ready to lay down some new rules for a new revised A&A world version.

[balungaloaf]

The new way for the Map: Clarifications   (IF some of this doesnt make sense at first, wait till the whole thing is done, will take some time).  there is a lot to write down yet.


Anyone who controls the panama canal can treat the sea areas on each side of it as one zone for naval ship movement.  Airplanes can ignore the panama land area as a space when moving across from one sea zone to the other.

West Canada is adjacent to the sea zone  in East canada for air movement only.  Not for ships.

S. Africa is not considered adjacent to the mozambique sea area for naval transports or amphibious assaults.  Its is adjacent for air movement.

LAnd and air units can move between turkey and eastern europe as they would over the suez canal. (helps a ton)

Black sea.  Naval movement b/w the black and med. sea needs the control of turkey by the same power. except america and britain which both can use if one owns.   The naval movement to eastern europe from the med.sea must go through the black sea.

Gibralter.  Redraw the sean zone boundry b/w spain and algeria so that it lies b/w Gibraltar and alergia instead.  Contol of Gibraltar is REQUIRED for naval movement b/w the West Spain sea zone and the Eastern med. sea zone.  Subs on non-combat moves can move past enemy controlled gibratlar.  Contol of algeria has no effect on sea movement.

Baltic sea.   Control of Western europe AND norway is required to move in and out of the baltic to the UK sea zone and vice versa. (except for subs in noncombat move).  Sweden must be neutral or controlled.

Control of Territory.   control of territory is determined at the instant of use.  If the Suez is captured by the germans, he may move his navy through the suez on the turn of capture.  Aircraft MAY land in just captured territory, even aircraft that just took part in the attack on that territory.  (awesome, i know).  An IC must be controlled by a player for his entire turn in order to place units there at the end of his turn.

Neutral countries.  You can attack them without paying a 3 ipc penalty.  When you attack a neutral of violate the airspace by flying over, your opponent whose capital is closest to that neutral country rolls 3 dice.  Exception, if you attack turkey or spain, 6 dice are rolled.  The result of the roles is how much ipc's your opponent recieves to immediately spend on land or air units to place in said country to defend against the attack.  All neutrals have an economic ipc value of 1 when they are controlled by a player. (dont forget).

i can answer any questions.  I will put down units and retreat options after the simpsons.

[balungaloaf]

Required rules also.

Players may not build new IC's

Placement of naval units in enemy occupied sea zones is allowed

Must use alternate turn order.  US, G, Russia, japan, and GB in that order.


COMBAT AIRCRAFT LANDINGS

 Attacking aircraft must land immediately after their battle is resolved, before going on to the next battle. (choose which battles you do in a careful order).  You do not land in noncombat movement.

ONE SEA ZONE RULE

Fighters and bombers may enter 1 sea zone when flying to a battle.  When returning from a battle they may enter one sea zone.   Exception- when bombing IC's bombers may enter one or two sea zones when flying to their targets and one or two sea zones when returning.   (many questions we had for this one, rules later help understand limits) i can answer q's

the one sea zone rule does not apply to noncombat movement

if you attack from an island with planes the opposing navy must be in the sea zone surrounding the island

CARRIERS AND FIGHTERS

can only carry fighters of own nation.

a fighters flight range from a carrier to its target is always 1

the carrier can move 1 or two zones before launching its fighters into combat, but must end its turn after doing so.  after combat returning fighters must return to their original carrier (keep these movements tracked)

Fighters can be attached or detached from a carrier only on noncombat move cycle.  They may not be used in attacking on the turn of their assignment or detachment.

land based fighters can not land on a carrier after attacking.

If the carrier based fighters carrier is destroyed, then it must land on another carrier.  If no other carrier, it may then land in an adjacent friendly territory.  If no adj. friendly terr. then the fighter is lost.

in noncombat a carrier may not move 2 spaces and then launch a fighter with its range of 4

PLACING NEW FIGHTERS AND NEW CARRIERS

New fighters may be placed on new carriers built by the same factory.  New fighters can also be placed on existing carriers in an adjacent sea zone.  Fighters that were not built but at the territory as the IC may be placed on a new carrier built by the IC if the fighters didn't attack on that turn.

AIRCRAFT FLIGHT RANGE LIMITS

except for carrier fighters and bombers on a SBR, fighters and bombers have a combat range of two to the attack point and a range of two while returning.  Two in and two out. total of four.

Bombers on SBR

they have a movement of 3 towards and 3 away to land.  3 in and 3 out.

NONCOMBAT RANGE
fighters have 4 and bombers have 6 in the noncombat move.

[Imperious Leader]

Most of that mindset is for 2nd edition concepts. The only carryover items from those that can apply are :

1) no allied planes on your carriers

2)carrier planes rules

That rule about planes landing in "just captured territory" has been refuted by playtesting.. What happens is it encourages concentration of too many peices in one territory and ruins the game. Anything that encourages the "infantry stack mechanic" is a fossilized concept for axis and allies.

The turn order sequence is also outdated by all axis all allies movement concept

The one sea zone idea is still a good idea to discourage the idea of attacking naval units and then flying to land based status on the following turn. However, we have installed new ideas to correct that so the rule is also dated.

some of the other ideas/problems were resolved by revised AA.

[Cmdr Jennifer]

I do so hope these will be consolidated into an easy to read PDF when it's done?

[balungaloaf]

i believe your wrong IL.  For two years we've been using these rules.  Much better than the rules we used to play by.  They are not even close to being all typed up.  It makes for a much greater game.  Ifantry stacking is nothing we encounter b/c of heavy infantry, new artillery rules and heavy tanks.  Its all much much better.  We tend to think the game is much better with all of the new rules in play. (except a few, which i will get to while posting rules).

Jen, i dont know what a pdf is.  or how to do it. notice i still dont know how to quite work the quote button on these forums.  I only have about 20 more posts to go, maybe 25.

[balungaloaf]

dont knock until you've tried it.  Its better than the house rules here for sure.  You guys still use rules that dont make sense.  It takes awhile but you have a really different twist to the game and not stacking.  I dont see how you could do that once the nukes come into play, you'd loose all your stacked people.

[tekkyy]

With the map "clarifications" I feel its not structured and not easy to remember.
Could print a new map instead though.
It does seem like you aren't playing revised but an older version of the game.

Its better than the house rules here for sure.

Have you checked out AARHE?
Justifications are included so its quite intuitive.

Download Link: http://rapidshare.de/files/32990411/Axis___Allies_Revised_Historical_Edition_Phase_2_Draft_20060914.rtf.html
Update Thread: http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=7188.0

[Imperious Leader]

dont knock until you've tried it.

Ive played those rules. That thing has been out for like 15 years. Some of it works and some of it does not. When you play you reduce your tanks back to 3/2? I find 3/3 is much better. You play with 12 IPC fighters? 18 ipc Carriers? 24 IPC battleships? Those are old concepts. What about those Maximum production limits? Japan cant build more than 3 infantry on Japan? Oh thats outstanding... ON J2 Japan is in a world of hurt if they cant make more than 3 infantry. If they build a fac in manchuria that limit is at 2 inf.

I dont like how they handled Turkey. If you take Turkey you cant move units from Balkans into Turkey as if they are not connected. Whats with that?

What about victory conditions? are we supposed to play only until one side is "conquered" that could take weeks! it does not take into consideration the victory cities which are an improvement.

also as you may know no allied units are allowed in the Soviet union... however the replacement for balance in this case is offered with a stupid 6 IPC loan carried by 2 transports... hows that gonna help the Soviets?

on top of that they reduce soviet units combat values to the point where they are ineffective... this weakens the Soviets too much IMO

AS i have allready stated many times before many of these rules are very dated and only apply or were meant to apply only to 2nd edition axis and allies. This varient has far succeeded its best intentions and is based on far superiour evolutionary rule ideas. That book has alot to offer and has its influences on many other ideas that form the basis of many good house rules.

[balungaloaf]

tek, i'll open a new post and put all rules in there.  Any questions or statements by people can come to this one, not the other.  That should help.  It's gonna take a while

IL, We still use victory conditions, either minor, major, or total.  Take the cities.  We use the new map.  Carriers, are 16 and hold two, but you can have small 12 ipc carrriers that hold one, and supercarriers that hold 3.  You can even put jets on them.  A whole bunch of new units and different defense and offense hit points are used also.  It evens out here.

With turkey, i didnt even know that was a rule until i started to type.  i overlooked it for a long time.  i usually just took over turkey and then used trn's to go into black sea and drop off in caucusus.

Japan on the other hand, already has 2 IC's at the beginning of the game.  With heavy units tech, you can build heavy infantry.  That makes up for the 3 and 2 respectivley.  Heavy inf, attack on 2's, or 3's on bonzai charges, defend on 4's on islands and have to be hit twice to die.  One hit drops them to regular infantry.  There's alot going on.

The soviets we have had no problem with, because even with reduced effectivness, they get all those heavy inf, all those free units after each turn, russian winter, and more help by national rules.

The transport rules have been overlooked cause they are rediculous.  One tank per tran or two inf per tran.  Air trans can carry inf also.

fighters are only 10 ipc in this rulebook, jets are fifteen.

sorry for being a jerk defending my work here, but this takes time to type, also we have fine tuned some rules and changed little things to make it better.  We've been playing this way for 2 to 2 1/2 years.

sadly tanks are 3/2 but heavy tanks which get hit twice are 4/3 then 3/2.  i think it works well.

[tekkyy]

like Eastern Europe isn't adjacent to Turkey nor Black Sea
but your title mentions "revised"