Hey Guys/Gals,
From what I have read a good 99.99999999% of you prefer to KGF. I would have to agree with you. Althoe with the US’s Strong economic base in theory you could start in any theater you wanted to and should be able to pull it off.
Thus my question for debate: If you prefer KJF how do you get the momentum ball rolling and execute the plan effectively?
You have to go island hopping with England and then follow up with American naval attacks. This forces Japan to choose Asia or Pacific, either way, Japan’s in a hard place.
On UK 1 you can take FIC and New Guinea, Consolidate in SZ 30 or take Borneo and New Guinea with a reasonable sense of security. After that, your fleet can either go around strafing while Japan runs down America and comes back, reinforce America to take the rest of the islands, or die distracting the Japanese forces and giving America even MORE to start with.
Jen,
When you try any of these do you build an IC any where for example India or AUS? Or is it your strategy to lean away from IC’s altogether?
Secondly, when you do this how do you pacify Germany until you get around to them?
IC in India if you have either taken FIC or landed everything possible in India to hold it.
IC in Sinkiang adds to the stress on Japan. But it’s worthless without the Indian IC.
Jen, I think you might be thinking of Revised.
Attacking Fic on UK1 is a bad idea, it is 2 inf, 1 ftr vs. 2 inf, 1 ftr. Not very good chances there. And there is no UK fleet just 1 trn at India, IIRC.
The better bet is Kwangbang. Russia attacks Man on R1, UK attacks Kwa on UK1.
Depending on what Japan then brings to Pearl, US can counter and build ships or just build ships and start to go after the islands.
UK can still go to Afr on UK2, while US follows up and you should be able to keep Germany held up at Kar with Russia (even if they are earning income from Afr).
The problem is with any kind of a bid you are likely to see 1-2 extra in Man taking Kwangbang off the table which makes going after Japan first very difficult.
Hey all,
On concept I read somewhere else was when Japan reinacts Pearl have your sub retreat working its way to the sea of Japan to destroy any transports.
I think its a good idea I mean lets face Pacific Fleet US isn’t going to have a good day at all if you have an experienced Japan player. Having your sub attacking transports its only a matter of J2 fixing that but it may buy all the time you need to repell Japans foot hold on the mainland.
Yes, having the sub retreat if Japan only gets 2 hits is a very good move.
If you attack Man and Kwa on R1 and UK1, you may be able to get Japan to go Pearl Lite, meaning maybe they only get 2 hits on the initial strike, so yes retreating your sub in that case can be quite effective and cause even more trouble for Japan.
Even if Rus and UK don’t attack it is still sound, b/c it forces the Japan player to protect any trns in the Jap sz or risk having them sunk.
It also gives you an extra ship if you decide you want to counter Pearl on US1.
Hey,
Countering Pearl might be a better Idea b/c the life expectancy of a sub vs. fighters on Japan won’t last long.
Yes.
It really depends though, some Japan players won’t give you the oppurtunity to counter. They may only attack with a sub, ftrs and a bom (Pearl Lite), maybe they bring in one other ship. But it is possible for them to clear the Sz and leave nothing for you to counter.
In which case have they probably kept a Capital ship back to protect their trns which means sending the sub to attack would be foolish, so here you might want to take the sub as the 1st casualty and try to kill another plane while you have the chance.
Hey,
Thats not true. US always gets to counter Pearl. This is how it would go down. Japan strikes pearl mustering its Navy from nearby locations make the death blow that brings the US into the game. Japan does what ever else it wants on mainland. follows up with NCM’s. Japan ends its turn. Thus starts the beginning of the US turn. If you retreat your sub like we discussed. On the US combat move you bring your sub as well as the rest of your Pacific Fleet sitting off the coast of California and your fighter there, lastly with your BMR when the smoke clears no one will have a Navy putting both the US and Japan in the same sinking boat.
Not true at all. Japan can easily do a “pearl lite”. US has 1 ac, 1 fgt, 1 sub in the Hawaiian sz. Japan could potentially bring any or all of:
1 sub, 1 ac, 2 bb, 1 trn, 3 fgt, 1 bmb
One “pearl lite” option would be to attack with 1 sub, 3 fgt, 1 bmb. Frood estimates 50% of the time Japan wins in 1 round (3 hits round 1). If US withdraws it’s sub whenever it gets a chance, Japan wins and 75% of the time takes only 0,1 or 2 hits.
Surviving 2 fighters land on carrier stationed at Wake (in non-combat movement, supported by 2 BB. US can only hit it with 1 sub, 1 trn, 1 BB (no planes can reach). Average outcome for that battle is terrible for the US - losing all their units and on average Japan only loses 1 unit (leaving on average 2BB, 1AC, 1FGT).
So US will never make that counterattack, and Japan can withdraw the surviving fleet (2BB, 1AC) the Sea of Japan in a KJF, or island hop in a KGF.
Hey,
I just checked and having your US sub retreat (J1) pearl attack, and make its way to Japan to disrupt transports on US1 could also work on revised.
Heres the kicker. It will only work if Japan doesn’t move transports out of harms way in the NCM stage. Yes they will be forced to place new units they bought. So you have to pray that Japan doesn’t start with a sub fleet. In this event you would have to counter pearl if you as the US want to maintain a presence in the PAC front.
You can’t do that in Revised for 2 reasons…
1. Subs do not move to retreat, they submerge.
2. If Japan brings the DST (they almost always do) the SUB can;t even submerge as long as the DST lives (it only takes 1 round with the DST still alive to prevent the submerge, and since USA declares combat losses first, you have to gamble on Japan being stupid and losing the DST even after they see that you kept the SUB).
So keep this move for Classic.
ncscswitch,
Thank you for your wisdom, your right my bad.
So here is a follow up question to the KJF debate. Lets say Japan knows it (lets not discuss how they just know the allies have it out for them) Does Japan go Navy or Army?
Wait a min. scratch last apology this is the A&A classic board.
A&A revise is down the hall!
-LT04
having your US sub retreat (J1) pearl attack, and make its way to Japan to disrupt transports on US1 could also work on revised.
I think you were the one to bring up revised… :cry:
Its hard to say if we were talking classic, revised we had so many flash backs, flash aheads, and a couple of flash side ways. With classic rules lets say the SUB can be spared the first round and submerge or retreat to the US West coast, only if Japan does a Pearl lite attack. On US 1 you could then counter with 1 SUB, 1 Battleship, and 1 TRAN as fodder, to be reinforced with what ever else the US chose to buy (assuming navy due to the KJF).
-LT04
With classic rules lets say the SUB can be spared the first round and submerge or retreat to the US West coast
Submerge doesn’t happen in classic. So we’ll say the sub withdraws to the US West Coast.
if Japan does a Pearl lite attack. On US 1 you could then counter with 1 SUB, 1 Battleship, and 1 TRAN as fodder, to be reinforced with what ever else the US chose to buy (assuming navy due to the KJF).
The question is, if Japan did Pearl Lite, what is there to counter? Maybe nothing. See my earlier post about a US counter of 1 sub 1 trn 1 bb at Wake against a Japan fleet of 1 ac 2 fgt 2 bb. Disastrous for the US.
Yeah after reviewing the situation at length I have come o the conclusion I’ve lost my d*** mind. Your right what was I thinking. At least what ever is left would give the US a good starter nave consisting of:
1 SUB (the one that retreated the Pearl lite attack)
1 BB on the US west coast
1 TRN also on the US west coast.
plus what ever else they start with in the Atlantic.
-LT04
Definitely, and not a bad option for the US either. That sub can represent useful fodder in a later battle instead of just leaving it to die at pearl on J1.
