UK Minor IC in West India



  • I’ve been thinking about the split income issue for the UK, and I think that the most expedient way around this rule–and keep Calcutta in the game–is to build a minor IC in West India.

    This will allow the UK player to syphon funds from the Europe board and put them directly where they’ll no doubt be dearly needed: to keep Japan at bay.

    Additionally, it’ll be a safer location than Cairo to build reinforcements for the North African front… the Italians can’t sail through the Suez.

    On the other hand, if the Japanese let the heat up, rolling through Persia gets the UK a couple of free infantry and 2 IPCs to boot, and if they’re quick enough they can deny Iraq to the Italians for 2 more IPCs. All of this income will go back to the European economy, so the minor IC might well pay for itself in time.

    Can anyone see any downside, or will this become a standard play?

    (Just to pre-empt the predictable, I’m not taking the much-touted ‘Sea Lion’ all that seriously, what with Germany’s 1 big starting transport and the ability of the UK to plop downs lots of infantry in response to further transport purchases by the Axis.)



  • If you can spare 12 IPC UK1 it might be a good build.



  • I think it all depends on what Germany does in her first turn.

    But yes, a West India Minor IC seems like a pretty good idea, one that I’ve considered since seeing the Europe map and learning that UK would have split income.

    I’m also skeptical about sealion but from what I’ve read about those who have played the game already it would seem that the British lose most of their fleet and have their hands full in Egypt.

    On the Pacific side I wonder how much India has to worry about a J1 attack on UK/ANZAK/US.  I would think that the AAP40 strategies for Japan can probably be thrown out of the window and all new ones will need to be tried.

    Is it August 24th yet?



  • @Seven_Patch:

    I would think that the AAP40 strategies for Japan can probably be thrown out of the window and all new ones will need to be tried.

    Would you care to elaborate?

    Obviously adding Russia in global makes a big difference, but what else are you referring to?



  • @Koningstiger:

    @Seven_Patch:

    I would think that the AAP40 strategies for Japan can probably be thrown out of the window and all new ones will need to be tried.

    Would you care to elaborate?

    Obviously adding Russia in global makes a big difference, but what else are you referring to?

    Well right now J3 India crush seems to be the dominate AAP1940 strategy, but in Global the Pacific will need to be rethought.  Here’s why?

    The presence of USSR means you can’t total denude Manchuria and Korea of defenses…so less going to India/China.

    The German player will probably be begging the Japanese not to go to war to keep the US neutral as long as possible.

    US makes more money while neutral in AAG than in AAP and could start off stronger

    If you don’t attack J1 (Germans and Italians don’t wont you to attack) then the U.K navy will survive, U.K. economy can get stronger adding the DEI, and ANZAC probably gets both there NOs for a few turns and will start off stronger.



  • @Koningstiger:

    @Seven_Patch:

    I would think that the AAP40 strategies for Japan can probably be thrown out of the window and all new ones will need to be tried.

    Would you care to elaborate?

    Obviously adding Russia in global makes a big difference, but what else are you referring to?

    Yes, Russia’s 18 Infantry mean that Japan has to keep Infantry on their northorn border and can’t march those guys into China, or torwards a quick attack on India.  Japan now has to buy some Infantry.

    Another big difference is that the US now gets 52 IPC instead of 17.  The Interesting thing about this is that Japan has to plan some kind of attack on the US to try and take out some US unit IPC value.  Once at war with the US, the US IPC jumps to 82 IPC.  So it’s not as clear when to strike as Japan as it was before.

    One thing is for sure, Japan needs to find IPC somewhere and can’t let India collect Dutch island IPC.  Perhaps Japan is likely to attack on J2, give Germany some time to operate before awaking the sleeping giant.

    Personally I think Japan is going to be a lot more difficult to win with in Global compared to how easy it was with Pacific.



  • It is a really good idea, I remember someone else mentioned beforehand when we got a preview of the map from birds eye. It also will make it seem better too to represent India’s large population.



  • It obviously depends on what Jap does. If you really think about it you will already know if Jap attacked J1 or not by time its UK’s turn. If they didn’t then you may not need to spend $ on an IC for W India, because you haven’t lost your Indian fleet. You will have more $ rolling in (DEI etc) so you may not need a back up plan. UK (London) is going to have a hard time feeding the IC’s it already has (will be loosing tt). If Jap still does do a J1 attack then you do what you have to, as they will be gunning for India. If Jap forgoes a J1 attack, then they could be poised for a J2 attack, but that should give you time to react, or reinforce India through other means. I agree that W India is probably a safer place to build an IC then Egypt as far as Italy is concerned, but a W India IC could be a stepping stone for a combined Jap/Italy attack on E India. Can UK protect them both and see to her other needs?

    One thing for sure is w/the new major IC become a minor IC when switching hands rule, you won’t be trading India. W/o that rule in a J1 attack (followed by a J3 India crush), the UK could have just vacated E India (or left it weak) and set up a counter attack from W India. In that situation the UK (India) wouldn’t have much $ to hand over, but surly won’t want to loose its 10 unit production center. I really like that rule.



  • @Seven_Patch:

    Yes, Russia’s 18 Infantry mean that Japan has to keep Infantry on their northorn border and can’t march those guys into China, or torwards a quick attack on India.  Japan now has to buy some Infantry.

    Another big difference is that the US now gets 52 IPC instead of 17.  The Interesting thing about this is that Japan has to plan some kind of attack on the US to try and take out some US unit IPC value.  Once at war with the US, the US IPC jumps to 82 IPC.  So it’s not as clear when to strike as Japan as it was before.

    One thing is for sure, Japan needs to find IPC somewhere and can’t let India collect Dutch island IPC.  Perhaps Japan is likely to attack on J2, give Germany some time to operate before awaking the sleeping giant.

    Personally I think Japan is going to be a lot more difficult to win with in Global compared to how easy it was with Pacific.

    I agree that the Japanese will far more challenged and interesting to play in the Global game.  I also think that J2 will be the appropriate attack turn (though J3 would not surprise me).

    A couple additional thoughts:

    • I agree that Japan will want to attack “for value” against the US navy.  With a J1 attack, the US first build money of 52IPCs will be similar to the “Immediate 40 NO” solution that people have been advocating in AAP40 alone, if they choose to devote all the first turn money to the Pacific front.  If a later attack is planned, then that US will be potentially building up navy each turn.  They have three options, turtle on the west coast, spread the pacific to threaten counter attack and spread the Japanese, or turtle on the east coast (planning to come through Panama).  I think the last will be foolish, as you will be exposed to an invasion of the west coast.  The first will leave you exposed to a pearl harbor type attack, neutralizing the navy.  I actually think that the best US strategy will be to try to have enough of a fleet on the coast to stymie an invasion and then get one or two other fleets out into the pacific with screening forces.  That could give the Japanese player some serious headaches.

    • I think that a first turn complex in West India actually won’t be that useful.  Against a J1 attack and J3 India crush, you build the IC on UK1, build three tanks on UK2, and then India still falls before UK3.  You can take it back on UK3, probably, but will almost certainly lose both territories to the followup, while having less than half your income to fight Germany and Italy.  Conversely, if Japan waits for a J2 or J3 DOW, India will have a much higher income and force level and will be much better suited to defend itself.  Meanwhile UK can decide on turn 2 or turn 3 whether to build a complex, having a much better picture of what the state of Europe and the Atlantic are.  Also, UK’s income will probably not be much higher than 35 for the first few turns (with NO)



  • @purplebaron:

    I think that a first turn complex in West India actually won’t be that useful.  Against a J1 attack and J3 India crush, you build the IC on UK1, build three tanks on UK2, and then India still falls before UK3.  You can take it back on UK3, probably, but will almost certainly lose both territories to the followup, while having less than half your income to fight Germany and Italy.  Conversely, if Japan waits for a J2 or J3 DOW, India will have a much higher income and force level and will be much better suited to defend itself.  Meanwhile UK can decide on turn 2 or turn 3 whether to build a complex, having a much better picture of what the state of Europe and the Atlantic are.  Also, UK’s income will probably not be much higher than 35 for the first few turns (with NO)

    Yea you right on that. It would be better (quicker) for UK to just bring in reinforcements from Egypt or S Africa if India is threatened.



  • so japan plays before UK, right?
    so UK1: builds IC
    UK2 builds troop there
    and between UK2 and 3, the india IC falls…

    i prefer that IC on egypt that way, together with taranto raid.



  • @Frontovik:

    so japan plays before UK, right?
    so UK1: builds IC
    UK2 builds troop there
    and between UK2 and 3, the india IC falls…

    i prefer that IC on egypt that way, together with taranto raid.

    Can’t Italy take Egypt on I2?



  • @calvinhobbesliker:

    @Frontovik:

    so japan plays before UK, right?
    so UK1: builds IC
    UK2 builds troop there
    and between UK2 and 3, the india IC falls…

    i prefer that IC on egypt that way, together with taranto raid.

    Can’t Italy take Egypt on I2?

    Africa looks like a fair fight.



  • Depending on what you do, Italy could attack you in Egypt and take it or cry and beg.

    In Africa, Italy has: 6 inf, 2 mech, 1 art, 1 tank. And 3 inf in Ethiopia and Somalia.
    Uk has 3 inf, 2 art, 1 tank, 1 fighter, and 1 inf in Sudan. And 1 ANZAC inf!

    If you build no IC and wait for the Italians to come, turtling in Egypt proper, their african forces may break you (10@1 2@2 1@3 and probably their fighters, against 7@2 1@3 1@4). If they do not, there is no problem, because they could ship troops in your face while bombing you from the sea too. The british african army is dead if left alone.

    But they can buy time. You can give them Alexandria while trying to kill the Ethipian forces with your transport. You can especially try to destroy part of their fleet and one of their transport. Even if you lose your own mediterranean fleet and your egyptian fighter doing it, Italy will be crippled. You’ll win at least 2 turns as they’ll need more time to prepare. And as you can buy time, you should buy an IC in Egypt too, so you could defend it and make sure the Italians never become anything close too an important power in that game.

    The Global game will be much more than one Pacific and one Europe game side by side. Japan must not attack J1 if it wants its allies to live. UK then has a chance to make money in Pacific for at least 1 turn, and this means that an India crush strategy will probably not work. At least not by turn 3. This also means that you could maybe spare 1 or 2 planes from India to Egypt, where they would completely change the balance of power.

    I would then do not even consider constructing an IC in West India. Ab IC in Egypt and some troops shifting between Suez and Calcutta should do just fine.



  • @BasileII:

    Depending on what you do, Italy could attack you in Egypt and take it or cry and beg.

    In Africa, Italy has: 6 inf, 2 mech, 1 art, 1 tank. And 3 inf in Ethiopia and Somalia.
    Uk has 3 inf, 2 art, 1 tank, 1 fighter, and 1 inf in Sudan. And 1 ANZAC inf!

    If you build no IC and wait for the Italians to come, turtling in Egypt proper, their african forces may break you (10@1 2@2 1@3 and probably their fighters, against 7@2 1@3 1@4). If they do not, there is no problem, because they could ship troops in your face while bombing you from the sea too. The british african army is dead if left alone.

    But they can buy time. You can give them Alexandria while trying to kill the Ethipian forces with your transport. You can especially try to destroy part of their fleet and one of their transport. Even if you lose your own mediterranean fleet and your egyptian fighter doing it, Italy will be crippled. You’ll win at least 2 turns as they’ll need more time to prepare. And as you can buy time, you should buy an IC in Egypt too, so you could defend it and make sure the Italians never become anything close too an important power in that game.

    The Global game will be much more than one Pacific and one Europe game side by side. Japan must not attack J1 if it wants its allies to live. UK then has a chance to make money in Pacific for at least 1 turn, and this means that an India crush strategy will probably not work. At least not by turn 3. This also means that you could maybe spare 1 or 2 planes from India to Egypt, where they would completely change the balance of power.

    I would then do not even consider constructing an IC in West India. Ab IC in Egypt and some troops shifting between Suez and Calcutta should do just fine.

    Let’s just see

    6 Infantry 1 Non Supported Mech
    Rolling 7d6:
    (1, 4, 4, 4, 5, 6, 6)  
    Supported Mech and Artillery
    Rolling 2d6:
    (2, 6)  
    1 Tank
    Rolling 1d6:
    (6)

    Italy can also get 2 fighters.

    4 Infantry (1 ANZAC)
    Rolling 4d6:
    (1, 2, 4, 5)  
    2 Artillery
    Rolling 2d6:
    (3, 4)  
    1 Tank
    Rolling 1d6:
    (6)  
    1 Fighter
    Rolling 1d6:
    (6)

    UK might get more if you move up.



  • Italy wins with 65% chance. You forgot the 3 Ethiopian inf



  • @calvinhobbesliker:

    Italy wins with 65% chance. You forgot the 3 Ethiopian inf

    But UK wins Med, looks like the Italians are stranded in Europe. Must build Minor IC in Egypt then if you take it, the only way you can win Africa with the IC in the south. Fighters will be key purchases (maybe bombers,) because you can maybe clear the Med later. Italy is going to be fun starting small with 10 IPCS, and maybe taking almost a whole continent!



  • I don’t know. I think that UK starts with plenty of places to mobilize units. It has an IC in nearly every tt that you would normally build one in other games. If I’m UK in our first game I think I will just see how to get the best use out of the 5 complexes (counted Anz) you start with. The more you build the more you have to protect. UK only has so much money, and its income is going to drop the first couple of rounds. You have to weather the storm. If you build an IC early on, it will probably cost you that IC or one of your other ones (hope its not one of your capitals). Use transports and strengthen (or rebuild) The Royal Navy, that’s what UK is best at.

    Now if we’re talking Germany, then yea your probably going to need to build an IC early on somewhere in eastern Europe so you can get more ground troops to the front. Maybe Romania so you can upgrade it to a major later if you want to, but that’s still a long way to go (4 moves w/inf).



  • @WILD:

    I don’t know. I think that UK starts with plenty of places to mobilize units. It has an IC in nearly every tt that you would normally build one in other games. If I’m UK in our first game I think I will just see how to get the best use out of the 5 complexes (counted Anz) you start with. The more you build the more you have to protect. UK only has so much money, and its income is going to drop the first couple of rounds. You have to weather the storm. If you build an IC early on, it will probably cost you that IC or one of your other ones (hope its not one of your capitals). Use transports and strengthen (or rebuild) The Royal Navy, that’s what UK is best at.

    Now if we’re talking Germany, then yea your probably going to need to build an IC early on somewhere in eastern Europe so you can get more ground troops to the front. Maybe Romania so you can upgrade it to a major later if you want to, but that’s still a long way to go (4 moves w/inf).

    Well the one in Canada is useless (unless you want more in the London area, and it’s Canadian so it’s a must need) India has it’s own money. Like just look at this

    South Africa helps fight Italy
    London helps fight Germany
    Calcutta is in it’s own little world
    Quebec is in the middle of no where
    The Australian one is going to be protected by the United States.
    Having India in it’s own world might need a Middle East IC.



  • @Dylan:

    Well the one in Canada is useless (unless you want more in the London area, and it’s Canadian so it’s a must need) India has it’s own money. Like just look at this

    This is wrong. G1 the Germans will take out the UK navy in SZ 106 with subs. You’ll want to be building a couple of destroyers in Quebec B1 to clear out German convoy disruption.


Log in to reply
 

Suggested Topics

  • 7
  • 27
  • 36
  • 4
  • 8
  • 31
  • 13
  • 10
I Will Never Grow Up Games
Axis & Allies Boardgaming Custom Painted Miniatures
Dean's Army Guys

98
Online

14.2k
Users

34.6k
Topics

1.4m
Posts