Japan should dump all its money into Research first turn

[wodan46]

Seriously, why not?  They don’t have enough money first turn to build anything useful, but moreover, there is nothing they really need to build.  They already have 9 Fighters, 5 Transports, and a ground force poised to easily trample India/China/Siberia/Indonesia.  The thing is that while US may be a threat eventually, you don’t need to worry about immediately building units to counter them.

So, Japan should just buy 3 Researchers first turn.  This will give them about 66% chances of getting a Tech by the beginning of their second turn, whereupon they have 40-50 money to start spending on the results of that Tech.  Moreover, 3 of the Techs are basically I WIN buttons.

Jet Fighters: Your 9 Fighters become as strong as 12, you can also build a good number of them each turn.
LRA: Or as fast as Bombers
Heavy Bombers: Which you can pump out at a rate of 3 or 4 per turn.

As for the less good techs
Improved Shipyard: Still a solid tech, allow you to build large fleets
Super Subs: If you get this, just spam a large number of Subs, then sink any Destroyers or Fleets in general that come into range.  It might not stop the US, but it will probably stall them for an impressive amount of time.
Radar: This one won’t stop Fleets, but at least it will block Bombers, especially Heavy or Long Range ones.

[Perry]

ok, don’t arrive to 66% (more like 40%, right?), but still it is an interesting idea.  :-)
You can use an early tech over more number of turns, so better pay up that cash early.

I would say that it leaves you rather thin for round 2. An maybe I’d advocate two dice +1 rtl, 1 inf, but either way, would be fun to try!  :-)

[Unknown Soldier]

ok, don’t arrive to 66% (more like 40%, right?)

No, he’s correct. It’s about 66% that you will have a tech after rolling on J2 if you buy 3 tokens on J1 (and none on J2).

It’s about 42% to get one at the start of J1.

[Unknown Soldier]

Interesting idea, wodan.

The thing is, I’m not sure this would be better than the 2 trans, 1 inf buy or even a first turn IC in Manchuria. Japan needs to get boots on the ground quickly to expand its income base, and buying all tech J1 does not achieve this. You’re sacrificing speed to get a tech a turn or two earlier, a tech which may or may not be immediately useful. Its not like you can’t buy tech on J2 or J3.

[wodan46]

@Unknown:

ok, don’t arrive to 66% (more like 40%, right?)

No, he’s correct. It’s about 66% that you will have a tech after rolling on J2 if you buy 3 tokens on J1 (and none on J2).

It’s about 42% to get one at the start of J1.

J1: Buy 3 Researchers, make 3 Rolls
J2: Make 3 more Rolls if you haven’t got the Tech.  After completing those 6 Rolls, then and only then do you buy units.

@Unknown:

Interesting idea, wodan.

The thing is, I’m not sure this would be better than the 2 trans, 1 inf buy or even a first turn IC in Manchuria. Japan needs to get boots on the ground quickly to expand its income base, and buying all tech J1 does not achieve this. You’re sacrificing speed to get a tech a turn or two earlier, a tech which may or may not be immediately useful. Its not like you can’t buy tech on J2 or J3.

Japan has 5 Transports.  Why would they need more?  They’d be better off buying 3 Infantry and 2 Artillery, so that they have more stuff to land next turn.  Also, Japan already has enough ground units to take Eurasia if it is using its air support properly.  They should attack East Asia with 12 Infantry and an Artillery, and hitting Philipines, Borneo, and East Indies with 2 more Infantry apiece, of which the Borneo and East Indies drops can be transported to India or Australia the following turn, while the surviving Infantry in the Philipines can take New Guinea.

[Unknown Soldier]

Japan has 5 Transports.  Why would they need more?  They’d be better off buying 3 Infantry and 2 Artillery, so that they have more stuff to land next turn.  Also, Japan already has enough ground units to take Eurasia if it is using its air support properly.  They should attack East Asia with 12 Infantry and an Artillery, and hitting Philipines, Borneo, and East Indies with 2 more Infantry apiece, of which the Borneo and East Indies drops can be transported to India or Australia the following turn, while the surviving Infantry in the Philipines can take New Guinea.

Why do they need more? You answered your own question. They need the additional TPs because the ones they start with will be in the south pacific, not in the sea of Japan shuttling your unit purchases to asia. 5 TPs just isn’t enough to do everything quickly enough. In fact, I’ve bought an 8th TP in many games, which allows you to set up a 4x4 chain to Alaska once the south pacific TPs return home.

At the end of J1, you should have 3 inf on Japan plus either the starting artillery unit. So you drop 2 more TPs and an inf, now you can move all 5 units on Japan plus the Iwo Jima inf with the help of only 1 starting TP (which is probably in sz61). The other 4 TPs will be in use elsewhere. With an all tech buy on J1, these extra units don’t get to asia next turn, since you won’t have the capacity to move them on J2.

Buying 3 inf, 2 art on J1 would be pretty pointless, since they’d just be sitting idle on Japan doing nothing because you can’t get them into Asia for the reasons already mentioned.

[wodan46]

My presumption is that the Landers hit Burma, Kwantung, Philipines, Borneo, and East Indies.  Following turn, Borneo and East Indies Transports hit India, Burma Transport hits Italian East Africa, New Guinea, or moves to Sea Zone 61, Kwangtung and Philipines Transports shift units from Japan to mainland, possibly into Buryatia and Soviet Far East.

[Unknown Soldier]

So you’re hitting Philippines with 1 TP only??

[Perry]

@Unknown:

No, he’s correct. It’s about 66% that you will have a tech after rolling on J2 if you buy 3 tokens on J1 (and none on J2).
It’s about 42% to get one at the start of J1.

Right! I didn’t notice that Wodan was talking about beginning of Turn 2!
The idea has merit, but as you point out, it gives Japan a bit of a slow start, as for shuffling troops into Asia…

[wodan46]

@Perry:

@Unknown:

No, he’s correct. It’s about 66% that you will have a tech after rolling on J2 if you buy 3 tokens on J1 (and none on J2).
It’s about 42% to get one at the start of J1.

Right! I didn’t notice that Wodan was talking about beginning of Turn 2!
The idea has merit, but as you point out, it gives Japan a bit of a slow start, as for shuffling troops into Asia…

Excluding the guy hanging out in Solomon Islands but including the 4 units already in Transports, Japan has 15 ground units not on the mainland.  They shuffle 6 to islands(Philipines/Borneo/East Indies) and 4 to the mainland (Kwantung/Fukien).  Following turn, they shuffle the 4 guys in Borneo/East Indies to India, the surviving 1-2 Infantry on the Philipines to Buryatia SSR, and use the remaining 2 transports to shuttle 3 Infantry to either Buryatia SSR or Siberia.  That’ll just leave the guy on Solomon Islands and the guy on Iwo Jima.  So, of your starting 24 Ground units, you can get 22 of those to the mainland by the end of turn 2.

[PelierBay]

:?

industry in manch

:mrgreen:

[wodan46]

@Unknown:

So you’re hitting Philippines with 1 TP only??

You would use the Infantry/Artillery, and you’d support with either a Fighter or Cruiser (Battleship can handle Destroyer)

[Bardoly]

@wodan46:

@Unknown:

So you’re hitting Philippines with 1 TP only??

You would use the Infantry/Artillery, and you’d support with either a Fighter or Cruiser (Battleship can handle Destroyer)

If you send the 2 fighters against the Indian Ocean fleet, then you don’t have the ability to send a different fighter against the Philippines.  In an amphibious assault, the cruiser must either join in wth the naval battle, or move in during the noncombat phase.  The rules don’t allow you to split your fleet and say that 1 part is conducting the naval battle, and the other part will shore bombard.  :-(  I wish that it did.

That means, that if you only send 1 loaded transport against the Philippines, that there is a very good chance (the battle becomes about a 33% chance that you capture, 67% chance that you don’t) that you won’t take it.  This means that you don’t elliminate the US’s NO for the Philippines, and unless you either take New Guinea or the Solomons (both of which leave you open to be attacked), then you don’t get your second NO (the 4 of 6 one)

So, you probably had better send 2 transports to capture the Philippines, because IMHO, sending the 2 fighters against the Indian Ocean fleet is pretty key.