Splitting hairs in the Balkans

[oztea]

If there is ever another war in Europe, it will come out of some damned silly thing in the Balkans - Otto Von Bismark

Which axis power should take charge in the balkans?

Germany taking Yugoslavia gives it a G1 territory that can have a factory on G2 touching the med and the 4 Bulgarian units could come in handy for G3-4. Germanys strong army can exhert its will on Yugoslavia but not Greece

But what about Italy, this is their home turf, and could be a good cash cow for the smaller power, +5 IPCs with Greece included. Also +4 units Italy could desperatly use. And Italy's navy is in prime position to soften up Greece and Yugoslavia.

An important rules question: Can Germany attack Yugoslavia and retreat to soften it up for Italy? Do you place allied units there to represent the standing army, or is there always just 5 INF there, no matter who attacks, and the 5 INF are there until you take it?

[calvinhobbesliker]

Germany can attack it and retreat, and let Italy take it. Italy doesn't need German help in the Med. What they need is cash, especially from the Balkans. Germany softening it up lets them save units. And Yugo is reduced to however many inf remain. Germany retreating allows inf in Greater Southern Germany to get to Romania

[oztea]

neat retreat move, didnt think of that

[calvinhobbesliker]

neat retreat move, didnt think of that

Yeah, but it seems cheap.

[oztea]

very cheap

[The Fire Knight]

Not really. When you think about it, all of the turns are technically happening at the same time (a period of half a year). So its kind of just like a joint German and Italian invasion where Italy earns it.

[SoJu]

Sounds like good strategy to me.. Not being 'cheap'.

[oztea]

the cheapness is in retreating the German attack force past yugoslavia to the russian border
effectively moving the units 2 spaces instead of 1.

[Hobbes]

the cheapness is in retreating the German attack force past yugoslavia to the russian border
effectively moving the units 2 spaces instead of 1.

You don't you have the gun barrel of a T-34 pointed at your head and forcing you to use OOB rules.

[oztea]

i know, i house rule a lot anyway.

1. Changes To Retreating
When conducting a retreat, units must retreat to the territory from which the most combat units originated.

This rule also prevents Italian units retreating to transjordan after an attack on egypt if they have both in AA 50th, which just happend to me recently.

[Seven_Patch]

This is really strange.  I always thought it was a rule that retreating forces had to return to the territory that they attacked from.  In the case of amphibious assaulting units they return to the transport (vulnerable to dying with the transport).

So even if you attack from two different territories and retreat, whatever units remained had to go back to the correct territory that they came from.

Seems really weird to retreat to an entirely different territory, it’s a free move that you shouldn’t get.

[SAS]

Units from an amphibious assault can never retreat regardless.

All other units when they retreat must retreat to a single territory controlled by the attacking player at the start of the turn.  This avoids anything crazy like having to keep your units attacking from different territories in different piles so you can retreat them to where they came from.  So yeah, I agree it's a little cheap to attack a territory and retreat to a territory on the other side, but that is the way the rules work currently.  Having to retreat to one of the territories your attacking land units came from would make more sense.  I think air units should be able to retreat wherever though, as that makes more sense than the land units.

[poloplayer15]

Italy. she needs the income more than Germany and besides Germany just got a ton of IPC'c from France and Finland. also the Germans gained a major and a minor industrial complex from France and are well set. they should be concentrating on operation Barbarossa