TripleA map for Global 1940 Alpha Final

[Hepps01]

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=28562.690 (original question post #688)

TripleA allows the Soviets to collect the SZ125/Archangel NO when at war with Italy (but still neutral to Germany) even if a German sub is in SZ125.

According to Kreighund, the presence of a German warship prevents the collection of that NO even if Germany isn't at war with the Soviets.

Logically that makes no sense.  Why on earth would a German vessel in the S.Z. negate the N.O. if they are not combatants?  Germany can't take a territory from Russia if it's not at war with them.  So why would it affect the S.Z. if they are not at war?

[wheatbeer]

The NO represents Lend-Lease ... so probably the way the NO operates represents that the German warship in SZ125 is attacking non-Soviet ships sending supplies.

[P@nther]

http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=28562.690 (original question post #688)

TripleA allows the Soviets to collect the SZ125/Archangel NO when at war with Italy (but still neutral to Germany) even if a German sub is in SZ125.

According to Kreighund, the presence of a German warship prevents the collection of that NO even if Germany isn't at war with the Soviets.

Logically that makes no sense.� Why on earth would a German vessel in the S.Z. negate the N.O. if they are not combatants?� Germany can't take a territory from Russia if it's not at war with them.� So why would it affect the S.Z. if they are not at war?

Krieghund argues in http://www.axisandallies.org/forums/index.php?topic=28562.msg1122513#msg1122513
as follows:
"Even though Germany and the USSR are not themselves at war, Germany can still interdict Allied aid to the Soviets."

The NO represents Lend-Lease ... so in perhaps the NO mechanism represents that the German warship in SZ125 is attacking non-Soviet ships sending supplies.

That's it, I think.  

[Hepps01]

Well if the N.O. is meant to reflect "Lend & Lease" supplies given to Russia to fight the Nazi's then shouldn't Russia only be eligible to receive the N.O. IF they are war with Germany?  Because if the N.O. is meant to reflect  Lend & Lease then the Lend & Lease only happens if Russia is fighting Germany.  Supplies weren't sent to Russia for no reason.  Just my opinion.

[wheatbeer]

It's not a simulation, it's a game ... and Italy can contradict history and attack the USSR before Germany does.

Hypothetically, if Italy had attacked the USSR before Germany, the Allied powers probably would not wait for Germany to invade before starting Lend-Lease.

Players can always house-rule the issue if the letter of the rules seems illogical.

[Cmdr Jennifer]

Well if the N.O. is meant to reflect "Lend & Lease" supplies given to Russia to fight the Nazi's then shouldn't Russia only be eligible to receive the N.O. IF they are war with Germany?  Because if the N.O. is meant to reflect  Lend & Lease then the Lend & Lease only happens if Russia is fighting Germany.  Supplies weren't sent to Russia for no reason.  Just my opinion.

TBH, if it's Lend-Lease I think the stronger arguement is, why doesn't the United States LOSE 5 IPC a round every round the Sea Zone is open?  Sure would make that stupid 10 IPC NO for having the Continental United States unoccupied a bit more logical!  (No.  NO, I will NOT buy that England was sending diddly squat to Russia in the form of aid before the United States of America was firmly entrenched in the war.  You can find all the primary and secondary sources you want, but as long as the US was sending lend-lease to England, how could the be sending Lend-Lease to Russia?  0-0 doesnt become 1, I don't care how fuzzy your logical circuits are! )