few to do any real harm unlike the real U-Boat threat.



  • They have enough to start to cause havoc, which is really all they should have.
    In game, subs are infantry of the sea. Giving germany more subs is like giving russia more infantry….not powerful, but more hits they can soak up attacking

    If at all, one more sub in the Baltic. Strange one doesnt start there.

    To be honest id be ok with adding the following

    USSR - Destroyer SZ 127
    Germany - Destroyer & Sub SZ 114
    UK - Sub 71



  • I’d say the sub number is fine, but no German destroyer!  That is where I’d add the unit.

    Remember this is 1940, Germany didn’t start with that many subs, but built tons during the war.  If you want to recreate the sub war you’re going to have to build them!:)



  • The problem with that is Germany generally doesn’t have a reason to invest in subs when it weakens the Russian offensive, especially when the US can come in with the hammer in a few rounds and wipe them out anyway.  I think the best way to see more submarine warfare is to give them more starting subs, because then they’d actually be able to use them.


  • Liaison TripleA '11 '10

    You should just throw in an NO.

    Provided Germany does This  whatever this ends up being, they get to place 1 free sub a turn at the end of thier turn.

    Could you imagine the effect that would have?



  • I like it. If Germany’s IPC value is -Blank- (I dont have the board in front of me so lets say 35) they control the three German homelands and France then they place one sub in the baltic. Consider this the german version of the japs kamakazies.



  • Bah.  Change the rules so that submarines can retreat if they survive a round of combat, offensive battles OR defensive.  It’s stupid that a single destroyer with backup planes can destroy an entire sub stack with the current rules.  Maybe have destroyers’ effects on subs only work on a 1:1 basis.



  • A sub or two can be a good option early in a game, especially if this can dictate what U.K. has to buy .For every sub you buy, U.K. needs a Destroyer , or the U.S.A.  I’ve found that they work better in groups of 2 or more.


  • Liaison TripleA '11 '10

    FYI Every unit in the game, with the exception of AA, works better in groups of 2 or more.

    Thank you for your worthwhile contribution.



  • @SgtBlitz:

    Bah.  Change the rules so that submarines can retreat if they survive a round of combat, offensive battles OR defensive.  It’s stupid that a single destroyer with backup planes can destroy an entire sub stack with the current rules.  Maybe have destroyers’ effects on subs only work on a 1:1 basis.

    If you have a SINGLE destroyer and a bunch of air, all that stack of subs needs is ONE hit and the air becomes unable to hit the subs (as the attacker can not take fighters as casualties against sub hits).



  • @Rorschach:

    @SgtBlitz:

    Bah.  Change the rules so that submarines can retreat if they survive a round of combat, offensive battles OR defensive.  It’s stupid that a single destroyer with backup planes can destroy an entire sub stack with the current rules.  Maybe have destroyers’ effects on subs only work on a 1:1 basis.

    If you have a SINGLE destroyer and a bunch of air, all that stack of subs needs is ONE hit and the air becomes unable to hit the subs (as the attacker can not take fighters as casualties against sub hits).

    It’s still a net loss, though (probably).  The subs can take out the destroyer, but they can’t even target the planes.  Meanwhile, the planes and the destroyer can probably get rid of at least 2 subs.  This is probably going to be a situation where the subs are defending, meaning they only hit on a 1 anyway.



  • New Rule?

    Germany can place a sub in its collect income phase instead of collecting a National Objective bonus



  • Eh I like the idea that they get a free sub if the Axis control all of France, Germany controls S.Germany, W. Germany, and Germany, AND Germany is making at least 40 IPCs.



  • Germany has sufficient to start with, can easily buid more if you like



  • Yeah but thats not the point. Most German players use everything they’ve got to take Russia and don’t build subs. We just want some historical stuff going on.



  • Wow, I find german subs to be soooo useful, I tend to buy 1 a round, or perhaps 3 in France if I can afford it.

    It only takes 3 turns of convoy raiding for a sub to pay itself off, and lots of Subs and aircraft around UK can make it hard for the US to take that island back.



  • just give Germany 1 free sub a turn (6 ipc) and russia 1 free tank per turn (6 ipc).



  • i am personally against giving freebies for anyone


  • '10

    @Ruanek:

    @Rorschach:

    @SgtBlitz:

    Bah.  Change the rules so that submarines can retreat if they survive a round of combat, offensive battles OR defensive.  It’s stupid that a single destroyer with backup planes can destroy an entire sub stack with the current rules.  Maybe have destroyers’ effects on subs only work on a 1:1 basis.

    If you have a SINGLE destroyer and a bunch of air, all that stack of subs needs is ONE hit and the air becomes unable to hit the subs (as the attacker can not take fighters as casualties against sub hits).

    It’s still a net loss, though (probably).  The subs can take out the destroyer, but they can’t even target the planes.  Meanwhile, the planes and the destroyer can probably get rid of at least 2 subs.  This is probably going to be a situation where the subs are defending, meaning they only hit on a 1 anyway.

    I agree with the Sarge. Most of the subs get killed in one round. The subs defending at one seldom get to hit that destroyer. The OOB sub rules are funky!



  • meh, I just think Uk gets screwed on geting enough destroyers, if you add more subs, id certainly add more destroyers.


Log in to reply
 

Suggested Topics

  • 6
  • 11
  • 10
  • 14
  • 19
  • 6
  • 7
  • 15
I Will Never Grow Up Games

38
Online

13.4k
Users

33.8k
Topics

1.3m
Posts