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Author Topic: Tired of KJF  (Read 5529 times)
ncscswitch
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« Reply #15 on: April 29, 2007, 08:29:32 pm »
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3 inf, 1 ftr from india is ot a sure win against Fic

True, only 50/50 to TAKE FIC.

But it is 3 in 5 for killing all of the Japan forces there, including a FIG, which secures india another round AND reduces the forces available for China.
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« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2007, 01:26:49 pm »
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With that out of the way, who has a good, strong, KJF defense?
can you give Japan some of the bid?

Not sure your bid amount.....

Also, I would stress to be very safe with your units in Asia
Move in large stacks, this way you will not be picked apart.

Extreme conservatism should keep Japan alive long enough for Germany to take advantage of no US pressure from the west.
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Hauptmann-Jager
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« Reply #17 on: May 01, 2007, 02:07:18 pm »
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How about a "Frack with Japan" strat...
India fleet to SZ59 (killing the TRN)
India + FIG takes out FIC (killing a FIG)
SZ40 to SZ45 to try to take out the SUB.

Japan has a choice to make...
Pearl or SZ59.  Doing both leaves Japan minus their fleet and AF.

Couldn't Japan just do a pearl light? Really light: 1 des, 2 fig, 1 bom (assuming sub is sunk, other wise he'd join). Assuming they they lose a Des and a fig then send in 1AC, 1 BB, 1trn, 2 fig to SZ59 where they'll pry lose 1 fig and 1trn. The SZ60 BB could join a battle but I assumed he'd hang with the carrier at wake to protect it from a counter. I suppose including the FIC you're out 3 fig, but you did manage to take out both fleets and only lose 2fig, 1trn and 1des and pry expecting to lose the des and fig anyways.

Though I will admit if one of the battles goes against them they will be hurting.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2007, 02:10:13 pm by Hauptmann-Jager » Logged
ncscswitch
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« Reply #18 on: May 01, 2007, 02:15:11 pm »
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And you are still down economy, and have achieved nothing extra in terms of destroying Allied forces in Asia, just the same kills that are usually made.
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Hauptmann-Jager
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« Reply #19 on: May 01, 2007, 02:36:13 pm »
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And you are still down economy, and have achieved nothing extra in terms of destroying Allied forces in Asia, just the same kills that are usually made.

I agree. In fact, I very much like this move you made and will probably try it out very soon!!! evil

However, I was just saying that you can hit both fleets successfully and have a minor air force.
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U-505
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« Reply #20 on: May 01, 2007, 03:12:09 pm »
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3 inf, 1 ftr from india is ot a sure win against Fic

True, only 50/50 to TAKE FIC.

But it is 3 in 5 for killing all of the Japan forces there, including a FIG, which secures india another round AND reduces the forces available for China.


C'mon Switch. That is a huge gamble. The average result is a cleared territory which means the UK fighter dies with the Japanese fighter. What's left after that, 2 inf, 1 AA in the middle east and no Egypt counterattack. That's a big gift to be giving Germany if it goes average.
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« Reply #21 on: May 01, 2007, 03:48:10 pm »
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Quote

C'mon Switch. That is a huge gamble. The average result is a cleared territory which means the UK fighter dies with the Japanese fighter. What's left after that, 2 inf, 1 AA in the middle east and no Egypt counterattack. That's a big gift to be giving Germany if it goes average.
Quote

Agreed. It is not worth the risk.
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ncscswitch
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« Reply #22 on: May 01, 2007, 05:58:03 pm »
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Even if you just clear the territory, Japan can;t follow up and capitalize and take India on J1 since they lack manpower in FIC (and the SZ59 TRN is dead).  So, while UK may not re-take Egypt, they keep India (which you basically surrender on an India counter).

You still damage the Japan Navy with your UK fleet, sinking a ship, maybe two depending on how many BB's are brought to SZ59
You still bleed off forces from Pearl, increasing the casualties there
And you bleed off/kill FIGs increasing casualty rates for China on J1, and for future battles due to lost airpower (from the FIC attack, and then from attacks in SZ59 and Pearl)

If it goes terribly wrong, what have you lost as UK?  You are gambling on nearly equal forces, and can ALWAYS RETREAT if round 1 dice go wrong (you CAN'T lose the UK FIG on the first round, even with the worst possible dice).
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ezto
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« Reply #23 on: May 01, 2007, 06:43:30 pm »
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I like that there are alternates out there. Im getting tired of the same ���� over and over.
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« Reply #24 on: May 01, 2007, 06:45:57 pm »
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I like that there are alternates out there. Im getting tired of the same sh*t over and over.
Yeah I was about to say that I definently want to try some of this stuff out to make a different game. UK basically can sacrifice it's stuff around Japan because who actually counts on keeping that for long anyway
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U-505
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« Reply #25 on: May 02, 2007, 12:03:58 pm »
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Even if you just clear the territory, Japan can;t follow up and capitalize and take India on J1 since they lack manpower in FIC (and the SZ59 TRN is dead).  So, while UK may not re-take Egypt, they keep India (which you basically surrender on an India counter).

You still damage the Japan Navy with your UK fleet, sinking a ship, maybe two depending on how many BB's are brought to SZ59
You still bleed off forces from Pearl, increasing the casualties there
And you bleed off/kill FIGs increasing casualty rates for China on J1, and for future battles due to lost airpower (from the FIC attack, and then from attacks in SZ59 and Pearl)

If it goes terribly wrong, what have you lost as UK?  You are gambling on nearly equal forces, and can ALWAYS RETREAT if round 1 dice go wrong (you CAN'T lose the UK FIG on the first round, even with the worst possible dice).

Giving Germany a free armor blitz through Africa is far more damaging than keeping India for a few extra turns.

And I never bleed off forces that are going to sz52. Either I go in with overwhelming force or I don't go in. Gambling with Japans navy is a sure way to get beaten.

And if it comes down to having to split my forces to attack sz52, sz59, and China, I will attack sz52 and only make one of the two other attacks, usually sz59. Eliminating the UK naval threat allows Japan to focus their entire navy on the US and it doesn't hurt my feelings to let the China fighter survive because the US/UK forces in Asia are limited and Russia will have a hard time reinforcing Asia with Germany sending 40+ IPC's worth of units at them every turn.

If you aren't going to counterattack Egypt with the UK fighter then you would probably be better off using it to help attack the Japanese sub and then adding it to the US forces in sz52. At least that way, you give the US better odds with a counterattack in sz52 on their turn or even preserve that fleet entirely if Japan decides against attacking it.
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« Reply #26 on: May 02, 2007, 03:20:17 pm »
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Even if you just clear the territory, Japan can;t follow up and capitalize and take India on J1 since they lack manpower in FIC (and the SZ59 TRN is dead).  So, while UK may not re-take Egypt, they keep India (which you basically surrender on an India counter).

You still damage the Japan Navy with your UK fleet, sinking a ship, maybe two depending on how many BB's are brought to SZ59
You still bleed off forces from Pearl, increasing the casualties there
And you bleed off/kill FIGs increasing casualty rates for China on J1, and for future battles due to lost airpower (from the FIC attack, and then from attacks in SZ59 and Pearl)

If it goes terribly wrong, what have you lost as UK?  You are gambling on nearly equal forces, and can ALWAYS RETREAT if round 1 dice go wrong (you CAN'T lose the UK FIG on the first round, even with the worst possible dice).

Giving Germany a free armor blitz through Africa is far more damaging than keeping India for a few extra turns.

And I never bleed off forces that are going to sz52. Either I go in with overwhelming force or I don't go in. Gambling with Japans navy is a sure way to get beaten.

And if it comes down to having to split my forces to attack sz52, sz59, and China, I will attack sz52 and only make one of the two other attacks, usually sz59. Eliminating the UK naval threat allows Japan to focus their entire navy on the US and it doesn't hurt my feelings to let the China fighter survive because the US/UK forces in Asia are limited and Russia will have a hard time reinforcing Asia with Germany sending 40+ IPC's worth of units at them every turn.

If you aren't going to counterattack Egypt with the UK fighter then you would probably be better off using it to help attack the Japanese sub and then adding it to the US forces in sz52. At least that way, you give the US better odds with a counterattack in sz52 on their turn or even preserve that fleet entirely if Japan decides against attacking it.

I generally agree with U-505, but I generally prefer to kill off China because of the possibility of US industrial complex in Ssinkiang with 4 inf and 1 fighter to start is inconvenient for Japan, particularly if there's an IC in India as well.  Sometimes, the UK player will fly the bomber east, and threaten the sea zone east of Japan; in that case, I think I would also attack the UK fleet.
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ncscswitch
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« Reply #27 on: May 02, 2007, 03:39:30 pm »
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Not killing China on J1 dooms Japan to slow progress in Asia.
The US INF, and FIG, backed up by Russian forces allows a nasty 1-2 punch that makes Japan have to put forces into Manch, Kwang and FIC directed at the central avenue of attack instead of north or south.

It makes China a meat grinder for Japan that USA can afford to maintain, but Japan cannot (since their income starts low, and if they get bogged down fighting for China, they do not gain much income elsewhere)

Combine this with the aforementioned strong press in other areas (like an FIC strike and UK fleet stack) and Japan is going to be hurting for quite a few turns (it once took me 9 turns to breach a Sinkiang IC as Japan).  And the Allies can maintain a newar full pressure assault on Germany, weakened only by 1-2 Russian INF per turn (after the initial Eastern forces are depleted in 3 turns or so), and USA down 10 IPC (2 of which are "preserved" IPC's that are normally lost when Sinkiang falls, and 2 more are made from "trading" China, so ne4t cost to USA only 6 IPC per turn after the initial investment).

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« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2007, 12:09:47 pm »
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Simply not killing the fighter can cause major headaches.
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« Reply #29 on: May 15, 2007, 12:16:39 pm »
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What Switch is describing is exactly the problem.  What I want to know is how to defeat it?  I can set it up, I've done so numerous times. (And yes, to prevent you almost have to give Jpn 3 IPC to put an infantry in FIC)

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