Industrial Complex Rule Placement Change



  • It has been brought to my attention that major industrial complexes can be purchased & placed on territories of value 3 or greater. This can result in a major industrial complex being placed on a number of territories not known for historically significant ìndustrial production. Why not make the minimum territory value in this case 4 or 5 or greater instead. If a minor industrial complex can be built on a 2 value territory, it seems to me that a complex that produces over three times as many units should be at least double the minimum value for placing a minor complex. This suggestion should, imho, be considered for a future rule revision.



  • @aethervox:

    It has been brought to my attention that major industrial complexes can be purchased & placed on territories of value 3 or greater. This can result in a major industrial complex being placed on a number of territories not known for historically significant ìndustrial production. Why not make the minimum territory value in this case 4 or 5 or greater instead. If a minor industrial complex can be built on a 2 value territory, it seems to me that a complex that produces over three times as many units should be at least double the minimum value for placing a minor complex. This suggestion should, imho, be considered for a future rule revision.

    In the map as drawn there aren’t enough territories that have 4 or more IPC value that this rule makes any sense because the majority of these spaces already have factories (minor or not) in place.  It would be more appropriate, and simpler, to allow major factories only be placed in ORIGINAL territories, not conquered spaces.  This still allows Japan to place a major in Manchuria, Korea, etc (which is a necessary step for most Japanese strategies) but prohibits the US from breaking Europe by placing a major in Norway.  And it still allows the flexibility of placing minors in non original spaces.


  • Customizer

    But it still allows the ridiculous British factory in India, a non-industrial region.

    Home areas needs to be restricted further, excluding non-industrial colonies such as Egypt.

    I would only allow

    USA (the 48 states)
    UK, “Scotland”, NSW, Quebec, US Africa
    Germany (3xtt)
    Italy (2xtt)
    France (3xtt)
    USSR in Europe
    Japan

    In fact to be absolutely plain I wouldn’t allow any new factories, just keep the OOB complexes minus India plus Kiev and Tankograd.

    I challenge anyone to come up with a historical example of a significant military production facility being set up from scratch during wartime other than in the above core areas, or of a factory captured in wartime being used to produce units.

    To balance this I allow infantry to be placed in any home area up to the IPC value, so the UK can place infantry in India, but not build tanks there.



  • @Flashman:

    But it still allows the ridiculous British factory in India, a non-industrial region.

    Home areas needs to be restricted further, excluding non-industrial colonies such as Egypt.

    I would only allow

    USA (the 48 states)
    UK, “Scotland”, NSW, Quebec, US Africa
    Germany (3xtt)
    Italy (2xtt)
    France (3xtt)
    USSR in Europe
    Japan

    In fact to be absolutely plain I wouldn’t allow any new factories, just keep the OOB complexes minus India plus Kiev and Tankograd.

    I challenge anyone to come up with a historical example of a significant military production facility being set up from scratch during wartime other than in the above core areas, or of a factory captured in wartime being used to produce units.

    To balance this I allow infantry to be placed in any home area up to the IPC value, so the UK can place infantry in India, but not build tanks there.

    Well, I’ve personally always accepted the abstraction that a “factory” is not a literal factory.  I’ve always imagined the “factory” to approximate the role of military bases, infrastructure, naval yards, ports, rearming, refueling, etc etc.  In fact, more of everything AFTER a tank roles off the line that the factory itself, as planes, tanks, infantry are finished with training complete, ships have been outfitted and have gone through their commissioning and shakedown periods and are combat ready - stands to reason, given the level of abstraction of the game, it’s not really JUST a factory and more similar to where new units are deployed to.  It’s still an abstraction even then, but far more reasonable than a “factory”.

    I just don’t believe that that level of military base coordination and staging would be reasonable in a newly conquered territory.  A minor “factory” (base), sure.  A major, not so much.  And I’ll forgive India.  Otherwise the UK couldn’t possibly get air or sea units to it, and britain certainly had some naval and air presence there.


  • Customizer

    …which were quickly wiped out by Japan and not replaced.

    The Soviet Navy had to build ships in Russia then sail them out to form the Pacific fleet.

    I don’t buy the idea of complexes as staging areas - this can apply to any area where you build up forces, and doesn’t need a factory.  To me, “Industrial Complex” means a vast industrial base of economic production in which weapons of war are forged.  To establish such a base overseas from scratch is simply not realistic. Much, much cheaper and quicker to ship/rail the units from their base of origin in your home territory which is exactly what the game should reflect.

    Industrial complexes (at least building new ones and using other player’s) are one of those hangovers from the original game design that somehow haven’t been updated because they feel like too much a part of the A&A tradition.  But, like the Sinai peninsular being in Trans-Jordan, or the disturbing re-appearance of the Hiberno-Caledonian land bridge, they don’t belong in a game which purports to represent World War II.


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