Technology is a bad strategic investment


  • TripleA

    If buying 1 technology dice per round you would average 1 technology per 30ipc.

    You can not direct your technology so you have a 1 in 6 chance of getting the technology you want (but there probably is not any technology that your really want) you would be better off buying units that you can direct to be exactly what you want.

    All techs are worthless, worth less than 30ipc.


  • TripleA

    Advanced Artillery -  your artillery is now bigger stronger and more dangerous, german 88s can take out tanks, katyushas bring huge amounts of explosives quickly to an area thus it allows a 2nd inf to upgrade 1 attack pip. for 30ipc you could just buy 7 more artillery that would get you 21 more attack pips, 14 more defence pips and 7 more units that can soak up hits. You even get 2ipc change.


  • TripleA

    Rockets – these sweet V2s  can rain terror on your opponent from over 300km away, for an average of 3.5ipc per aagun. Problem is you need to have aaguns(or sink in another investment of 6ipc per gun) and own a secure territory within 3 spaces of an enemy industrial complex.

    Look at the map and this technology is very impractical for almost every power. Of the 9 powers it sucks the least for Germany. But even for Germany they can usually only hit London and probably only 1 of the Russian complexes.

    So in the best case scenario is spend 30ipc upfront to hope to take away 7ipc from your opponent next turn and every turn thereafter. But remember if you spent 30ipc on bombers or other units your opponent would have to deal with them for every turn thereafter as well.


  • TripleA

    Paratroopers – the bestest and super most fun idea. but the worst of the 12 techs. Can someone actually find a way to take advantage of this rule laden technology? Here are the steps

    1 you must control a territory within 3 spaces of your target
    2 you must have or build an airbase
    3 you must get 2infantry to that airbase
    4 you must position other non paratrooper land units to also get to your target

    There is no power that can take advantage of this technology.


  • TripleA

    Increased factory production – your economies of scale now let you produce 1 or 2(minor or major) more units per factory and your labourers have found an ingenious way of repairing bombed factories for half the cost.

    But for 30ipc you could just build a new major complex that lets you build 10 more units and probably closer to the front.  In G40 we have factories that have built in aaguns, interceptors, and a larger map all making bombing factories rare so being able to repair at half the cost is not a big benefit.


  • TripleA

    War bonds – I guess this is why it is no longer called technology. Spend 30ipc now to get 3.5ipc per turn in perpetuity. Yikes that’s an awful investment


  • TripleA

    Improved mechanized infantry – your researchers found that…. well  your mechs now get 1 extra attack pip. But you have to have a tank to get that benefit and you lose the benefit of any artillery. for 30ipc you could just buy 6 more mech and 1 tank that would get you 9 more attack pips, 15 more defence pips and 7 more units that can soak up hits.


  • TripleA

    Super subs – your researchers have found that putting a snorkel on your diesel  U-boats allows you to submerge with the engines running so you can be extra sneaky and you get 1 more attack pip. for 30ipc you could just buy 5 more subs that would get you 10 more attack pips, 5 more defence pips and 5 more units that can soak up hits.


  • TripleA

    Jet fighters -  your engineers have found that compressing air then combusting it allows your planes to fly faster. For this you get 1 extra attack pip. for 30ipc you could just buy 3 more propeller fighters that would get you 9 more attack pips, 12 more defence pips and 3 more units that can soak up hits.


  • TripleA

    Improved shipyards -  so your seamen found a way to get their units into action at a low cost. If you buy 10 battleships you can save 30ipc!!! Or you can just not spend the 30ipc on the tech in the first place.


  • TripleA

    Radar – your electronic engineers have probably turned the war in your favour by using RAdio Detection And Ranging. so your aaguns get 1 extra defensive pip.

    This tech is to protect ground units. The best protection for ground units is more ground units so you could buy 10 more infantry. However this is hard to rationalize because if your opponent sends 18 or more air units into an attack that has radar defence then your opponent has lost as much ipc as you have spent to acquire it.

    I think it is a waste of money but not as bad as most techs. (it is kind of funny how this tech that was the runt of the tech litter in previous games is one of the better ones now)


  • TripleA

    Long range aircraft -  engineers have crafted a more lightweight, aerodynamic, fuel efficient plane. So you can now move 1 extra movement point. Well this tech can be very useful if you have lots of planes. This tech depending on the power and game situation might be worth the investment. Too bad you only have a 1 in 6 chance of getting it.


  • TripleA

    Heavy bombers – the Royal Air Force has the Lancaster with bomb bays big enough to fit blockbuster  bombs and the usa is not hesitating to drop nuclear bombs. So you can now roll 3dice wait 2 dice wait pick the best of 2 dice!!!

    Bombers normally hit 67% of the time now they hit 89% of the time. That is the equivalent of 1.3 extra attack pips. for 30ipc you could just buy 2.5 bombers that would get you 10 more attack pips, 2.5 more defence pips and 2.5 more units that can soak up hits.


  • 2015 Official Answers '11 '10 Moderator

    Hmmmmmmm……  I rolled 1 tech die with my Axis powers for 4 consecutive turns and hit a 6 every single time.  (This game is in the play boardgames section and is at G5, I believe)

    At round 3, I have radar and war bonds for Germany (totally awesome).  The war bonds will get me about 70 IPC’s in 20 rounds.  They cost me 5 IPC’s.

    I have heavy bombers with Japan and Italy.  Cost to each - 5 IPC’s.

    You can’t win if you don’t play.  It’s a lottery.  If you don’t buy a lottery ticket you can’t win.  If you play the lottery regularly, you will almost certainly lose money over time.  But you also have that small chance of hitting the jackpot.

    You don’t want to take risks with buying tech?  Your point is taken.  But when I roll a tech die each turn and hit LRA or radar, etc. you won’t be happy.  But it’s not my problem - I’m playing according to the rules.  😄

    And your logic is flawed.  A tech does not cost 30 IPC’s, it costs 5 to have a 1/6 chance of hitting a tech.  I understand that on average it will cost you 30 IPC’s per tech (and that’s only if you buy 1 at a time).  But you’re forgetting something else.  You (my opponent) are counting on my stack of subs in my fleet attacking at 2 and my fighters at 3 and my bombers at 4.  If I spend 20 IPC’s on research for an approx. 50-55% chance of getting a tech, and I then have a 50% chance of Super subs, jets, long range air, or heavy bombers, that may be just the boost I need to annihilate your fleet.  So you are forgetting the “surprise factor”.  Tech improvements take place immediately, but your new units that you are buying take time to be created, then deployed, then moved into position.  Tech takes place to all units (Jets, subs, bombers, etc) all over the board and can immediately pummel your opponent.  This is but one of the aspects you are completely ignoring in your analysis.

    Also, you are biased in trying to make your point.  Don’t look at the 15% discount on battleships (for improved shipyards), look at the 18.75% discount on carriers or the 16.7% discount on subs.

    Respectfully,
    Gamer


  • 2015 Official Answers '11 '10 Moderator

    @allweneedislove:

    Jet fighters -  your engineers have found that compressing air then combusting it allows your planes to fly faster. For this you get 1 extra attack pip. for 30ipc you could just buy 3 more propeller fighters that would get you 9 more attack pips, 12 more defence pips and 3 more units that can soak up hits.

    Logic is FLAWED.

    How about Japan?  Have 20 fighters (or could have more) = 20 more pips, and again, all the fighters are already deployed and many are presumably in a position to attack the next round.  Your 3 new propellor fighters have to be purchased, then placed, then moved into position (which could take a couple more rounds, in some cases).

    PLUS - your opponent is NOT EXPECTING this sudden boost in power.



  • Allweneedislove, I agree with the mathematics that you posted and I hardly use tech myself but this point can’t be dismissed:

    @gamerman01:

    PLUS - your opponent is NOT EXPECTING this sudden boost in power.

    Technology above all creates opportunities, since it is activated immediately. And it might not change the strategic situation but in some cases it just might completely change the dynamics on a region.



  • Tech is fun.  That’s the point.  Like playing the lottery.  And I recall it is an OPTIONAL rule?



  • @MaherC:

    Tech is fun.

    Some disagree, me included  😉



  • so don’t use it?



  • @allweneedislove:

    Paratroopers – the bestest and super most fun idea. but the worst of the 12 techs. Can someone actually find a way to take advantage of this rule laden technology? Here are the steps

    1 you must control a territory within 3 spaces of your target
    2 you must have or build an airbase
    3 you must get 2infantry to that airbase
    4 you must position other non paratrooper land units to also get to your target

    There is no power that can take advantage of this technology.

    I think you need to reconsider this statement. If you look at the map this is the most useful technology in the game. With Germany u can use France to help Sealion, West Germany to reinforce Russian advance, and if you build an airbase in Germany, Romania with a minor IC, or both it can help crush Russia by beefing up your stacks with 4-6 inf a round. Not to mention you will crush Allied landings in most of Europe as long as you have a force in France to respond with.
    With England you can harass Germany everywhere in the Atlantic. With the US, after crushing Southern Italy you can take the Baltic States and practically assure the fall of France. Russia can use it to help counterattack Germany/get troops to China to face a rowdy Japan. I think the only powers to which it is useless are Japan, ANZAC, China, and France



  • @paratroopers for sea lion

    you realize that for the cost of researching paratroopers you could just buy a transport?  and it doesn’t have a 1/6 shot of being AA’d.



  • Well a transport cost 7IPC and must be defended by a fleet or else it gets sunk forever. My point was additional support for Sealion. Why are you so testy MaherC?



  • if you are going to sea lion, then you already have a navy full of transports and some protection, yes?

    5 IPC spent gives you a 1/6 shot at getting a tech token, and then you have a 1/6 shot at getting paratroopers.    I’d spend 7IPCs on a sure thing v. 5IPCs on a 1/36 chance.

    or are you suggesting that you will sea lion w/only paratroopers?

    stop reading into things on the internet.  wasn’t being testy, merely proposing a counter-point to yours.



  • Point taken. I personally would not attempt Sea Lion without rolling paratroopers on G1. On a separate note, I think people would not misunderstand you as much if you phrased your responses less tersely/aggressively.



  • Yes, but you all forget what Caspian Sub called Tech Power Projection. Sure, you can buy 1 Transport cheaper than a paratrooper, but your paratroopers may be closer to the front line than the transports.


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