As far as Techs in game only 7 this time and Germany bought 2 tech tokens first turn and rolled 2 dice for every turn and never got a breakthur or a free tech or spy steals a tech. Epic. The game does go the normal 60 -70 % way but the 30-40 % in game can go in many different small ways. Techs, NAs, Event Cards, SBRing, Axis total income bonus for getting more territories for the 1 point bonus to win and/or The 7 Mideast oil territories for 1 point bonus too for axis.
There is more SBRing in game than ever. Everything in Europe gets bombed. India ICs get bombed and Oil Derricks get bombed.
So will see how the new tank buy max rule works. Probably slow game down a bit but now should be more Mech Art buys with maybe a plane here or there. You can still buy tanks and its that you just cant drop a bunch on a Minor IC so you need to buy most in your Capital and move.
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I came up with something I hope will boost the pacific side of map like the Atlantic side of map. Its going great with the convoy raiding campaign working out great. More small battles through most of game.
In another thread I was mentioning about raising some islands to 5 icps to make either side at least go get an island or 2 in the Pacific side but kinda didnt do that. I posted a picture in House Rules thread about showing what groups of islands to have to try and get more small battles in the Pacific without just fleets looking at each other or 1 big battle sometimes for the heck of it, and not just have Fleets move here or there or park here or there and just have Japan mostly do land battles besides going for Dutch Islands.
So I made up 6 NOs for the Pacific side. Im not a huge fan of them but saw I had no choice in the matter to see if I could add them to game on the Pacific side but make it easier to get them then the normal NO rules where you need like 5 islands to get a NO bonus.
NO 5 icp bonus
Green group for Japan or US
Grey group for Japan or US
Orange group for Japan or US
Red group for Japan or US
Blue group for Anzac
Black group for Anzac
So I have 6 groups of 3 islands that have NOs. For each 3 island group you control you receive 5 icp bonus. Now in picture below I used colored tokens to show which islands are in a group. Also I gave Midway, Carolina and Solomon islands a value of 3 icps each.
Now If you look at setup that I have in my game with Midway, Carolina, New Britain and Solomon (some say why Solomon, because naval battles ) islands have 2 different color tokens where if you control one of those islands you can deny 2 NO. So Im hoping with Japan having a chance for 2 NO at home they need to control Midway. But then the US would just need to control Midway. So now maybe there will be more small battles at that area for both sides. Most islands you can hit from 2 sz away. Neither side can not just sit now. Other wise somebody going to get some money. Same thing in Carolinas. Japan holds that they can deny some NO down there. Both countries would need to leave small fleets near home to the North and down south they both need fleets. Or Japan would need to park in Manilla and could come from there if they get pushed out of Carolinas
and still protect Dutch Islands. But then US gets more money and maybe they get it in time before Germany gets the win the axis needs. If US goes to much in Pacific then Germany going to have a field day. Or is this going to be to much for Japan to control in the Pacific szs while not getting anywhere on land. Remember in my game Axis dont need Calcutta to win if Germany gets that extra VC. I need to watch for any balance issues where maybe the US may need a ship or 2 on setup. OR I change the NA for Germany Sub Interdiction from 10 subs max to 5 subs max. This should be fun anyway on first few games.
If you look at setup Japan in the Carolinas has to decide if they want to deny Anzac there NO or attack US Line Island fleet or do both.
Anyway I hope this is a starting point on the right track for a better Pacific side. Maybe some body would like to try it in there game also.
I also added two 3 island groups in Med. Italy pretty strong so I made the UK NO a little more easier. Closer to Cairo and making Italy have to go further to get islands.
Well will see how this goes. Cant wait to try out.
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I really like this colored roundels mapping to visually understand each Islands NO group.
Each 5 IPCs NO will attract immediate interest.
IMO, you will get more actions in PTO and the additional money influx could be to built more ships in this area.
I’m pretty excited about it.
I will certainly check how I can implement a smaller variant into AA50 or 1942.2.
Thanks for this game mechanic.
@Baron:
I really like this colored roundels mapping to visually understand each Islands NO group.
Each 5 IPCs NO will attract immediate interest.
IMO, you will get more actions in PTO and the additional money influx could be to built more ships in this area.I’m pretty excited about it.
I will certainly check how I can implement a smaller variant into AA50 or 1942.2.
Thanks for this game mechanic.
Thanks Baron
I played a turn so far with it. Looks like Japan will get the 2 midway NO for the next 2 turns. I may have to make midway a 1 color token island if this becomes to much money for Japan. Can move colored tokens around to see. But when Japan left Carolinas to attack line island US fleet and take Manila Anzac is predator to get there 2nd NO and India can actually build a ship but they need to watch out for Japan trannys close.
Well at the end of T2 the US made a good move on T1 by landing 2 marines in Hawaii with there air transport plane. So on US T2 they took back Midway with Marines and a bunch of planes coming from Hawaii to take back Midway from Japan to deny Japan 2 NO for T3. So there was a battle there already. Japan may have gone to Midway to soon ? Hard to say yet. It Made US do must buys in the Pacific though on T1.
Japan also landed ground troops in Dutch New Guinea to stop Anzac from getting there second NO without at least having a ground battle there. Anzac took back Dutch New Guinea and now has 2 NO to collect 10 icps. When Japan left Carolinas it gave Anzac the chance to land ground in Papua with 3 figs.
Now Japan also has to deal with a ground attack threats from Russia China and FEC. FEC finally had the chance to build some ships because Japan had to run trannys back to main land for ground. But if US goes Pacific buys to much Ger and Italy can win the game and Japan wont need to take Calcutta.
Japan will need to park in Carolinas to deny a NO or two there or park in Manilla and nick pic an island here and there to deny a NO for the allies and US may have enough to go to Wake and get a NO there too. Will see.
Pros
Already more Island battles
Cons
Allies going to be to strong with Pacific Island NO s ?
I think Im on to some thing that may be awesome for the Pacific but will it benefit other games ? This may only work if Japan starts with enough transports in games ?
I think it will make the old Pacific game awesome with a few tweaks with all those islands on map.
Whats nice also is most Islands can be reach to counter any attacks for both sides. You may have big fleets stationed off an island for protection but then send out a small raiding fleet to capture an island. This way you dont need to take 1 or 2 of the islands that are further out in the 3 island group. This allows you to at least get the closet one and counter against any navy or forcing the other side to bring more ships to defend.
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End of T3. The US has joined up with Anzac in New Guinea and New Britian. Japan cannot attack with both fleets. Remember can only move 3 spaces from a Naval base in non combat. So is it still going to be a stalemate where both navies will just sit ?
Anzac will get Dutch New Guinea back next turn to collect 2 NOs again. Will see if Japan parks both fleets in Carolinas to force US to move. Depends. Other wise Japan fleet will retreat to Manilla and counter some island battles to deny a US NO and Anzac.
Japan can go towards Midway again and force US to go that way also and pull away US fleet from going south.
Japan probably get 2 more Dutch Islands but FIC being threaten now. But just with Anzac getting a bit of a push to an island has delayed Japan from probably getting a Dutch Island sooner. So far in this test game Japan has to make more decisions on every thing. Remember also US has spent 75 % of there money in the Pacific. I have not tested both sides yet. Just trying to see if US goes Pacific how much pressure are both sides going to with stand.
Anzac is actually a lot of fun to play now. With just collecting like 8-10 icps a turn and then getting 1 to 2 NO early in game has made them a little pain in the a$$.
Baron the figs and tacs being able to M5 has made the island battles alot better from all the airbases on islands. With fleets only being able to M2 from Naval bases in combat it keeps your fleets save at a distance but now with figs and small fleets you can have more island battles.
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Ill probably go with 1/4” colored stickers instead of chips until guys get an idea of which are the island groups.
Also if 3 islands wont work in some areas try going with only 2 island group or groups. Who knows maybe a Midway island and a Carolina island works as a 2 island group for an example.
@SS:
Baron the figs and tacs being able to M5 has made the island battles a lot better from all the airbases on islands. With fleets only being able to M2 from Naval bases in combat it keeps your fleets save at a distance but now with figs and small fleets you can have more island battles.
This combination of restriction for Naval Base and special M5, seems to enhance the usefulness of Island Airbase and land-base aircraft.
Pretty cool to make all this work in PTO so, it is not just Strategic bomber which are tactically viable but now Fig and TacBs can play a working role similar to WWII. Now Islands can be viewed as unsinkable Aircraft Carriers.
I played a few times with Cruiser and TP moving 3 SZs.
Clearly, on wide map with a lot of SZs, it increase the pace of invasion and add more smaller fleet battles because other warships moving only M2 cannot follow as much as they wish.
The issue to incentive more amphib landing is to give a bit of escort to Transport, Cruiser get this more specialized role without being able to protect against Subs.
The lust for gain to conquer an Island may outweigh the risk of placing a few ships in vulnerable SZ (which can be in a deadzone from a few enemy’s units).
Another possibility, is to give a complete defense @1 out of 12 per Transport with M3.
This will generate more amphib with TPs being use as expendable unit to grab land.
Of course, cost should be increase compared to defenseless.
@Baron:
I played a few times with Cruiser and TP moving 3 SZs.
Clearly, on wide map with a lot of SZs, it increase the pace of invasion and add more smaller fleet battles because other warships moving only M2 cannot follow as much as they wish.
The issue to incentive more amphib landing is to give a bit of escort to Transport, Cruiser get this more specialized role without being able to protect against Subs.
The lust for gain to conquer an Island may outweigh the risk of placing a few ships in vulnerable SZ (which can be in a deadzone from a few enemy’s units).Another possibility, is to give a complete defense @1 out of 12 per Transport with M3.
This will generate more amphib with TPs being use as expendable unit to grab land.
Of course, cost should be increase compared to defenseless.
Yes Japan did sacrifice 2 transports to take Midway. I believe the transports missed there plane defense shots. But it kept them at home for a extra turn. So without seeing Europe side outcome yet dont know if it hurt US. But they didnt seem to have a problem getting down to New Guinea. I can see in future games now Japan needs to stay at Carolinas and then get Manilla at a later turn instead of moving away as the case in the pics in above posts.
Also those M4 Cruisers in non combat can support small fleets or big fleets coming from Toyko to Carolinas and US from LA to Australia and New Guinea islands.
But Cruisers can only move 3 in combat so its not a total crush.
I can see where the Transport would be nice also to M3 in combat and 4 in non combat in my game.
Transport now in game which I think I didnt change in list is if you take a transport as a casualty you do not get the D@1 against a plane. If no attacking planes then they get the escape roll.
If the transport went to a M3 would that be to strong on the Europe side for US ? I think it depends because if you spend to much in the Atlantic as US then Japan with M3 Transports in combat and M4 in non combat will be all over the islands. So this would keep both sides in Pacific honest to protect other side from total island control.
Im trying to get also a more of a 50-50 60-40 US spending in game.
Transport
A0
D1 At 1 plane only if taken as casualty
M3
C8
The M3 Transport would have to be tested later do to testing the island group campaign that is being tested now and in a game coming up but aways off yet. But will play test where will just do like a 3-4 turn test games before group game. Could test transport in those 3-4 test turn games also.
Hi SS
Took a while but I found it. Hello to Baron as well : )
So I can only respond generally, as i haven’t played this kick ass ana version, but using Global 40 as a guideline, I had similar results. Russia was given a little more dough though and that kept things from getting whacked.
The best counter, imo, was using Black Elk’s “Sphere of Influence” where Japan and Russia can’t share territory with anyone, otherwise it’s a minus 10 bucks or w/e is appropriate.
But yea, found the Pacific to be a lot more fun with increased dollars : )
We are going to go with the 3 island group NOs in next game and Japan tanks are now A5 D4 M1 C7. Japan Mech M1.
For each 3 island group with color token you control you will recieve 5 icp NO bonus. 4 groups are for US and Japan and other 2 for Anzac. On play testing if Japan moved all fleet out to attack US Line Island fleet and Manilla, it allowed Anzac to get a 2nd NO. Also there was a Naval battle at Midway on T2 were Japan got Midway and Collected 2 Nos but then US landed Paratroopers in Midway with a bunch of planes and took Midway back. So there was more action in the Pacific already which is the goal.
Also need to slow down Japan tank blitz in China. The M1 will help. With a new tweaked China placement rule this should keep China in game longer and keep Japan out of Russia.
We will keep the NA for Russia ( Japan attacks any Russian territory you can place 6 inf in that territory being attacked one time in game ). Japan is already into China territories so they dont need to go that far to get rest of money but it wont be that easy. Besides they will probably have to spend hopefully more money for naval to protect or take some islands now in game.
Heres a pic of the island groups.
https://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=38459.0;attach=671591;image
Game is setup and ready to go. I will before game in week or so take away the colored tokens and use colored dots by each island representing ea 3 island group NO for 5 icps.
I have also 2 NO for the Med. Dont want to blast the game too much.
Also the yellow and dark green tokens are for resources of iron/ore dark green token and Grain yellow token.
Ea token is worth 2 icps. Once Japan gets the 3 China territories with grain tokens the money is even in game.
Im not 100 % sure if I am going to use this in next game. You can also bomb the resources for up to 3 damage for each one and it goes against your income just like the oil derricks.
I can see now in game where the Japan fleet in the Carolinas has a few decisions to make. Also Japan can attack Midway and get 2 NOs but will lose 2 transports and NOs after US counters. But US needs to land the air transport on turn 1 to take back Midway other wise they wont get there till T3 and Japan collects another 10 icps for another turn. Either this new 3 island group NOs make the Pacific now epic and many naval battles or it just makes the navys look at each other or makes either side to strong.
The Med NOs now is where a strong Italy has to get Malta and hold if they want to deny a UK NO or receive a NO.
Also Norway has been changed do to more historical which Ill be posting a pick soon. No more Allied come take and run to fast to Leningrad.
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Heres the pic of the new Norway. Made it 3 territories now split the szs to make 2 off coast and added the island for Sweden Straits.
If history I read is correct Germany can make a 1 time combat or non combat move through Sweden. Also Germany needs to land a inf on Sweden controlled island to control the Sweden Strait if they want to transport troops through Sz 19 to Finland for a shorter route to Norway.
Finland has been split in 2 territories now and worth 1 icp ea and Norway has another territory worth 1 but I see the green chip is covering the amount. I will make any changes if need be.
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Will be an edit to Norway. The Sweden Island will be removed and replaced with the Finland Island in sz 19. Germany will have control of it and has the rights to move in and out of sz19 do to Straits control.
Updated Norway Sweden on map with 2 marshes added. Norway 3 territories, Sweden 2 territories and Finland 2 territories on map now. Marsh added to Finland Leningrad border and the Pripet Marsh added to border of 2 territories in Russia. This will make Germany have to go around marsh ( or wait until T4 for Winter to cross frozen marshes.) if they want to attack Leningrad at the same time will need to control Karelia and use transports from sea but will need some kind a navy to protect Ger trannys. If Germany waits till T4 to attack Leningrad there maybe a huge Russian stack there. So best to attack right away and then go get Leningrad.
Thanks to Narvik for his input on Norway and Sweden.
Motorized units can only cross the Marshes in Winter season which is every 4 turns only.
In Norway everything only moves 1 space do to mountain terrain and no motorized movement in Winter season every 4 turns only.
Finland island of Aland added to sz 19 on my map. You need to control Aland in order to go thru the strait into Northern Sweden and Finland or out of.
With this new historic Norway now it wont be an Allied blitz to Norway and into Finland and Leningrad. Allies can do it but will take time and the right seasonal timed attacks.
This will help Germany to defend this area for a few turns.
The Allies can also just take VC Oslo and hold just that 1 Norway territory. Gives Germany a chance to maybe defend or take back now.
So game is this Sunday with these changes in game.
The New Norway Campaign
Weather Chart updated to include Norway
Japan tank Build Cap Minor - 1 Major - 4
Either have only Japan tanks M1 or any tank move in Asia M1 only.
This has been edited. The rule is now M1 only for all motorized units in all China and Japan controlled China territories at start of game and all Russian territories East of NOV.
3 Island group NOs to have finally found a way to have more major naval Campaigns in the pacific involving more Island control. Theres 4 islands that have a value of 3 now and have control of 2 island groups. Like Midway if you control it you can get 2 groups of islands and the same for the Carolinas, New Britian and Solomon islands. Now US has to take back Midway on T2 if Japan takes Midway to give them 2 NOs for 10 icps and Japan cannot leave the Carolinas because then Anzac can get another NO and the Allies will need to defend also Solomon islands and around New Britian. You will have no choice in game now because you dont want either side controlling to many island groups for 5 icps each. But will this make the allies ( KJF ) to strong if they control most islands by Carolinas ? Depends on Germanys NAs in game. IF need be this may have to be tweaked but need to play some games first. So US has to spend some money in Pacific and if played right you just deny each other NOs but Im hoping the 2 navies just dont look at each other. Also maybe this way will make US have to go 50/50 or at least 60/40 or 40/60. You also have to remember if Germany gets there 2 NAs Sub Interdiction and Wolf Packs the US has to spend money on Europe side too right away in game. If US goes KJF they will probably deny Japan getting Calcutta ( do to protecting money islands and island NOs ) but give Germany a better push on Europe side for the win and major convoy raiding in the Atlantic. Each game is always different.
Just like the Battle of the Atlantic which is great on Europe side in game now.
Iron/Ore and Wheat/Grain resources on map now.
The main goal is to invent a way for the Pacific side be epic. Hoping this is a start.
An Edit has been made and this was updated.
We got a game in with the newer changes. Norway never became a factor in game for Germany because Allies never landed there. The Allies also did not combine the UK in Africa, FEC and Anzac right and Anzac never got going and FEC even though they were making a ton of money. They did not use the triangle affect right.
As far as the new 3 Island Group NO Japan pretty much sat at Midway collecting 10 icps a turn and kept US at bay in the SF bay most of game because US did not move out T1 and Japan kept convoy raiding US with continued subs shucking.
US player was saying why buy stuff in Pacific when US just sits there. Wrong. So I just said then leave the Pacific all together and do what you want. Just let Japan rule it all.
W E
UK Europe have no idea what there plan was. Never bought ground every turn in S Af to chuck to Cairo or Calcutta. They kept losing Trannys in the canal from Italy bombers. WT?
The M1 only for All Motorized Units in Asia and Northern Russia worked great in game.
Japan does finally have a Art from a China territory just moving into a Russian territory on T6. Plus Japan could only build 1 tank at a Minor and 4 tanks at a major. This did not hurt Japan at all in this game. China still has a nice army that could of taken Saigon but opt to go hold Honk Kong. But with Calcutta just falling on T6 ( As mentioned above Allies never bought and transported enough units in Calcutta ) major mistake and Now Japan has 2 Minors in India to buy and send tanks to Stalingrad so in the long run probably an Axis victory.
As far as the 3 Island groups it worked great for Midway and Anzac did collect 2 NO most of game do to Japan leaving the Carolinas but came back and the US finally got there to attack and did collect 1 NO for Carolina-New Britain-Solomon island group.
Whats nice is Anzac does have some money and with a little help from US could also take away Japans Carolina-Papan-Marshall island group NO. Anzac was making 25 icps a turn for awhile and thats plenty of money to do something even with a UK Carrier sent over from S AF. But no they didnt play any of this side of map right.
Russia bought 2 figs first 2 turns with inf and kept keeping Germany at bay on the Eastern front using inf and 8 figs. There was just enough German push where Russia just couldnt afford to lose 2-3 figs trying to take out German fleet of coast of Leningrad. But felt it didnt need to be taken out do to only 2 trannys there. Germany mistake mostly was bought to many subs but that kept UK US scrambling a lot in Atlantic which that side of map is epic. A few less subs and more for Russia.
Germany did get the Rockets Tech early in game and was hurting Russia some with SBR
attacks on there ICs. Also Germany should of bought a few more AA guns and could of also started bombing Russian Airbases, Oil Derricks and Wheat/Grain supply.
Iron/Ore Wheat-Grain tokens worked great in game. Japan would take the China wheat (3 tokens) and China kept taking them back. China did get there 2nd US fig in game but maybe to late for them to use. They will have to retreat and then plan an attack or 2 in later turns. China never collected less than 10 icps in game. The Japan Tank buy cap was one of the reasons why China had some push in game finally with 5 inf added to setup and receiving some free inf and fig in event cards and US getting there Chinese Divsions NA where they can buy 1 China Inf per turn and place in China.
Also made the Philipphines 2 territories and that worked pretty good. Japan took it T1 and then left it empty and US got an Event Card where 2 Guerella Inf uprising in Manilla got the US back to controlling it. Nice. Japan had to come back and retake.
Still need more play to see if the 3 Island Group NOs are going to be the fix for the Pacific side to force Japan to not go deep into China and Russia ( which it did with Japan tank buy cap and M1 rule only ) and make them defend islands and some Island group NOs. Have to see what happens with some kind of US fleet in Pacific combined with Anzac and even a ship or 2 from Calcutta or S AF to make Japan come out to Islands more and keep the Pressure off Calcutta. If you combined it right is should work.
Its possible I may have to add a ship or 2 for US on Pacific side. Plan on adding more inf to Philipphines to make japan have to use a few more ground to take.
Ill tell you this japan now has to make a lot more decisions in game and not Wack it all over pacific.
So I think Im getting closer to a more epic campaign in the Pacific. One key is to make Japan not able to blitz through Asia and Northern Russia for starters. Yes Japan does need more transports on setup if you try to put some of this into your game but you also need to offset Japans extra trannys and make them have to use else where besides India. Another key is to keep those Japan Transports more towards island defense and NO island defense. Ill post pics of map later.
Nice report.
It seems there was a lot of unoptimized play for Allies.
The new rules seem to have bring more interesting things.
I would not change anything else without more plays.
Maybe your players need time to adjust with the new depth you are bringing into your game.
M1 Tank in China and Siberia seems more credible in terms of pace of conquest.
Ya just a couple tweaks to game otherwise Im leaving rest due to Allies play.
New South Wales going from 2 to 3 in value so Anzac can buy 3 units like 3 destroyers if they get that high in money or buy inf to defend.
Add 2-4 more inf to Philippines on setup or make Event card for US for uprising in the Philippines from 2 inf to 4-6 for the Guerilla warfare. Or split this.
Carriers now only shoot at planes. A2 D4
Transport values changing to.
A: Fleets with planes and Transports vs fleets with planes and Transports.
1. Can take transport as a casualty with no AA D@2
2. Transport stays gets AA D@2
3. Transport can ES @2
B: Fleets with no planes vs fleets with Transports.
1. Cant take as casualty and no AA D shot.
2. Transports can only get a ES @2.
C: Fleets only vs Transports only.
1. Casualties get a no AA D shot.
2. Survivors get a ES @2.
D: Planes only vs Transports only.
1. Casualties get AA D@2.
2. Survivors get a ES @2.
Thats it for now.
Here are the pics of map. As you can see allies never got to the new designed Norway. Iron token in Finland is for the copper Germany had. Germany bought a bunch of subs to keep allies hoppin in the Atlantic for convoy raiding. Russia bought planes early in game and are still keeping Germany at bay but with less sub buy maybe get a better push but no need to once Stalingrad falls with japan help.
At least in my game Japan can get you to the win and take some pressure off Germany but US cannot go one way or the other.
China has a nice force in game now and also all motorized units in Asia and Siberia can only M1. Japan also can only Buy 1 tank at a minor ic and 4 at a major. So if you look at map I think theres only 4 tanks in Calcutta and 2 ic. So Japan can only build 2 tanks there anyway instead of 6 a turn. You can only build minor ic in my game and this way you just cant plop down major ic. You also can only build up to the territories value. Only threat to lose IC mostly in game are at India, Paris, and Norway if Germany buys. No IC in Paris. Captured IC dont get a massive build up now unless a Capital. No lets build a major and drop 10 tanks or inf. Now you want territories and a minor IC you have to go get it.
The 3 island group NOs worked great for Japan. Each 3 group has a colored sticker by each island to show you the group of 3. They just sat in Midway and collected 10 icp extra a turn. As I said the US UK FEC Anzac did not combine play very well. Anzac did collect 10 icps a turn after time for 2 3IG NOs.
Philippines I made 2 territories instead of 3. 3 Which is correct on this map. What was nice was Japan left it empty and US drew an event card saying Guerilla up rising and US got to place 2 inf one in each territory to collect back 6 icps a turn and make Japan have to come back and get again.
So hopefully between the Japan restrictions, Philippines 2 territories and the 3 Island group NOs will finally be the fix for Pacific side.
It was classic. It took the Japan player on T1 some time to decide where he wanted to go now. Japan has many decisions now to make in Pacific and not sittin on his butt wackin it now ! :-D
