Should Schools Require School Uniforms?

[Imperious Leader]

I think kids should wear uniforms and that these uniforms should be military as in a military academy. I was a student in Brentwood Military academy for 3 years  (ages 5-7) and  we had to carry a heavy gun ( the inside was taken out) we had to drill and pay attention in class. Medals were earned and the only way one student looked better than another was by the example that student set by being awarded medals for good work. The school was extremely expensive so i had to leave, but it was a greatest time.

Nowadays your class is filled with immigrants and trash is everywhere.

[unc_samurai]

I like some aspects of military school, but just like every other educational measure, it won't work if applied universally.  I would have performed far, far worse in a school run like a military academy than the laissez-faire style of my high school.  That's the problem with the U.S. educational establishment.  Administrators try to apply universal policies at the state and local level, and I believe that's only impairing our success.

[rjclayton]

Nowadays your class is filled with immigrants

So?

[Cmdr Jennifer]

The thing is, there is no one method of instruction that works for everyone.  Charter schools, religious schools, military academies and banking schools (what we call Public Schools) all have their places.

Military uniforms, drill and awards for exceptional achievements is a great way to run an education system, but some people just don't have the genetic material to succeed in that environment.

Religious schools with uniforms are also a great way to run an educational system.  But again, some people just don't have the genetic material to succeed in that environment.

Banking Schools are an adequate way to train the unexceptional to fill lower level positions so that society can keep functioning.  Uniforms and pride are pretty irrellevant in this type of system because you are only aiming at basic arthimetic training, basic communications training and an ordered and structured day to get them used to going to a "job" for the lions share of the day. 

[Imperious Leader]

So?

Remember were talking about grade school..

Because:

1) half of them don't have any language skills and take time away from the teacher who has to constantly stop to explain over and over something thats simple.
2) The class size goes up because a bunch of families coming from other nations decided to put the burden of education on the American public, which is a burden on the other students ability to get ahead in class
3) Most of these kids act up in class and start fights because they feel inferior.

They should be placed in a separate schools and on a separate track to better gauge their educational acumen. Many of them could be re-integrated after they are up to speed. But basically the fleet sails at the speed of the slowest ship, but they are too slow to make the journey acceptable for the majority of students.

[Cmdr Jennifer]

Well, the nice thing about uniforms is that the district can buy them in bulk and get huge discounts and then have families that can afford them purchase them.  This way all the children have adequate clothing to shield them from the elements.  Remember, a uniform does not mean plaid skirts and ties per se.  A uniform could be jeans, white sneakers, school t-shirt and, for cold weather, a school jacket.

Furthermore, parents could get together and exchange or sell their children's uniforms to the next student - since the style would not change, the uniforms would have lasting power.


And anyway, after school, kids would be free to wear whatever, whenever.

[dezrtfish]

Well, the nice thing about uniforms is that the district can buy them in bulk and get huge discounts and then have families that can afford them purchase them.  This way all the children have adequate clothing to shield them from the elements.  Remember, a uniform does not mean plaid skirts and ties per se.  A uniform could be jeans, white sneakers, school t-shirt and, for cold weather, a school jacket.

Furthermore, parents could get together and exchange or sell their children's uniforms to the next student - since the style would not change, the uniforms would have lasting power.


And anyway, after school, kids would be free to wear whatever, whenever.

Exactly...

[unc_samurai]

Well, the nice thing about uniforms is that the district can buy them in bulk and get huge discounts and then have families that can afford them purchase them.  This way all the children have adequate clothing to shield them from the elements.  Remember, a uniform does not mean plaid skirts and ties per se.  A uniform could be jeans, white sneakers, school t-shirt and, for cold weather, a school jacket.

Furthermore, parents could get together and exchange or sell their children's uniforms to the next student - since the style would not change, the uniforms would have lasting power.


And anyway, after school, kids would be free to wear whatever, whenever.

You know what I never thought of until now - college athletic teams sign deals to use Nike and Reebok brand gear, I'm surprised the clothing companies haven't tried this on the lower levels.  Granted, people would raise all holy hell if a public school tried this, but a private school could get away with it.  "School Uniforms Provided By Nike", and then they get their apparel at cheap rates, and have all these kids walk around with their swoosh label on.

Kinda creepy, in that corporate saturation sense, but I'm surprised no one hasn't tried it.

[Jermofoot]

You know what I never thought of until now - college athletic teams sign deals to use Nike and Reebok brand gear, I'm surprised the clothing companies haven't tried this on the lower levels.  Granted, people would raise all holy hell if a public school tried this, but a private school could get away with it.  "School Uniforms Provided By Nike", and then they get their apparel at cheap rates, and have all these kids walk around with their swoosh label on.

Kinda creepy, in that corporate saturation sense, but I'm surprised no one hasn't tried it.

Well, schools, including public ones, currently do get funding for ad time (stadium, jerseys, vending machines) by such entities as Nike, Coca-Cola, and others.

[Cmdr Jennifer]

That's actually a very good idea!  We could subsidize the education of our children through corporate advertising.  Obviously we'd have to have some controlls on who or what is being advertised.  But the uniforms could be purchased by companies and other companies could purchase patches for the uniforms, kinda like nascar.  Anyway, the proceeds could be used to purchase books or lab equipment. 

[rjclayton]

Kinda like Nascar?  Great idea, why not go one step further?

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/europe/02/10/offbeat.forehead.ads/

[Jermofoot]

That's actually a very good idea!  We could subsidize the education of our children through corporate advertising.  Obviously we'd have to have some controlls on who or what is being advertised.  But the uniforms could be purchased by companies and other companies could purchase patches for the uniforms, kinda like nascar.  Anyway, the proceeds could be used to purchase books or lab equipment. 

Well, it's a novel idea, but I don't know how good it is, ultimately.  It's pretty bad if schools need to resort to this just to do what they are supposed to do.  I know that vending machines in the school are highly prized by students, but junk food is bad encouragement, IMO.  Also, how much influence would these companies have over the admin, teachers, students, even curriculum?  I also find that sanctuary from the constant bombardment of advertising is a good thing.  Advertising is a distraction and not very conducive to learning. 

[Baghdaddy]

Uniforms and / or dress codes...

My kids had uniforms in their public schools K-6.  The area was rough and had a significant immigrant population along with gang recruitment.  The uniform allowed for two different colors, neither of which matched the local gangs, and a variety of shirts, sweatshirts, tops, pants, shorts, skirts and jumpers for the boys and girls.  Cost was maybe 10% less than if we were just buying our normal stuff for the kids but the "gucci gear" costs never would be in our budget anyway.  The families who were struggling to put clothes on their kids were being helped by the PTO which maintained a "used clothes" bin.  As clothing was outgrown, the ladies of the PTO would do some sewing and washing and then offer it for resale at a reduced cost.  This provided funds for the PTO and for the families who could not even afford the reduced cost, things became free.  I would point out this was a rather impoverished area.  So much so that the Feds provided 100% free breakfast and lunch since more than 75% of the families qualified for food assistance.

By the time my daughter was entering middle school, we have moved into a more affluent area.  Uniforms were not seen as a way to keep gangs out of the school since that was not a problem.  The dress code was aimed at the "sexy" look and the "faddish" look.  No belly buttons visible.  No under clothing visible.  Skirts and shorts have to reach below the hand of the wearer when standing.

Now with my daughter in high school, the dress code is less restrictive.  Brand name clothing is important to her and as the boys and girls become men and women, clothing becomes another way to attract the opposite sex.  Both boys and girls are pushing their own comfort zones as they try on different looks and identities.

I offer all of this both to help those who have not yet dealt with kids see what the various issues are as the kids get older and to provide background to my viewpoint.

A school uniform in K-5 makes perfect sense to me.  Keep the kids more focused on being a cohesive group in a learning environment. 

For grades 6-8 loosen the rules to a strict dress code.  This gives the kids more freedom and with it more responsibiilty.  Failure to meet the dress code in our middle school means the principal puts school sweatpants, t-shirt and sweatshirt on you, puts you back in class and calls you parents to bring appropriate clothing.  Quite the scandal!!! <grin>

For grades 9-12 lossen the dress code a little more.  Certainly still keep the rules that allow gang colors and paraphenilia to be removed.  Keep guidelines in place to encourage modesty and decency but again, increase freedom and increase responsibility.  By this age, my kids are buying their own "brand name" clothing items to supplement the "Costco" clothing that we provide as parents.

Ideally, by the time the student has graduated from high school, getting dressed appropriately each day for the days activities should not be something that needs to be regulated.

[dezrtfish]

That makes sense to me.

[unc_samurai]

Careful, Baghdaddy, you coming dangerously close to a reasonable idea with some common ground.  That sort of thing is not tolerated on either the internets or in public education.