What if….

Korea and Manchuria didn’t have the resources which Japan needed most, especially oil, so stopping there wouldn’t have solved Japan’s economic problems.  On the other hand, some of those problems were caused by the oil embargo which the U.S. slapped on Japan after the start of the invasion of China proper in 1937, so if Japan had been satisfied with acquiring Manchuria and Jehol it would not have been in as critical a position as it was after its invasion of China led to the oil embargo.  Japan did, however, also have the purely domestic problem of having a rapidly growing population being supported on too little land, which was another motive for acquiring new territory, even when oil is left out of the equation.

If Hitler would have stopped at Czechoslovakia, WWII (at least in Europe) wouldn’t have happened.  Its possible there would have been a war between Britian, France, and Russia over the Baltic states, but maybe not.  Likewise with Japan.

But their ambition drove them to wars they wouldn’t win.

@221B:

If Hitler would have stopped at Czechoslovakia, WWII (at least in Europe) wouldn’t have happened.  Its possible there would have been a war between Britian, France, and Russia over the Baltic states, but maybe not.  Likewise with Japan.

But their ambition drove them to wars they wouldn’t win.

I disagree on both “wouldn’t happen” and “wouldn’t win”.

Hitler pushed as much as he could to get land just by bullying. In fact, he was even surprised when France and UK declared war over Poland’s invasion.
France and UK accepted unfair deal (before Poland) to avoid the war, and yet Hitler kept bullying. So I feel WWII would happen anyway… which Third Reich could have won BTW. I don’t feel Third Reich would have last decades tho, certainly not 1000 years!

USA was rated 14th as army power at that time and didn’t want to get involved in “European war”. What “saved” USA is distance. USA was surprised at Pearl Harbor, perhaps, but France (whole Europe actually, Great Britain saved by water) was surprised over all his land!

All Europe was down. Worst, Vichys resisted UK!
Even Great Britain was down, equipment left at Dunkirk, RAF was about to crumble when Hitler stopped raiding them. Loosing twice as much aircrafts than UK, made Hitler stop, unaware that RAF was struggling lacking of both pilots and planes.

Stop fighting at Dunkirk (allowing Allies to flee and regroup in Great Britain), UK Land invasion never occured, Attack on Russia (and it’s winter), failed assasination on Hitler, unsupported Africa Corps (few supplies sent was sunk)… all those major events cause Third Reich downward. Even if D-Day is outrageously promote by movies (Many other battles were way more important, specially on russian side), I have to admit that Third Reich wouldn’t have failed without USA and UK’s colonies’ effort.

Please don’t take me wrong, I certainly hope this war (any war in fact) would never happen. I most certainly don’t like dictators, racism and disinformation (propaganda). Yet, facts are there. WWII was going to happen anyway, Third Reich could have won, as much as I dislikes both statements.

@BigBadBruce:

@221B:

If Hitler would have stopped at Czechoslovakia, WWII (at least in Europe) wouldn’t have happened.  Its possible there would have been a war between Britian, France, and Russia over the Baltic states, but maybe not.  Likewise with Japan.

But their ambition drove them to wars they wouldn’t win.

I disagree on both “wouldn’t happen” and “wouldn’t win”.

Hitler pushed as much as he could to get land just by bullying. In fact, he was even surprised when France and UK declared war over Poland’s invasion.
France and UK accepted unfair deal (before Poland) to avoid the war, and yet Hitler kept bullying. So I feel WWII would happen anyway… which Third Reich could have won BTW. I don’t feel Third Reich would have last decades tho, certainly not 1000 years!

USA was rated 14th as army power at that time and didn’t want to get involved in “European war”. What “saved” USA is distance. USA was surprised at Pearl Harbor, perhaps, but France (whole Europe actually, Great Britain saved by water) was surprised over all his land!

All Europe was down. Worst, Vichys resisted UK!
Even Great Britain was down, equipment left at Dunkirk, RAF was about to crumble when Hitler stopped raiding them. Loosing twice as much aircrafts than UK, made Hitler stop, unaware that RAF was struggling lacking of both pilots and planes.

Stop fighting at Dunkirk (allowing Allies to flee and regroup in Great Britain), UK Land invasion never occured, Attack on Russia (and it’s winter), failed assasination on Hitler, unsupported Africa Corps (few supplies sent was sunk)… all those major events cause Third Reich downward. Even if D-Day is outrageously promote by movies (Many other battles were way more important, specially on russian side), I have to admit that Third Reich wouldn’t have failed without USA and UK’s colonies’ effort.

Please don’t take me wrong, I certainly hope this war (any war in fact) would never happen. I most certainly don’t like dictators, racism and disinformation (propaganda). Yet, facts are there. WWII was going to happen anyway, Third Reich could have won, as much as I dislikes both statements.

I’m confused as to why you disagree with my statement, then go on to make a similar point as mine.  My “Wouldn’t happen” statement is dependant on Hitler stopping at Czech, which of course we both agree (you stated Hitler kept bullying) that this action was not in Hitlers character.  “Wouldn’t win” is the actual outcome (I don’t think you claim Germany won the war), though of course prior to the war no one knew with certainty the outcome.

Is your point that WWII was inevitable after 1938 regardless of the actions of any individual (i.e. no invasion of Poland)?  That if not Poland, there would somewhere be another point of friction to start the war?  This I can agree with.

Yep, exactly that 221B Baker Street .

Sorry, I miss read your negative verb tense… english failed me (which isn’t mother tongue).
Reading your last answer, we have same thoughts.

BBB,

Thanks for clearing this up.  You English is actually pretty good (certainly much better than my abilities with other languages).

It already is, Roosevelt caused Pacific WW2 because there were 3 options: make Japan lose face, have them slowly withdraw without being internationally humiliated(the one I would have chose, plus the Japanese were open to this, as the US ambassador thought this would succeed), or go to war. Roosevelt chose the last option, keeping within his tendencies as the man who destroyed pigs that could have saved people’s, in the Great Depression’s lives, so that the unions would be happy with high food prices. Thomas Jefferson would have done the right thing, which is to be isolationist unless it threatens your nation’s exsistence. They can not invent anything to save their life, but they can improve anything to make it ten times better than it was before. My last sentence explains how they watched Gen. Billy Mitchell and his demonstrations, so that they could use it someday. Gen. Mitchell predicted Pearl Harbor (not the day), within 30 monutes for every aspect from who would do it to how they would organize it to what would be destroyed, the only thing he got wrong was the time, and only by 30 minutes.