• I know this is probably a really silly idea, but does the fact that by the end of the 2nd round, Germany & Japan combined can produce the 27 subs required to convoy disrupt USA down to its NO 30ipc income?
    I havent really tried to work out if this is at all viable or worthwhile, but the basic idea is USA gets waaaay too big because of it’s income, UK & ANZACS are much of a lesser concern for the same reason, USSR could be a problem unfortunately. So if u could position ur subs by G3/J3 (not easy i admit, USA is reduced to an income similar to UK(europe). Of course the axis continue to do some of the standard opening moves also, such as grab the money isles, take france, etc…
    Also working on the idea that maybe Larry included the concept of Convoy disruption to be utilised somehow… 😉

    Has anyone considered or tried this?


  • You’re wasting 6 ipcs to deny 2 ipcs. In addition, 1 Destroyer and multiple planes will kill the lot. If the axis build them on round 2, then it’ll be until round 4 that they get to the US. US, seeing this coming a mile away, blocks with DDs and prepares to counter them. in addition, Russia is eying up Germany


  • @calvinhobbesliker:

    You’re wasting 6 ipcs to deny 2 ipcs. In addition, 1 Destroyer and multiple planes will kill the lot. If the axis build them on round 2, then it’ll be until round 4 that they get to the US. US, seeing this coming a mile away, blocks with DDs and prepares to counter them. in addition, Russia is eying up Germany
    OUCH! 😮


  • True, it seems like a waste of IPC’s - 6 vs 2 - and it takes G4 to get them into position.
    However, if you can get them into position, those 27 lots of 6 ipc’s can continue to deprive the USA of income for many rnds (maybe…); and maybe it’s more effective to deprive the USA of IPC’s before they get to build something, rather than work out how to destroy it without casualties after they’ve built it.

    Getting them there is a problem; but i was wondering if you could send a single sub forward in each sz around the main sub fleet to prevent the DD’s facilitating the US airforce sinking the bulk of the sub fleet - eg: get the fleet to sz103, with one sub in each of sz’s 90, 91, 102, 104, 107, 108; then all survivors and the fleet wipeout all remaining DD’s in the area (20@2 should take out a few DD’s pretty quickly!)

    I appreciate this isn’t doing much to help Germany/Japan’s main tasks of crushing UK/USSR/ANZAC, however a big part of the problem is the Big Green Giant coming over in rnd4 or earlier and smashing Germany. If this sort of worked, then it gives both of them plenty of time to complete these tasks.
    Is USSR an actual threat to invade Germany? i can see it being harder to crack by rnd 4, but i find it hard to believe they could seriously hurt Germany even by rnd 4…
    Any other ideas to stop the rnd4 termination of the Axis?


  • This is sort of related. Does anyone feel the scale of the Atlantic Ocean is too small? I think it should take longer and be harder for US to smash into europe so easily. Seems like Atlantic is too small compared to Pacific.


  • If Germany spends enough money to safely battle the fact that the USA will be pumping out 5 destoryers a turn(before they go to war and a lot more fleet after they do)  and still manage to win the upcoming navel battle then they have spent so much that Russia will easily roll through Germany(again assuming average dice rolling) once they break through the first german wall. And with getting 6 per German area they take(or even 3 with the new possible upcoming changes) its all over for Germany and thus game is over. So you contain the USA fine, the USA switches to the job of draining resources from Germany in Japan allowing the other allies to move about mostly freely. Also if the Uk fleet lives or they start building off Canada they could put a giant hole in this by messing around with German subs.


  • This is sort of related. Does anyone feel the scale of the Atlantic Ocean is too small? I think it should take longer and be harder for US to smash into europe so easily. Seems like Atlantic is too small compared to Pacific.

    Actually the Atlantic is too small if you take real scale into consideration. Do you really think the Pacific is the same size as the Atlantic?


  • Yeah fair enuff - its obviously a silly idea then ;-(
    I think i maybe keep forgetting that the destroyers negate the subs First Strike or something, i kept thinking it seemed a bit more plausible than general consensus. Just as well i’ve never tried it in a game!

    On the tangent tho, YES the Atlantic is waaay too small. I guess Larry decided it was necessary for game design/balance or something. It is extremely annoying for the axis when the yanks can hit Gibraltar so quickly. Just one more sz to travel would’ve made it soooo much better for the defending axis to prepare. And it does seen v inconsistent compared to the vast expanse of the Pacific that the Japanese/USA/ANZAC’s hv to cover. The Pacific actually is big enuff for naval maneuvers, whereas the Pond is just a playground for everything built in Eastern USA.
    Obviously it would be v v hard to errata the map itself, but maybe sz 102, 90, & 88 could each be split down the middle, for example.


  • THANK YOU! At least one other person acknowledges this and YES i realize the Pacific ocean is bigger than the Atlantic you jackwagon! US transports should have to travel further and linger out in the Atlantic in the U-boat kill zone where US air power cant reach. Germany then would have a chance at slowing down US landings with relatively cheap.

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