@Caesar:
as for the Japanese, they are not allowed two sea zones within US mainland.
Which exact sea zones are Japan actually allowed/restricted?
Just count two SZ from Alaska, Western US, and Mexico.
Does taking Spain with USA spell doom for the Axis?
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I believe the point is to sap the strength of Russia with Japan early (aka, before Germany declares war) and then finish it off with MI/Armor from Japan + Inf/Armor from Italy and ground forces from Germany (to physically take Moscow, Novgorod and Volgorod maybe Caucasus if you dont give it to Italy).
If America is landing in Spain, I can bottle them up there pretty easily or invite them to liberate Paris and shoot themselves in the foot (note: no German or Italian objectives for holding Paris, so I dont HAVE to have it, not that it hurts to have the complex and 4 IPC for having it.)
Once Russia is down, it’s a simple matter to push the Allies out of Spain again. Yes, China, India and England are free in my perspective, but now that Russia is gone (with a significant German fleet remaining and a significant Japanese one) all that equipment can turn south to India while new German units can focus on Spain and new Japanese ones can focus on the Pacific again.
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Thank you for the feedback, It will help me refine the specific plan I put together.
I’ll let you know how it turns out.
Looks like there are two or three styles to consider:
1) Conservative (especially in the east):
USA may want to focus on Japan early, then try Spain by turn 6. Specifically, I’m thinking first three productions would be needed in the Pacific, to tie in with a UK fleet and the use of an Anzac shuck to lock down Asia if that can get going by turn 7.Russia may want to cool its jets, and let Asia play out “naturally” and focus on defense since USA will be delayed. They will prepare for a round 4 assault on Turkey to do a hit and run in order to reduce that stack or prevent Italian naval passage through the straight.
2) Hyper Aggressive: Risks early loss to Axis
USA rushes Spain Earlier than round 4: This requires vacating UK on turn 1 to permit a USA DOW turn 2 after Germany seizes London.Since USA will be in war round 2, first production will be split, second will focus on Atlantic. Surrendering London does not force Germany to build as large of a navy, and Italy is not likely to be free to help as UK will have concentrated assets in Mediterranean. After 3 rounds of Atlantic, builds will begin against delaying Japan’s 6 cities.
USSR will go defensive, India and Anzac will go Land as the Med navy is messing with Italy.
USA will seize Portugal or Gibraltar first, then with second wave, move into Spain in force. If German is too prepared, stage 2 rounds in Portugal, then move larger force into Spain on third turn.
3) Moderate strategy
Spain on turn 4 as discussed, play test to see if viable, then move to 1 or 2 above to test results. -
I honestly wish that America would be moved to play before Japan, as Japan really needs to determine what their strategy is after they see what America is doing, but Larry said no go.
I see the following for Japan:
1) Russia and help Germany get 8 Victory Cities
2) Turtle and wait for Germany to get 8 Victory Cities
3) China into Russia again to help Germany get 8 Victory Cities
4) India (probably timed to coincide with Sea Lion to remove the entire British power)
5) Australia + SE Pacific
6) Kill America First (requires a major investment from Germany and a blind America) -
I’ve always wanted to fight someone who would stack in Amur and the Spain thing sounds fun too. If you want a challenge right now James, I am up for it.
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Spain just doesnt sound effective because of the moving through Turkey thing.
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Jen -
The issue I see with that kind of turn order change is that the Allies are the reactive power, not the Axis. Just like UK’s every action, particularly early game, is entirely based on what Germany does, Japan-American has the same sort of relationiship. Japan has the initiative and freedom, while America has the ability to react to their moves. It seems to me that that relationship is fundamental to the Axis-Allies dynamic. -
I’ve always wanted to fight someone who would stack in Amur and the Spain thing sounds fun too. If you want a challenge right now James, I am up for it.
I’ll give it a whirl, but I am new to forum games, so you’ll likely need some patience. I can post moves every other day I believe. Do you want to create the game, and play Germany, then I’ll see if I can load the map and post my moves as well. Abattlemap is what I have, and I believe I know how to roll dice. This way, the others can watch the play and see how to respond.
I will say, its a bit of a stretch since you know what I am planning. Probably not advisable since you will likely prepare from the get go. I’ll test this idea, but I won’t let you know if I’ll do the aggressive, conservative or moderate approach.
Oh, well, if it works after you know what I am going to do, then it has merit.
Here is a sample of the Abattlemap if I can load this right, I’ll also need to learn how to update the various boxes.
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There’s not much Axis can do in anticipation in my opinion. I’ll have Germany done tonight and PM you. I’ll need scramble orders for the attack.
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There’s not much Axis can do in anticipation in my opinion. I’ll have Germany done tonight and PM you. I’ll need scramble orders for the attack.
Well, if you send in enough to clear in one round, I won’t scramble….the only place I would might be sz 109.
If this helps, as long as there are more than 4 pieces in 110 and 111 I’ll keep my planes on land.3 or 4 I will have to consider. Also if you are hitting London to clear planes, and there is a sea battle to escape too, thats a good time to scramble as well :)
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Jen -
The issue I see with that kind of turn order change is that the Allies are the reactive power, not the Axis. Just like UK’s every action, particularly early game, is entirely based on what Germany does, Japan-American has the same sort of relationiship. Japan has the initiative and freedom, while America has the ability to react to their moves. It seems to me that that relationship is fundamental to the Axis-Allies dynamic.Agreed, in part. My thoughts were thus:
1) America would not be able to declare war until Round 4, otherwise, the turn order would screw up the balance of power as it currently stands.
2) It’s already a pain in the butt to run 5 allied nations online. (America, China, England, India (which literally is part of England, but realistically feels like a seperate power) and Australia.)
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1 - I understand that, but my original point remains valid, I think.
2 - I say this lovingly, as I feel the same way sometimes:
Suck it up, Princess. :lol: -
Nice thread James!!! :-)
I’ve thought about an Allied Spain gambit for a while. I believe if the Allies can somehow get Turkey and Spain it could work. I definitely think that Spain can’t be taken early- I think its a late game tactic when the Germans press into Russia and leave France/Italy open- Spain maybe be a necessity to stop the VC win and gain an advantage.
I think a Spain gambit is tough, but someone is gonna figure a way to pull it off in certain situations. Maybe you’ll be the one- keep thinking. :-)
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