Canada House Rule

Played our first game of 1914 tonight and had a blast. Afterwards, we brainstormed some additional house rules (because gamers, I suppose), and one stuck out. Before I say this, let me note this is a very casual crowd.

Rule: A neutral minor power when attacked by one faction or the other sides with the one that did not attack it. If it is able to repel the invasion, it becomes a fully functioning member of the alliance it joined. It has IPCs, builds units, deploys them, and attacks.

Cause: Almost no reason not to attack some of these nations. Defeat means nothing- the scale of units involved means a small handful of units lost is not a true blow. The potential IPC gain outweighs the risk in all but a few instances. By making neutral powers a bigger threat, hopefully players will only attack those they deem important to a war winning strategy and not just as random acts of violence for IPC gain. This can lead to silliness with Switzerland and the Nordic countries along with Spain among others.

Mechanics: New factions get 6/8 IPCs plus whatever IPC total is on their territories. From this point we had some disagreement:
1- They are a fully active faction with no restrictions.
2- They can only attack the faction that attacked them and their territories.
3- They can only counter attack into the territories that the attack against them was launched

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I posted this in the 1914 forum, then I saw the House Rules forum.  I believe that is the forum suited for the idea. I would message the mods to move this thread but their profiles indicate they’ve been gone for a while. I apologize for my faux paus.

1942.2 SBR Black Elk hypothesis

Strategic Bomber
Attack 0
Damage 1D6, 1D6+2
Cost 5

Fighter
Attack 1
Defense 2
Cost 10

Break even point StB A0 C5, 1D6+2 damage vs Fg A1 D2:  21 StBs vs 30 Fgs: 0.700 StB/Fg
1StB D6+2 vs 1Fg D2: + 3.056 - 2.222= + 0.834 IPC damage/SBR12= +10.008
1StB D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: +2.037 - 3.148 = -1.111 IPC damage/SBR9= -9.999 (Diff.: +0.009)
21 StB vs 30 Fgs:   0.700 StB/Fg
No FIT (Fighter Interception Threshold), always beneficial to Intercept.

Break even point StB A0 C5, 1D6 damage vs Fg A1 D2: 17 StBs vs 15 Fgs: 1.133 StBs/Fg
1 StB D6  vs 1Fg D2: + 1.944 - 2.222 = -0.278 IPC damage/SBR13 = -3.614
2 StBs D6 vs 1Fg D2: +4.861 - 3.056= +1.805 IPCs damage/SBR2= +3.610 (Diff.: -0.004)
17 StBs vs 15 Fgs: 1.133 StBs/Fgs
No FIT (Fighter Interception Threshold), always beneficial to Intercept.

Down below here is a different values doing SBR for 1942.2 and G40

Strategic Bomber in air-to-air combat SBR:
Attack 0
Bombard IC damage: D6 or 1D6+2

Fighter in air-to-air combat SBR:
Attack 1
Defend 2

IC’s AAA: @1 against each Strategic Bomber

1942.2 SBR HRules with StB A0 and Fg A1 D1 : damage 1D6 or 1D6+2

1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor

AAA roll = odds casualties

5/6 StB survived * 5.5 IPCs = +4.583 IPCs *3.5= +2.917
1/6 StB killed *5 IPCs = -0.833 IPCs

D6: +2.917-0.833= +2.084 IPCs
D6+2: + 4.583 - 0.833 = +3.750 IPCs damage/SBR

1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2

Interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

2/66/6 = 12/36 1 StB killed by Fg
4/61/6 = 4/36 1 StB killed by AAA
4/6*5/6 = 20/36 No casualty at all.

Results:
Bombard on IC 20/36* ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 3.056 IPCs *3.5=+1.944
StB killed 16/36 *-5 IPCs = - 2.222 IPCs
1D6 vs 1D2: + 1.944 - 2.222 = -0.278
1D6+2 vs 1D2: + 3.056 - 2.222= + 0.834 IPC damage/SBR

D6 vs Fg D1: + 2.431 - 1.528 = +0.903
D6+2 vs Fg D1: + 3.819 - 1.528= + 2.291 IPC damage/SBR

1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Interceptors Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

20/366/6 = 120/216 1 StB killed by Fg
16/361/6 = 16/216 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*5/6 = 80/216 No casualty at all.

Results:
Bombard on IC 80/216* ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = +2.037 IPCs *3.5= +1.296
StB killed 136/216 *- 5 IPCs = -3.148 IPCs
D6 vs D2: +1.296 - 3.148 =-1.852 IPCs
D6+2 vs D2: +2.037 - 3.148 = -1.111 IPC damage/SBR

D6 vs Fg D1: + 2.025 - 2.106 = -0.081 IPCs
D6+2 vs Fg D1 : + 3.183 - 2.106 = +1.077 IPC damage/SBR

1 Fighter Att 1 and 1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Fighter roll/interceptors Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

1/64/366/6 = 24/1296 1 Fg and 1 StB killed by Fgs vs 1 Fg
1/616/361/6= 16/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/616/365/6= 80/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg vs 1 Fg
1/616/361/6 = 16/1296 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/616/365/6 = 80/1296 No casualty vs 1 Fg

5/64/366/6 = 120/1296 1 Fg and 1 StB killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/616/361/6 = 80/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/616/365/6= 400/1296 1 Fg killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/616/361/6 = 80/1296 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/616/365/6 = 400/1296 no casualty at all

Results:
Bombard on IC: 960/1296 * ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 4.074 IPCs 3.5= +2.593
Killing 1 Fg: 216/1296 +10 IPCs = + 1.667 IPCs
Fg killed: 480/1296-10 IPCs = - 3.704 IPCs
StB killed: 96/1296 -5 IPCs = - 0.370 IPCs
StB & Fg killed: 240/1296* -15 IPCs = - 2.778 IPCs

D6 vs 2Fgs D2: +4.260 - 6.852 = -2.592 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: + 5.741 - 6.852 = -1.111 IPCs damage/SBR

D6 vs D1: +4.503 - 1.690 = +2.813 IPCs
D6+2 vs D1: + 6.123 - 1.690 = + 4.433 IPCs damage/SBR

1 Fighter Att 1 and 1 Strategic Bomber Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2
Fighter escort taking the casualty.
Fighter roll/interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

1/62/61/6= 2/216 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/62/65/6= 10/216 1 Fg killed by Fg vs 1 Fg
1/64/61/6 = 4/216 1 StB killed by AAA vs 1 Fg
1/64/65/6 = 20/216 No casualty vs 1 Fg

5/62/61/6 = 10/216 1 Fg killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/62/65/6 = 50/216 1 Fg killed by Fg vs no casualty
5/64/61/6 = 20/216 1 StB killed by AAA vs no casualty
5/64/65/6 = 100/216 no casualty at all

Results:
Bombard on IC: 180/216 * ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 4.583 IPCs 3.5= +2.917
Killing 1 Fg: 36/216 +10 IPCs = + 1.667 IPCs
Fg killed:60/216-10 IPCs = -2.778 IPCs
StB killed: 24/216 -5 IPCs = - 0.555 IPCs
StB & Fg killed: 12/216* -15 IPCs = -0.833 IPC

1Fg A1 1StB D6 vs 1 Fg D2: +4.583 - 4.166 = +0.418 IPCs
1Fg A1 1StB D6+2 vs 1 Fg D2: + 6.250 - 4.166 = + 2.084 IPCs damage/SBR

1Fg A1 1StB D6: +2.500 - 1.111 = +1.389 IPCs
1Fg A1 1StB D6+2: + 6.250 - 1.111 = + 5.139 IPCs damage/SBR

2 Strategic Bombers Att 0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors Def 2

Interceptor Fgs roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

4/3636/36= 144/1296 2 StBs killed by Fgs
16/366/36 = 96/1296 1 StB killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*30/36= 480/1296 1 StB killed by Fg

16/361/36 = 16/1296 2 StBs killed by AAA
16/3610/36 = 160/1296 1 StB killed by AAA
16/36*25/36 = 400/1296 No casualty at all.

Results:
2x Bombard on IC 400/1296* ((2+4)+(12+4) IPCs)/2= +11 IPCs) = +3.395 IPCs 7=+2.160
1x Bombard on IC 640/1296 ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 2.716 IPCs 3.5=+1.728
2 StBs killed 256/1296 -10 IPCs = -1.975 IPCs
1 StB killed 640/1296* -5 IPCs = -2.469 IPCs
D6 vs 2 Fgs D2: +3.888 - 4.444 =-0.556 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D2: +6.111 - 4.444 = +1.667 IPCs damage/SBR

D6 vs 2 Fgs D1: +4.863 - 3.056 = +1.807 IPCs
D6+2 vs 2Fgs D1: + 7.639 - 3.056 = + 4.583 IPCs damage/SBR

2 Strategic Bombers Att 0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor Def 2

Interceptor Fg roll/ AAA roll = odds casualties

2/66/36 = 12/216 1 StB killed by Fg and 1 StB killed by AAA
2/630/36= 60/216 1 StB killed by Fg
4/61/36 = 4/216 2 StBs killed by AAA
4/610/36 = 40/216 1 StB killed by AAA
4/6*25/36 = 100/216 No casualty at all.

Results:
2x Bombard on IC 100/216* ((2+4)+(12+4) IPCs)/2= +11 IPCs) = +5.093 IPCs 7=+3.241
1x Bombard on IC 100/216 ((1+2)+(6+2) IPCs)/2= +5.5 IPCs) = + 2.546 IPCs 3.5=+1.620
2 StBs killed 16/216 -10 IPCs = -0.741 IPC
1 StB killed 100/216* -5 IPCs = -2.315 IPCs

2 StBs D6 vs 1 Fg D2: +4.861 - 3.056= +1.805 IPCs
2 StBs D6+2 vs 1 Fg D2: +7.639 - 3.056 = +4.583 IPCs damage/SBR

2 StBs D6 vs 1 Fg D1: +5.347 - 2.361= +2.986 IPCs
2 StBs D6+2 vs 1 Fg D1: +8.403 - 2.361 = +6.042 IPCs damage/SBR

@Baron:

Summary:
StB A0 C12 vs Fg A1 C10
1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor
D6+2: + 4.583 - 2 = +2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: +2.917-2= 0.917 IPCs

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 3.819 - 3.667 = + 0.152 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: + 2.431 - 3.667 = -1.236

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 3.183 - 5.056 = - 1.873 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: + 2.025 - 5.056 = -3.031 IPCs

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 6.123 - 5.334 = + 0.789 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: +4.503 - 5.334 = -0.831 IPCs

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1
D6+2: + 7.639 - 7.334 = + 0.305 IPC damage/SBR run
D6: +4.863 - 7.334= -2.471 IPCs

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 6.250 - 3.667 = + 2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run
D6: +2.500 - 3.667 = -1.167 IPCs

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1
D6+2: + 8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/SBR
D6: + 5.347 -5.666= -0.319 IPCs

Comparison of this HR with Triple A SBR for 1942.2

1942.2 SBR HRules with StB A0 and Fg A1 D1 : damage 1D6+2   Triple A SBR for 1942.2: damage 1D6

1 Strategic Bomber doing SBR against no interceptor             1 StB doing SBR without interceptor
Sum: + 4.583 - 2 = +2.583 IPCs damage/SBR run                Sum: +2.917 - 2 = +0.917 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1     1 StB A1 against 1 Fg D1
Sum: + 3.819 - 3.667 = + 0.152 IPC. damage/SBR run        Sum: +3.69 - 3.667 = + 0.023 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1       1 StB A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 3.183 - 5.056 = - 1.873 IPC. damage/SBR run              Sum: + 2.025 - 5.056 = - 3.031 IPCs damage/SBR run

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1       1 StB & 1 Fg A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 6.123 - 5.334 = + 0.789 IPC damage/SBR run              Sum: +6.155 - 5.33 = + 0.825 IPC damage/SBR run

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 2 interceptors D1         2 StBs A1 doing SBR against 2 intercepting Fgs D1
Sum: + 7.639 - 7.334 = + 0.305 IPCs damage/SBR run              Sum: +8.195 - 7.334 = + 0.861 IPC damage/SBR run

1 Fighter A1 and 1 Strategic Bomber A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1       1 StB & 1 Fg A1 doing SBR against 1 intercepting Fg D1
Sum: + 6.250 - 3.667 = + 2.583 IPC damage/SBR run         Sum: + 5.973 - 3.667 = + 2.306 IPCs damage/SBR run

2 Strategic Bombers A0 doing SBR against 1 interceptor D1         2 StBs A1 doing SBR against 1 intercepting Fg D1
Sum: + 8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/SBR run         Sum: +8.403 - 5.666 = + 2.737 IPCs damage/StB

Hi all,

Been a long time reader on the boards, but this is my first time posting! Been an avid AA player and history buff for a long time. Sorry to post here at such a later date, but I wanted to get an opinion.

My take on adding Canada to the game without too much drastic effects on the playability involved a couple of moving parts.

Give Canada the 7 ipc income of the Canadian territories to spend each turn, but that same ipc value still counts towards the UK as well, with the UK also able to build from IC’s there.

Do the same thing for South Africa, giving them both South Africa territories and Rhodesia for a 4 ipc total. Again, UK still controls the money as well, with UK also able to build from IC’s there.

Both Commonwealths still play as part of the UK, buy, move, combat, etc. Essentially just adding 11 ipc income.

To counter this so it’s not unfair to the Axis, do the same thing with Romania, Finland, Bulgaria, and Hungary (Slovakia-Hungary on the map of course). Those four powers would have a total of 9 ipc value between them. I figured the extra two ipc’s would have minimal effect.

Essentially all I did was add ipc’s and therefore troop numbers to the game, just forcing them to be used at their respective locales.

My only thought with this was would the immediacy of the minor Axis powers being on the front lines basically effect gameplay on the Eastern Front more so than the added Commonwealth powers would in Africa and Europe? I don’t want to hurt the USSR unfairly.

Any feedback would be great! Glad to finally post and be a part of the community!

Would Germany have much chance of sinking them with the Atlantic just a couple of SZs wide?

Give subs a first-strike capability and you may be talking, but this will not make USW worthwhile.

Bumped due to changes made to original post.

Well, the reason why I would like it a little bit better than decent is so that tech tree 1 is actually worth using. It takes a lot to convince people away from heavy bombers, jet fighters and LRA.

dakgoalie38:

check out this section of what we came up with on paratroopers and air transport.

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=7594.30

Also, damaged battleships shouldn’t be repaired until the start of the owner’s next turn.  It’s stupid that Brition can damage it, America can damage it and Russia can damage it all in the same round and it doesn’t sink when normally 2 hits kills it.