If the Axis won, who take Washington


  • What do you think.


  • Japan, since Germany had no significant navy


  • Why isn’t Rio De Oro not a choice?


  • @Imperious:

    Why isn’t Rio De Oro not a choice?

    Then vote for other, but I really don’t think they need one  :-)


  • Washington would never had been under threat. The only possibility would have been for the axis to fund a group within the United States.


  • @ABWorsham:

    Washington would never had been under threat. The only possibility would have been for the axis to fund a group within the United States.

    Are you sure, like even if Germany didn’t attack US, I bet Japan (if they could,) most likely would, at least of what I think.


  • @Dylan:

    @ABWorsham:

    Washington would never had been under threat. The only possibility would have been for the axis to fund a group within the United States.

    Are you sure, like even if Germany didn’t attack US, I bet Japan (if they could,) most likely would, at least of what I think.

    I don’t think so.  Japan was more concerned with building a buffer around their home island.  They didn’t seem as interested in world domination like Germany.  If Japan did have grand plans of expansion I think that would have lead them deeper into Asia not North America.


  • USA would not fall even if the axis won WW2. Germany would take most of Europe, and the neutral states during the war would be puppet states after the war. How far east Germany would stretch is hard to say, but probably not further than the Ural mountains. Japan would lose anyway, unless they did not go to war against the US.


  • If the axis held Europe, Africa, Middle East, and Asia for any duration of time it would only be a matter of time where the total resources and labor will out-build anything America can do.

    They would have significant assets to give us a two front war. South America would not offer much resistance.


  • In this scenario were the axis held every thing except the americas I think Japan and Germany would split america down the middle. After a joint assault.


  • @ABWorsham:

    Washington would never had been under threat. The only possibility would have been for the axis to fund a group within the United States.

    the Nazis did infiltrate the U.S even before the war started and was not less succesful with it as well…Kuntz I think was his name and he cheered the Americans up to join the Axis…when Hitler made the call Heim ins Reich many followed!..


  • @Dylan:

    @ABWorsham:

    Washington would never had been under threat. The only possibility would have been for the axis to fund a group within the United States.

    Are you sure, like even if Germany didn’t attack US, I bet Japan (if they could,) most likely would, at least of what I think.

    Japan did not have the man power or the land mobility to capture the U.S. The best the Japanese could do would would have been to capture a port city.
    However, if the Axis could get an armed communist revoltion, or eithnic minorities to fight a war a invasion is possible.


  • @Imperious:

    If the axis held Europe, Africa, Middle East, and Asia for any duration of time it would only be a matter of time where the total resources and labor will out-build anything America can do.

    They would have significant assets to give us a two front war. South America would not offer much resistance.

    The axis powers and especially Germany would have most of Eurasia, and then would have good odds to win the cold war, but as the real cold war never escalated between Soviet and US directly b/c of nukes, I think the US would hold it’s ground, and probably South America, although Latin America would be guerrilla territory, as different fractions would be supported by the US and Germany. But even if the Sovietunion lost the cold war b/c it was dissolved, Russia is a major European big power, and Russia has not been overrun by NATO b/c Russia has nukes. Same goes for US if Germany controlled most of Eurasia, since both Germany and US would have nukes, there would be no direct confrontation. US could even occupy South America to secure the continent and themselves, during a cold war against Germany.
    In the “second book” by Hitler, (Mein Kampf is the best known), Hitler thought that if Germany won the war, there would be a huge world war between US and Germany during 1980’s.


  • I don’t think either power could have taken Washington and it seems impossible to imagine a foreign power able to occupy the United States of America against the will of its citizens. Now if they got the bomb first they might have just tried to obliterate us.


  • IF one of them managed to take Washington, it would’ve been Japan, in my opinion. Japan was lightyears ahead of Germany on navy, as the Kriegsmarine was just plain pitiful compared to whatever the US could get up. The time to construct a navy would have put Germany far behind, and the Japs would already be on the mainland for some time before Germany got close.

  • '12

    The Axis powers would NEVER cooperate with a communist anything.  Hitler HATED communists nearly as much as he hated jews.  I doubt Japan would have been down with a philosophy where everyone was equal peasant and samuri with was no room for the emperor.

    Japan might have been able to invade Washington state if about 100 things were different.  But to trek across a few 1000 miles of territory with rather well armed and hostile natives to get to DC?  Or the other choice to launch an invasion fleet and have it sail 10,000 miles (or more?) around south america to come up on the east coast or invaded panama first to gain control of the canal to shorten the invasion fleet trip?

    The allies prepared and built up for D-Day for 2 years.  They had an unsinkable aircraft carrier 25 miles from shore about the same size as Great Britain from which to launch the invasion from.  Only with sh@* luck and the incompetence of Hitler was D-day successful.

    Japan had no technology to force a US surrender and for ‘old-school’ military…by 1943 the US was producing in a month as many machine guns as Japan produced in the entire war.

    The ONLY way the US was going to lose is if Germany got nukes first and they were NOWHERE even close to deploying a nuclear bomb.
    God I hate these text boxes, why is it that when I hit the bottom of the screen the text in the box jumps up and down when I type, friggin annoying to have to use a text editor to creat the post then copy and paste it in here…ugh!


  • MrmalachiCrunch

    I think that you are taking the question out of context.  The question wasn’t who had the resources to take the US.  I think that the US mainland was out of the scope of what Japan wanted. That simply leaves Germany as the only viable option left.

    LT

  • '12

    Ah well perhaps I did.  Assuming Hitler had been smarter a few for instances.  Put Germany’s economy on a war footing in 1938 instead of 1944.  Waited a few years before starting the war, many German planners figured 1945 would be a good start date.  A fleet of bismark class ships to escort fleet carriers along with a fleet of 100s of uboats rather than the less that 100? to start the war with.  Let’s say jet power and heavy 4 engine bombers that Germany never really had.  Now let’s say they beat England, then Russia.  No way they EVER build enough of a fleet to do an invasion anywhere in Pan-America.  They would still need atomic bombs to force a defeat.

    Even with superior resourses the allies would never have beaten Germany if not for that mutual meatgrinder called the USSR who accounted for 9 out of 10 casualties.  If Germany thought they had it rough in the USSR, imagine urban warfare in a city where every american had 2 really sweet guns.

    I wish I could remember the title of the book I read as a kid, I think it was by Arthur C. Clarke, oh I will have to google this.  The premise was a story line about 100 years past the start of WW II.  America stayed neutral, europe and asia spiraled into the stoneage, communication was lost and amrican ships would not pass certain longitude lines bisecting the pacific and atlantic oceans.  All the america’s formed a commonwealth……now to google!


  • @MrMalachiCrunch:

    I wish I could remember the title of the book I read as a kid, I think it was by Arthur C. Clarke, oh I will have to google this.  The premise was a story line about 100 years past the start of WW II.  America stayed neutral, europe and asia spiraled into the stoneage, communication was lost and amrican ships would not pass certain longitude lines bisecting the pacific and atlantic oceans.  All the america’s formed a commonwealth……now to google!

    When you find the name of the book, then please post it in the Science Fiction/Fantasy Book Forum thread below.  I really enjoy reading alternate history novels.

    http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=15842.75


  • @MrMalachiCrunch:

    Ah well perhaps I did.   Assuming Hitler had been smarter a few for instances.  Put Germany’s economy on a war footing in 1938 instead of 1944.  Waited a few years before starting the war, many German planners figured 1945 would be a good start date.  A fleet of bismark class ships to escort fleet carriers along with a fleet of 100s of uboats rather than the less that 100? to start the war with.  Let’s say jet power and heavy 4 engine bombers that Germany never really had.  Now let’s say they beat England, then Russia.  No way they EVER build enough of a fleet to do an invasion anywhere in Pan-America.  They would still need atomic bombs to force a defeat.

    You make a good point.  The only problem I see with that is according to the treaty that Germany signed and the end of WWI they were not allowed to have a standing army over a specific number of people.  They were not allowed to have air fields or ports.  At some point they wouldn’t be able to hide a force like that.

    LT

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