US 1 Purchases

i usually but 3 trans, 2 tanks and save 2, for next turn to start landing in africa

I normally buy a fighter or two for the Pacific or to send to England.

if you want to go with the united states know what role you want to do. first you must buy transport. buy nothing but transport first turn. second turn buy nothing but inft. then after that invade africa. third turn buy nothing but fighters. then buy a few more transports, and then buy nothing but inft, and fighters.

@darkangel:

if you want to go with the united states know what role you want to do. first you must buy transport. buy nothing but transport first turn. second turn buy nothing but inft. then after that invade africa. third turn buy nothing but fighters. then buy a few more transports, and then buy nothing but inft, and fighters.

If you buy nothing but transports the first turn then you have wasted IPCs sitting around the second turn, as there are not enough units to transport to use all of them. Using this buy you would have wasted IPC’s sitting around not doing anything. Using DM’s method, you have the potential to do something the second round instead of having them sit around. That doesn’t mean you NEED to do anything with them, but buying mixed transports and infantry the first and second round is much more useful than buying solely one or the other. I do agree that at some point you should simply stop buying transports, but I would usually advocate buying the bombers instead of fighters unless you really need them on defense for some reason. If you are buying nothing but infantry and X, you shouldn’t need X to be defensive.

@aaFiendish:

@darkangel:

if you want to go with the united states know what role you want to do. first you must buy transport. buy nothing but transport first turn. second turn buy nothing but inft. then after that invade africa. third turn buy nothing but fighters. then buy a few more transports, and then buy nothing but inft, and fighters.

If you buy nothing but transports the first turn then you have wasted IPCs sitting around the second turn, as there are not enough units to transport to use all of them. Using this buy you would have wasted IPC’s sitting around not doing anything. Using DM’s method, you have the potential to do something the second round instead of having them sit around. That doesn’t mean you NEED to do anything with them, but buying mixed transports and infantry the first and second round is much more useful than buying solely one or the other. I do agree that at some point you should simply stop buying transports, but I would usually advocate buying the bombers instead of fighters unless you really need them on defense for some reason. If you are buying nothing but infantry and X, you shouldn’t need X to be defensive.

i agree with that strategy you have to mis your purchases of transports with infantry or tanks that way you can be in constant traffic to africa or wherever youre going and that keeps some pressure on the axis player if you just build up your forces then the axis player can breathe a little and focus resources on russia or somewhere else in the meanwhile

I was recently trying to work out the ideal schedule for US builds. It’s a bit of a futile gesture, since the ideal schedule assumes no Pacific interference from Japan whatsover, no Sinkiang IC, etc. but in that scenario I came up with the following experiments:

Start: 1 transport, 1 tank, 2 infantry in EUS, 1 tank in WUS (I believe?)

1st turn
Move: 2 infantry to EC (a US1 attack adversely affects longer term movement)
Result: 1 transport, 2 infantry in EC
Place: 2 transports, 6 infantry ($34, save $2)
Result: 3 transports and 6 infantry in US, 2 infantry EC (total transports:3)

2nd turn
Move: 6 infantry to Europe on 3 transports from US; 2 tanks to EC
Result: 3 transports in UK, 2 tanks & 2 infantry in EC
Place: 1 transport, 9 infantry ($35)
Result: 3 transports in UK, 2 inf & 2 tanks in EC, 1 transport & 9 infantry in US (total transports:4)

3rd turn
Move: 4 (2EC+2US) infantry & 2 tanks to Europe, 7 infantry to EC
Result: 4 transports in UK, 7 infantry in EC
Place: 1 transport, 9 infantry ($35)
Result: 4 transports in UK, 7 infantry in EC, 1 transport & 9 infantry in US (total transports:5)

4th turn
Move: 9 (7EC+2US) infantry to Europe, 7 infantry to EC
Result: 5 transports in UK, 7 infantry in EC
Place: 10 infantry ($30)

5th turn
Move: 7 (EC) infantry to Europe, 10 infantry to EC
Result: 5 transports in UK, 10 infantry in EC
Place: 1 transport, 9 infantry ($35; a bit of a reach, perhaps)

6th turn
Move: 12 (10EC+2US) infantry to Europe, 8 infantry to EC
Result: 6 transports in UK, 8 infantry in EC

==============

Alternative Build Schedule:

3rd turn
Move: 4 (2EC+2US) infantry & 2 tanks to Europe, 7 infantry to EC
Result: 4 transports in UK, 7 infantry in EC
Place: 11 infantry ($33)
Result: 4 transports in UK, 7 infantry in EC, 11 infantry in US (total transports:4)

4th turn
Move: 7 (EC) infantry to Europe, 11 infantry to EC
Result: 4 transports in UK, 11 infantry in EC
Place: 1 transport, 9 infantry ($35)

5th turn
Move: 10 (EC) infantry to Europe, 9 infantry to EC
Result: 5 transports in UK, 9 infantry in EC
Place: 11 infantry ($33)

6th turn
Move: 9 (EC) infantry to Europe, 11 infantry to EC
Result: 5 transports in UK, 11 infantry in EC

@Desertfox:

I normally buy a fighter or two for the Pacific or to send to England.

If you are playing against a German opponent that is focusing on destroying UK navy, you will NEED to build 2 fighters in round 1.  These fighters will be flown to the NEW UK carrier that is built in UK2 to replace the one that was sank carrying US fighters in G2.

This of course assumes a “standard” round 1 UK build of 1 carrier, 1 transport, and 1 INF; and of course flying existing US fighters to defend that navy.

If by chance, you do not need the 2 extra fighters to defend UK naval forces, then you can move 1 of them out to your Pacific carrier, and then the other can either be flown to Africa to secure existing territories and assist with future assaults; flown to some Pacific island or Alaska for defense, or flown to Russia via UK for defense.

With 2 fighters, you then buy a transport and an INF to finish your build.

With this round 1 build, you are now in a position to defend UK navy now and next round, to always have 1 transport in US waters to pick up forces to send to Africa or Europe every round; and possibly to provide some strong defense assistance against a Japan advance, or to help hold Karelia.

Why waste the two fighters on the first round? If germany is hellbent on killing the navy, they will be able to accomplish it the second round against a carrier and 2 fighters. So why bother as the UK/US? There is a reason why darth is buying 3 trans/4inf and not 2 ftrs.

If the UK abstains from buying the first round, the second round they can buy an aircraft carrier and whatever else it is their heart desires, lets say a transport and some other crap. The us moves their 3 transports into the UK seas, drops off some troops in finland/norway, and hangs out with the UK navy. The US builds a few more transports and infantry that round.

So G3 comes around, and what does germany do about the navy? Not much that I can see. 5 ftrs and 1 bmb against the navy in the UK seas nets you about a 10% chance at a win. The most likely outcome is that I have my fighters and an aircraft carrier lying around. Next round US moves in and drops more troops into finland/norway, and the UK builds some transports too. Now there is even more of a navy than last time, and you have not much at all to attack it with.

So, you COULD buy 2 fighters if the UK did the “standard” build, in fact you should. Most of us are aware though that the standard build rarely works out very well, and thus plan more in tune with what I mentioned above. If you don’t sac your airforce against the navy, the allies are dumping in troops pretty quickly. If you do, then the allies are still dumping them in quickly, you just have no airforce.

@aaFiendish:

If the UK abstains from buying the first round, the second round they can buy an aircraft carrier and whatever else it is their heart desires, lets say a transport and some other crap. The us moves their 3 transports into the UK seas, drops off some troops in finland/norway, and hangs out with the UK navy. The US builds a few more transports and infantry that round.

So G3 comes around, and what does germany do about the navy? Not much that I can see. 5 ftrs and 1 bmb against the navy in the UK seas nets you about a 10% chance at a win.

A few comments regarding a US “transport only” build and no UK naval build in Round 1.

First off, if Germany blew the hell out of UK’s existing navy in R1, and UK built no replacements and the US built transports, the allies are going to have a bit of trouble with G2.  No UK navy means all those fighters, all those extra 3’s, can be used against Karelia.  Even if 1 fighter was destroyed in R1 in Eastern, Germany still has four 3’s to add to the mass of infantry and tanks coming out of Eastern into Karelia.  And BEST case scenario (best case for Russia), Russia has only 20 or so INF in Karelia, say enough to kill 4 enemy units the first battle round.  But those fighters pick off an average of TWO additional INF each attack round, rapidly depleting Russia’s mass of INF which is only going to be replaced by AT MOST 8 INF the next round (since Germany will hold Eastern and Japan will certainly re-take Manchuria in J1)

Also, that pretty little transport fleet is subject to the German bomber (unless Germany decided that they had the numbers to take Karelia and used it there).  1 transport likely sunk first battle round, with only 50-50 chance of bomber being splashed.  Round 2 another trasnport goes to the bottom and less than a 33% chance of the bomber going splash.  Based on my experience with dice, 2 trasnports go down on average before the bomber is lost.  That means that Germany has ONE MORE ROUND to batter Russia un-opposed (now round 3 beating against Russia with no assistance from UK and US) since UK will have to BUILD their navy in UK 2 and can;t use it until after G3, and the US has only 2 trasnports in the Atlantic to us on US2… not much threat to mainland Europe to stop a third all-out attack by Germany on Russia in G3.

Of course, if UK builds what I call the “standard” build on UK1, then Germany HAS to assault it with their AF instead of using it on Karelia, otherwise both the UK and US start pounding Germany in Round 2 instead of Round 3.

So the immeidate build pulls forces away from Russia, takes German air power totally out of the picture by the end of UK2 instead of sometime in round 3; and an extra 10 or 12 Russian INF units remain alive over rounds 2 and 3 as a result.

@Soon_U_Die:

2.  The Russians will easily have more than 20 Inf to defend with.  In fact, you will most likely have terrible odds as Germany on an all out G2 attack on Karelia as long as the UK lands her Ftrs/Bomber there as does the US bomber.  That is a suicide attack.

OK, then I have to ask… unless Russia does not attack anything in R1, where does all the INF come from?  They build 6 in R1, they can get 5 from Caucuses, 4 from Russia.  That is 15.  Any Karelia INF would remain in whatever territory it was used to attack (unless quickly retreated, even then there would be some losses).  And unless Russia takes some territory, it can only build 6 in R2.  That is 21, plus any saved from the “feint” attack in R1.

Yes, you can get more.  You can not attack with Karelia forces saving those INF, you can pull back from Evenk to Russia in R1 and then to Karelia in R2.  Hell, you can get 30 INF, plus a few tanks and your fighters there by the end of R2 if you want.  But IF you do, what have you left? Caucuses is vacant, or nearly so.  There are almost no Russian forces in the east facing Japan (just 4 INF and a tank, with nothing else between Japan and Russia.  And Russia is empty, or nearly so. And of course, Russia under this strategy is collecting only 24 IPC (6 INF) less one INF for every territory Japan takes (not quite one per, but darn close).

Again, faced with this, I simply change strategies… slash and burn in Africa, fortess Germany, slash and run in territories south of Karelia to keep IPC’s up, and let Japan come in in 3 moves with 5 fighters, a bomber, half a dozen tanks and 8+ INF.

You simply CAN’T ignore Japan as Russia in the early stages of the game, Japan with 40+ IPC’s (most of the extra IPC’s taken from Russia) combined with a still-existing Germany is just too much for them to stand up to for any amount of time.  Japan at 8 tanks against Russia with 4 INF per round after they lose all of their eastern territories… do the math.

Switch
Usually i play Russia Restricted, so Karelia ends up with 19 inf, 2 ftrs, and 2 arm after R1.  It’s a foolish (or absolutely fiendishly brilliant) Germany who goes up against this.
Also even when Russia does not attack in the first round and stacks, i usually get one inf to CAU, and for some reason UKR turns into a dead zone.  Too often when Germany has their stuff together, CAU turns into a dead zone when Germany is landing stuff there from SEU.  Luckily the UK tends to take that crap out early. 
Anyway, I tend to agree with SUD and DM as i have little imagination.

Oh yeah - Darth - what were you planning to do with that one little fighter you purchased as US1?  I don’t remember seeing that before from you.

And SUD - nice to see you again.  It’s been too long.

While I apologize for getting potentially off track here, I must point that nccswitch is playing by some sort of mystic rules where infantry cost 4 IPCs. 24 IPC ( 8INF )

The concept of slashing/burning africa is very amusing to me, you honestly take all of africa with germany? I think you are assuming that you are the only one who can change strategies, and that the allies will keep dumping all of their troops into “germany” or karelia. Oh, and I ignore japan all the time as the allies, it tends to piss off the japanese player. Once they get a little closer I’ll start paying attention. I think this probably relates to axis strategy more, so i’m going to go over to that thread.

@aaFiendish:

While I apologize for getting potentially off track here, I must point that nccswitch is playing by some sort of mystic rules where infantry cost 4 IPCs. 24 IPC ( 8INF )

My apologies.  I did mis-type the Russia build numbers.

@cystic:

Switch
Usually i play Russia Restricted, so Karelia ends up with 19 inf, 2 ftrs, and 2 arm after R1.  It’s a foolish (or absolutely fiendishly brilliant) Germany who goes up against this.

OK, let me check my math (since I screwed up earlier).
You have 21 2’s, 2 4’s, and your AA in Karelia after R1.

In a MAXIMUM load against Karelia (assuming RR as you posted above), Germany brings:
11 INF, 7 tanks, 5 fighters, 1 bomber
This is ALL units in Finland, Eastern and Ukraine, plus German and Southern tanks, 2 German INF via transport, plus all fighters and the bomber.
Average AA will kill 1 fighter.  Let’s say 2 just to make it interesting.
So I attack with 11 1’s, 10 3’s, and a 4.

Your defense total is 50
My attack total is 45

Advantage Russia.

But, while your attacks in the first rounds of the battle are killing my 1’s, my attacks are killing your 2’s.
the VAST majority of your defense are 2’s (33% chance of a hit) while the majority of my attack forces are 3’s, 50% chance.

Battle Round 1, I kill 2 units with INF, 5 with armor and fighter, and probably 1 with bomber.
You kill 6 with INF and amor, and probably 2 with your fighters.

Going into round 2 your defense total is down to 34
But my attack strength is still 37, now superior to yours.

Round 2 I miss with my INF (50-50 chance) and hit 5 with tanks and fighters, and again 1 with bomber.
You kill 2 with INF/Armor and 2 with fighters

So now you have blown through my cannon fodder and killed one of my tanks (of 7).
I have killed 14 of your INF.

My attack score is now 31
But your defense is down to 22.

Round 3 I kill 4 more with tanks/fighters, and the bomber misses.
You kill 1 with INF/armor, and 1 fighters (both loses either fighters or tanks)

My attack score is now 25
Your defense is down to 16

Round 4  I kill 3 with tanks/fighters, 1 with bomber.  Your infantry is gone and so is one of your 2 tanks.
You kill 1 with INF/Armor, and 2 with fighters.  I am taking Fighter losses to maintain ground forces for after the battle

My attack is now 16 (bomber, and a mixture of 4 tanks/fighters, your defense is 10, 1 tank, 2 fighters.

Round 5, I finish you off:  2 from armor/fighters, and 1 from bomber.
You retaliate with killing 2 more units.

So I have Karelia, with two tanks there (or perhaps a tank and a fighter flown back to Germany) and a bomber flown back to Germany.

Meanwhile, Germany did a naval landing in Caucuses supported by a battleship.  That lone russian INF is gone, and I have 1 or 2 INF in Caucuses.  Also, I blitzed open territory in Africa taking 3 IPC’s from UK.

Germany has 2 INF in Western, 1 or 2 in Caucuses, their Afrika Corps. 2 INF from Germany are moving into Eastern, the two tanks remain in Karelia.  And my build puts 2 INF in Southern, 7 in Germany, and a tank in Germany, plus the bomber flown back to Germany.  Germany gets paid PLUS 9 for 41 IPC’s

Sure, UK can re-take Karelia IF my subs fail against the UK navy, and Japan has a tough nut to crack in Yakut, but they can do it, and possibly Far East as well.  USA will likely fail against Westerm and so would take Finland.

In R2, Russia builds 8 INF in Karelia, with nothing to attack with; not even to boot that German INF out of Caucuses.  They get paid MINUS 7 (Caucuses, Far East, Yakut) and will only have funds to build 5 INF for R3, less bombing losses.
Come G3, Russia will ONLY have 13 INF, plus whatever UK and USA support has been moved in to defend against a German assault that could be as much as 18 INF, 5 tanks, and a bomber.

And Japan keeps marching West…

yeah but Switch - this rarely happens.  It leaves Europe too soft, and besides - Russia is very rarely aggressive.  If German forces burn it’s offense down to 2 arm which are easily retaken by the UK in exchange for some 3-ipc badlands, then leaves itself a series of deadzones, i hardly see the advantage for Germany.  Russia bounces back pretty readily, whereas Germany is back to square zero.  In the meantime UK and US have built up a little and have taken FIN, and possibly WEU.  Germany shrinks from 41 - 30.  As for Japan - there is no “failure to contain it” so no losses there either.

EDIT These numbers below are incorrect. I’m going to leave this post here though to show how much of a dolt I am. Most of the ideas still stand. Corrections are in next post. /EDIT

Switch,

(this dialogue is fun) I don’t think your numbers are representative of chance. With your offense vs. defense, germany will only win about 50%?

Lets do a little NOLUCK to show what the most probably outcome of your battle is. I’ll take out 1 plane with the AA gun.

R: 50 = 8 hits carry 2
K: 48 = 8 hits

R: 13 2’s, 2 4’s = 34 = 6 hits + carry4 + carry2 = 7 hits
G: 3 1’s, 11 3’s, 1 4 = 40 = 6 hits carry 4

R: 7 2’s 2 4’s = 22 = 3 hits carry 4
G: 7 3’s, 1 4 = 25 = 4 hits + carry1 + carry 4 = 4 hits + carry 5

R: 3 2’s, 2 4’s = 14 = 2 hits + carry 4 + carry 2 = 3 hits
G: 4 3’s, 1 4 = 16 = 2 hits + carry 4 + carry 5 = 3 hits + carry 3

R: 2 4’s = 8 = 1 hit + carry 2
G: 1 3’s, 1 4 = 7 + carry 4 = 1 hit + carry 5

R: 1 4 = 4 + carry 2 = 1 hit
G: 1 4 = 4 + carry 5 = 1 hit

R: Dead
G: Dead

So you are left with nothing in no luck. Let ssay you were left with a unit, you could always take out your bomber earlier of course, but then you are left with one tank, and no air. What would you do? I assume put the tank there, and no build in karelia is nice. (please double check my math, I did once and found an error, but am going off the assumption it’s right).

Of course, in RR russia would move over to UK seas, which means your subs have a whopping 11% chance at a win. 54% chance you only kill 1 or no transports, and even if I have to take the transport casualty, I have my transport off of canada. Much less chance if you don’t take your trans.

This round, I roll into karelia with a BB shot, 2 inf, 2 fighters. I probably take with 2 inf, land my fighters in moscow. I send my bomber, battleship, and sub to your BB and transport. They are gone. The UK doesn’t even BOTHER building an AC because you have nothing to take it with. Depending on transports it has left, it can build a few. Lets say it only has 1 left, so it builds 2. Then 4 inf. The US builds as per darth’s suggestion 3 trans/2 inf. The US lands 2 inf in finland, 2 fighters, bomber in UK.

Next round: Russia builds 6 inf in karelia, 2 in moscow. You have two inf in eastern, 1 armor in berlin. You cannot possibly attack, so where do your forces go? I assume you move inf into eastern, maybe do a little dance in ukraine/caucus. You still have no air, bonus for UK. UK moves 4 inf + 1 arm into karelia. It attacks your caucus inf with 1 bmb + 2 ftrs + 2 inf. Maybe ukraine has two inf also? So I don’t bother attacking. If it only had 1 I might split forces. US builds another 2 trans, places some in eastern, the rest in western. Shuffles its troops into finland, shifts finland troops to karelia.

You quote “Come G3, Russia will ONLY have 13 INF, plus whatever UK and USA support has been moved in to defend against a German assault that could be as much as 18 INF, 5 tanks, and a bomber.” Where did your 18inf come from? In G2 you only had 2 left in eastern, then lets say you moved your 9 in. That’s 11 that can attack in G3. Meanwhile, russia has 6 + R3 build of 6 (caucus was retaken in UK2) + 2 from moscow = 14. On top of that, you have in UK2 moved 4 inf + 1 arm into karelia, and the US has moved in another 2 inf. Oh yeah, and the fighters.

In short, G3’s more likely outcome is ~11inf + 5 armor vs. 14 inf + 4 inf + 1 arm + 4 ftrs.

I think you need to re-evaluate this all out assault on karelia, or maybe I am missing something.

Ack, this thread took up way too much time and can’t respond to others now. Damn this whole thinking thing. Oh, btw, if I stack Yakut with 7 inf and the armor you only have a 51% chance of taking it, and that is saccing 3 fighters to do so. 3 1’s 3 3’s 1 4 vs. 8 2’s. That means you don’t take the land either, which means another 2 IPCs for russia, yippee.

@aaFiendish:

(this dialogue is fun) I don’t think your numbers are representative of chance. With your offense vs. defense, germany will only win about 50%?

Lets do a little NOLUCK to show what the most probably outcome of your battle is. I’ll take out 1 plane with the AA gun.

R: 50 = 8 hits carry 2
K: 48 = 8 hits

R: 13 2’s, 2 4’s = 34 = 6 hits + carry4 + carry2 = 7 hits
G: 3 1’s, 11 3’s, 1 4 = 40 = 6 hits carry 4

R: 7 2’s 2 4’s = 22 = 3 hits carry 4
G: 7 3’s, 1 4 = 25 = 4 hits + carry1 + carry 4 = 4 hits + carry 5

R: 3 2’s, 2 4’s = 14 = 2 hits + carry 4 + carry 2 = 3 hits
G: 4 3’s, 1 4 = 16 = 2 hits + carry 4 + carry 5 = 3 hits + carry 3

R: 2 4’s = 8 = 1 hit + carry 2
G: 1 3’s, 1 4 = 7 + carry 4 = 1 hit + carry 5

R: 1 4 = 4 + carry 2 = 1 hit
G: 1 4 = 4 + carry 5 = 1 hit

R: Dead
G: Dead

Whoever wrote that stuff in that post was really dumb. Germany actually wins more like 60% of the time. Allow me to correct that idiots numbers, man he can’t even count.

R: 50 = 8 hits carry 2
K: 48 = 8 hits

R: 13 2’s, 2 4’s = 34 = 5 hits + carry4 + carry2 = 6 hits
G: 3 1’s, 11 3’s, 1 4 = 40 = 6 hits carry 4

R: 7 2’s 2 4’s = 22 = 3 hits carry 4
G: 8 3’s, 1 4 = 28 = 4 hits + carry4 + carry 4 = 5 hits + carry 2

R: 2 2’s, 2 4’s = 12 = 2 hits carry 4 = 2 hits + carry 4
G: 5 3’s, 1 4 = 19 = 3 hits + carry 1 + carry 2 = 3 hits + carry 3

R: 1 4’s = 4 = 4 + carry 2 = 1 hit
G: 3 3’s, 1 4 = 7 + carry 4 = 1 hit + carry 5

R: Dead
G: 2 3’s + 1bmb

There, now that I have corrected myself. Much of what I said above still stands. I’ll carry noluck about as I talk about, and do the baltic battle. If the transport is left in the baltic to prevent offshore shelling then that can be an excercise to the user, and just means I’d use the bomber in karelia more than likely. In the UK Seas, lets do this quickly now…

R: Non-sub=1 4’s + 2 1’s = 1 hit
    Sub = 1 2’s = 2
G: Sub = 2 2’s = 4

R: Non-Sub 1 4’s 1 1’s = 5 (transport lost because g sub’s add to 6 this round)
  Sub = 1 2’s = 2 + 2 (from 1st round)
G: Sub = 1 2 = 4 (from 1st round) + 2 = 1 hit

So the UK attacks karelia with UP to 1 bb, 1 arm, 2 inf, 3 fighters, 1 bmb. Lets just say I take 2 fighters, 2 inf, an arm and the bb. That’s it for the defense, and in with the UK.

Yes, I realize I am going with a no luck scenario, and that does not represent reality. What I am trying to show is that if germany blows its load and the UK can take back karelia, it was a really silly move. Given that it is VERY likely they will, why do this as germany? Yes the dice can go well for you, yes you can take karelia with overwhelming force. On the other side, yes russia can kick your butt back to oblivion. Why the hell even bother to setup the board if you are going to attack karelia with RR? No strategy could be implemented by Russia to prevent this, there is nothing they can do. So you as germany take a crapshoot, maybe get lucky and hold karelia so russia can’t build on it. Otherwise karelia as I have demonstrated will have a strong defense. If your crapshoot works out, then you believe the allies have no chance. So why bother? Why throw the whole game to a single battle that requires no strategic setup?

If the mods want to move this latest part of the thread, go for it.

Actually, I was just showing that German CAN take it, no matter how hard Russia stacks.

And yes Germany would be weak afterwards, but building strongly for 2 rounds against a weakend Russia (with enough INF in key places so that UK would have to risk those precious fighters if they attempt an amphib).

You make a few errors in your responses.  Caucuses CAN’T be retaken in round 2 before German gets to act:  Russia has no forces left to do so:  everything west of Yakut (in your scenario) is dead (except the R2 build, 8 INF to cover Karelia and Russia).  That means Russia has to split their defense, leaving Karelia potentially vulnerable (not extremely, but again it comes down to my north atlantic sub sinking that Canadian transport and limitting UK to landing only 2 land units, of which one will survive and I might even get one or both of those fighters with AA or my land forces in Karelia that survive the BB.  Also, have you considered that Germany leaves only 1 land unit in Karelia, inviting UK in and saving much of their air-power for an all-out strike on Russia from the Caucuses that you can NOT re-take before G2?

Anyway, I know you are probably bored with this exchange:  that even with UK help, Germany can be adjacent to Moscow on multiple fronts and able to begin attrition warfare against Russia by G2.

And as far as holding Japan at Yakut with 7 INF and a tank…
On J1, I can probably crack that with available J forces in an RR game.

By J2 the only forces Russia has on the board are those you BUILT in R2:  8 INF, less any losses to Germany in G2.  (and perhaps there useless at this point except for cannon fodder Navy).

Do you REALLY think that Russia, starting from 8 INF in Round 2 and reduced IPC’s can stand up to Germany knocking on the door and Japan a tank-blitz away backed up by a hell of a lot of air-power?

All I have to do is take Russia ONCE, even if UK or USA takes it back.  I still get their money, and they then have NOTHING to build with next round… possibly ready to be re-taken to pay the Axis Russia’s money again…

In KGF against veteran level opponents, Ger really has to wait for Jpn to open the eastern front.

Kar only falls only when Ger gets lucky.  Assuming average odds.  It will not last long.  US and UK will counterstrike on any weak Europe spot with amphib assaults.  After Kar, Ger will present multiple open and lightly defended European targets.