PT Boats



  • Hey everyone, I just saw a cool documentary on PT Boats during WWII, and I thought it would be cool if they were added into Axis and Allies as a new house rules unit, anyone have any ideas how these units would work or where to get the sculpts?



  • not sure bout this… maybe if its stats are  Att 1, Def 0, Move 1, Cost 3.  or if somehow you up all the other naval units to make room for this.  it should not make a SZ hostile either



  • @Keredrex:

    it should not make a SZ hostile either

    I like this idea but I think the stats should be changed somewhat due to the power brought with the the torpedo tubes and other heavy cannons machine guns and mortors issued to the boats.
    The stats I think they should have are:
    attack 2  (I think the PT boats should be able to bombard small islands, islands contained within one SZ, hitting on a 1)
    defense 0 (all though to account for speed after enemy rolls if they hit the PT boat my roll, if they hit on a 1 then they can avoid the attack, also I think on the first round of fire each PT boat may fire one anti-aircraft volley)
    move 2
    cost 3



  • @spartan:

    The stats I think they should have are:
    attack 2  (I think the PT boats should be able to bombard small islands, islands contained within one SZ, hitting on a 1)
    defense 0 (all though to account for speed after enemy rolls if they hit the PT boat my roll, if they hit on a 1 then they can avoid the attack, also I think on the first round of fire each PT boat may fire one anti-aircraft volley)
    move 2
    cost 3

    They should not be as powerful in there attack as a Sub.  Unless its an attack of 2 in the 1st cycle only.  Bombardment from such a cheap unit is too much i think.  you could spend 20 and get 2 PT boats, A Transport, 1 Inf., 1 Art. and make an amp assault getting 2 bombardments.  AA would also be Too much… you could potentially have cheap AA guns in a bunch of SZ’s. 
    You can’t always represent Actual combat abilities for every unit on the game board, because the game generalizes the various units.  for example 1 inf. probably represents a Squad or company of troops, but a fighter unit may represent 3 fighters. etc.



  • How about bombard is taken away and the Anti-air ability is changed to a tech, but I like the idea of only having an attack of 2 on opening fire, representing the element of surprise in the PT torpedo attacks.



  • I thought about that but PT boat is too small and didn’t any impact during the conflict.



  • @crusaderiv:

    I thought about that but PT boat is too small and didn’t any impact during the conflict.

    Actually the PT boat sank many larger enemy ships using stealthy torpedo attacks, it sank several destroyers and a few battleship in the pacific theater, along with causing a virtual hell for the japanese shipping lines, they also were very valuable for island defense.  IN the european theater they caused havoc in shipping but also sank many german cruisers and defended the landers and other larger bombardment ships during d-day.



  • that is true … however in the game, a naval battle its not always just about the Attack factor… its also about the defense factor, and the representation of hits. 
    You could say that when building a navy the PT boats are implied and represented by the DD on the board.  cause PT boats needed supplies and reinforcement.  A Destroyer can be a representation of a group consisting of A Destroyer and its PT Boats.
    the only problem i see in adding this unit, what would stop someone from purchasing 10  PT boats. A single PT boat should not equal a sub when considering hits taken.



  • Okay then how about that PT boats get no casualty zone, also if PT boats have no defense factor this seems to balance out



  • _that is true … however in the game, a naval battle its not always just about the Attack factor… its also about the defense factor, and the representation of hits. 
    You could say that when building a navy the PT boats are implied and represented by the DD on the board.  cause PT boats needed supplies and reinforcement.  A Destroyer can be a representation of a group consisting of A Destroyer and its PT Boats.
    the only problem i see in adding this unit, what would stop someone from purchasing 10  PT boats. A single PT boat should not equal a sub when considering hits taken. 
    Posted on: Today at 11:55:36 amPosted by: spartan solider _

    Well said…
    I prefer Escort than PT boat or E-boat (germany)



  • The scale of most A&A games would preclude the use of small units like the PT boat.  A single Destroyer in A&A represents flotillas of Destroyers and Escorts.  The UK had 82 DD (Destroyers) (http://www.naval-history.net/WW2CampaignsStartEurope.htm) in and around the UK in 1939.  The 1941 set-up in AA50 calls for 2 DD and 1 BB in Europe and Atlantic to represent over 130 actual units including 4 carriers and 21 CA (give or take a few for builds and losses).  I could see the PT boat being used in localized battles such as Guadalcanal, but not on the strategic level that most AA games represent.



  • The UK had 82 DD (Destroyers) (http://www.naval-history.net/WW2CampaignsStartEurope.htm) in and around the UK in 1939.

    False….
    Royal Navy had 184 destroyer (Including torpedo boat) in august 1939.



  • @crusaderiv:

    The UK had 82 DD (Destroyers) (http://www.naval-history.net/WW2CampaignsStartEurope.htm) in and around the UK in 1939.

    False….
    Royal Navy had 184 destroyer (Including torpedo boat) in august 1939.

    May I ask what your source is?  Note that the 82 DD was in “Home Waters” only and does not include units in the Atlantic or ships not classified as DD such as Destroyer Escorts, Corvettes, Mine Sweepers and Torpedo Boats.  According to the Marshall Cavendish Illustrated Encyclopedia of World War II, (1972) p. 121, the Royal Navy had a total of 243 Destroyers and 52 Escorts in 1939. The naval-history.net site lists the DD numbers as about 140 world wide for the Royal Navy not including Commonwealth ships.  The notes under the charts on the web site indicate that these numbers do not include escorts.  The encyclopedia includes ships “built and launched”  which would include most units brought on line in 39 and 40.  The encyclopedia also lists 11 carriers (CV) for Britain, 2 for France and 1 for Germany.  The German carrier was never finished and never brought into operations.  I suspect that the difference in total numbers relates to operational (web site) versus all vessels launched.  Vessels are launched without necessary equipment installed to make the ship operational.  Hopefully this clears up any misunderstandings.


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