Why no Italy???



  • I can’t be the only person here who thinks leaving Italy out was a big mistake. Don’t get me wrong I still love the game just thought Italy would have been a big addition!! Yes Italy would have been the weakest power in the game but still they should have added it anyway.

    I am glad though about hearing all these other people comming out with rules that add Italy. Thank god for these people.



  • yeah, Italy would have been/would be a great addition to the game, but realistically, I think the game starts in 1942? Italy would actually be an ally in 1943, so they would just change over-if you wanted realism you would have to deal with that, but these games aren’t completely realistic anyway.



  • Very true on all points but one.

    The game starts in 1941 not 1942.

    Russia was invaded by Germany in 1941 on June 22nd.

    The game starts right at the invasion. But your point remains solid though by mid 1941 Italy was already showing signs of war weariness!!!
    Maybe too weak to be a true power in game, but still why not?

    It could be the newbie power for beginners to learn with.



  • thanks for the history lesson…I still have yet to use Italians in A&AE, think it’s a great idea, though.



  • Sorry if I offeneded you Grigoriy. Didn’t mean to sound like a a$$hole about the whole thing.

    I may use a Italy in my next game myself.



  • sorry if I sounded offended…how does that work when typing? oh well, if I had actually said it, I probably would have sounded more offended. :oops:



  • Understood Grigoriy.



  • Italy was a weak weak sister ally for Germany. If you’re going to add them to the game, you should go ahead and add all the German allies that took part in the invasion of Russia.
    Hungry, Romania, Austria and Croatia.
    There is nothing that Italy did during the war the didn’t require German help. Africa, Yugoslavia and even their own country. Tsk, Tsk :lol:
    They are not worthy of being a seperate entity in the game, as for as I’m concerned anyway.



  • Hi all,

    i think that if Italy was to be included, it actually should be quite powerful, though considerably weaker than Germany.

    at least the navy, if not the air force and land units. the italians actually had quite modern battle ships and destroyers at the time, so that would actually better represent the circumsatnces at the time.

    the Italians were just very poorly led and made too many strategic mistakes.

    Laters,

    Hans

    [and when it is all done and dusted was it really worth it, and did it really matter?]



  • Yes, Italy had pretty little ships that were very modern at the time, however, they spend so much building them, they forgot the tiny issue of actually arming the Navy properly.
    When Britain was running around the Med destroying the Italian navy some of the Italian ships didn’t even have ammo…. :lol:.



  • most of those problems are leadership errors.
    Germany screwed up too, but they’re still in the game!
    part of the game is figuring out what hitler or stalin or churchill or roosevelte did wrong and fixing it with your own ideas! WHY NOT MUSSOLINI!



  • most of those problems are leadership errors.
    Germany screwed up too, but they’re still in the game!
    part of the game is figuring out what hitler or stalin or churchill or roosevelte did wrong and fixing it with your own
    ideas! WHY NOT MUSSOLINI!

    It has nothing to do with “screwing up”. The fact is Italy’s contribution at this point in the war was no more than that of other German allied nations. I will admit that they do have and Navy, though. However, by 1941 the cream of it was already gone.

    There is simply no reason to have a seperate Italian nation.
    All of the “German” units on the board represent the various Axis allies at the time. If, like i said, you are going to seperate Italy, then a strong case can be made to seperate all of the Axis allies. And for that matter some of the Allied nations minor allies, like Canada.
    They made great contributions with their destroyers and corvettes. Canada had the 4 largest navy at the end of the war. And lets not forget about D-day. I mean, they had their own beach head.
    They did some of the best soldiering any one’s nation could hope for in the Netherlands. They made an impact on WW2, certainly as much so, if not more, as Italy did.



  • well lets think about that. if the thw whole Axis is made up of (for the sake of argument) 10 nations (ergo, 10 axis players) and the allies of at least 20 (ergo 20 allies players) then this could really developed into a game that a whole class room size of people can enjoy. oh dear, i better get a beer after my go then!!



  • I agree with mr ghoul. If Italy is added in, Canada might as well be in the game. Canada has no role in this game when in the real war Canada was a very helpful ally.



  • i think they left italy out because if italy was in they would probaly have to give italy historcal disadvantages, such as infantry defend at 1 because italian infantry sucked at defending, and minus 1 to all defense on ships , no offense to any italians, but the reason why todays italian warships have glass bottems is so they can see all the italian ships at the bottom. For example in one raid, the royal navy sent 20 small out of date torpedo planes(sorry i forget the name of the plane) to attack the italian fleet in i think taranto and destroyed the whole fleet with the lbritish loss of i think 2 planes (sorry if some of my facts are off, im only 16 and my memory goes really quick)alzheimers any one?



  • one more thing mr. ghoul is right, they helped alot, canadian tanks where in berlin before american and british tanks.(no russian though) if italy is there own country why not finnland or any of the danubian nations?



  • Probably because they would only have one or two territories…it would be possible, though kind of pointless. I think the primary reason to have Italy would be to balance out the game for Germany’s sake, or to make it so you could play online games. 😉


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