When they come out with a War of 1812 game,then we can conduct a toronto raid.
Hey! What about South America?
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For the first time in the history of the game, there may be some real action on the least interesting continent in A&A.
Previously, the neutral countries there acted as a ‘wall’, limiting the usefulness of US-controlled Brazil. Now that neutrals can be invaded, there is an interesting possibility that the Allies could expand their base of operations there for economic gain (if there are IPCs to be had on the map) and as a launchpad for attacks into Africa and the Mediterranean.
Either that, or the Axis could take it over, build an IC, and start the tank drive through Mexico to Los Angeles!! :wink:
What do you predict will be happening (if anything) in South America?
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South America will serve for two things:
- Increase income of USA (or maybe ANZAC, that could be a interesting twist)
- Add one (more) reason to prevent try-ignore-Japan strats
I wonder if Argentina will be pro-axis and Brazil pro-allies
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As per Larry Harris:
There are no “Pro-Axis" neutrals in South America.
See:
http://www.harrisgamedesign.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2101&start=120
I assume that Brazil will start out as “Pro-Allies”, and that the other South American countries will be true neutrals. It remains to be seen what IPCs values are affixed to the various territories…
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What’d be nice to put in would be “Neutral Intervention” on your Purchase Units phase… Spend 5 or 10 IPCs (depending on IPC cost of the country/territory, 2-3) and turn a Pro-Axis or Pro-Allied country (depending on your side) active… Units would be placed on the board for the corresponding country under control of the intervening power, with numbers based on the territory’s value. These would be free to attack any other countries nearby; including neutrals. The formerly neutral country essentially becomes a puppet state and could be industrialized to produce more units. Neutrals that are captured by enemy powers, of course, cannot undergo Neutral Intervention.
Argentina should definitely be pro-Axis. Brazil is probably (if not definitely) pro-Allied.
What do you guys think? The Axis could use this to start a proxy war in S. America, Spain, or the Middle East, drawing or diverting the attention of the Allies. The Allies could use this to stir up trouble in the Balkans to divert attention away from Russia.
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What’d be nice to put in would be “Neutral Intervention” on your Purchase Units phase… Spend 5 or 10 IPCs (depending on IPC cost of the country/territory, 2-3) and turn a Pro-Axis or Pro-Allied country (depending on your side) active… Units would be placed on the board for the corresponding country under control of the intervening power, with numbers based on the territory’s value. These would be free to attack any other countries nearby; including neutrals. The formerly neutral country essentially becomes a puppet state and could be industrialized to produce more units. Neutrals that are captured by enemy powers, of course, cannot undergo Neutral Intervention.
Argentina should definitely be pro-Axis. Brazil is probably (if not definitely) pro-Allied.
What do you guys think? The Axis could use this to start a proxy war in S. America, Spain, or the Middle East, drawing or diverting the attention of the Allies. The Allies could use this to stir up trouble in the Balkans to divert attention away from Russia.
The only problem with that is you would most likely get more value in infantry units than the amount you spend; getting troops for free with no drawbacks… That would mean G1 Germany could “buy” all the neutral territories along the Russian border and be able to attack right away… And all for less than it would have cost them to build the troops normally.
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Some of us still seem to not understand the point of pro-side neutrals. They are not meant to represent countries that slightly favored one side or another but never joined the war. They are in place rather for historical reasons to represent countries that were not yet involved in the war by the start date in 1940, but joined later on. For example, Greece would be pro-allied neutral because they joined the war at the end of 1940, after the game starts. Spain, on the other hand, would not be pro-axis neutral because while the government may have favored the Nazis, they at no point had serious plans to enter the war. If the Nazis moved large scale military forces into Spain, Spain would have fought back. Greece on the other hand welcomed British troops into the country to help defend it and would not have fought back against them.
To show an in game example from Pacific, up until turn three, the United States actually functions as a pro-allied neutral power. They are neutral until attacked, but only if attacked by the axis. Because the US is also a power, they have some special rules which apply to them, such as the ability to build and move around units before entering on the side of the allies. However, it would be impossible for them to join the war on the side of the axis, even if they wanted to.
Anyway though, it wouldn’t make sense for Argentina to be pro-Axis because at no point in the war did they welcome Axis forces into the country (at least that I’m aware of).
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Good Points dakgoalie38
I predict south america will be little more than 5 territories. 4 of which would be neutral. I also predict there will be a set (possibly 2 sets) of sea zones on the europe board on the west coast of south america, making it extra far from japan, to limit sillyness early game from carolines.
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you could attack neutrals they just cost 3 IPCS
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@Dylan:
you could attack neutrals they just cost 3 IPCS
only in the original axis and allies, in all subsequent versions they could not be attacked or moved over except in the new Europe and Pacific
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@Dylan:
you could attack neutrals they just cost 3 IPCS
only in the original axis and allies, in all subsequent versions they could not be attacked or moved over except in the new Europe and Pacific
Thats pathetic :-o
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In previous games of A&A42, My friends have used Brazil as a Nazi Naval base. before attacking the USA. One of the rare occurences when it was a tight game until Washington shipped too many men to war. Britain had France AND Kwangtung
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Get over it, South America will never be an important part of this game.
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It might be in Japans best interest to take the Panama canal.
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Meh, I dunno, was just throwing suggestions out there. “Neutral Intervention”, would, in effect, be giving some sides “free” units in addition to extra IPCs, so, yeah, I guess that wouldn’t work. It’d be difficult to balance properly too.
Japan taking over the Panama Canal has never worked; its just not necessary and is a big diversion. IF there was a rule in place stating that the US could only build so many ships on east or west coast each round due to shipyard constraints; then it might be a big deal. But we don’t gots that in AA.
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If there’s war in South America the Axis have probably won.
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Japan taking over the Panama Canal has never worked; its just not necessary and is a big diversion. IF there was a rule in place stating that the US could only build so many ships on east or west coast each round due to shipyard constraints; then it might be a big deal. But we don’t gots that in AA.
Major IC limit = 10 units per turn.
But, then again, even the US will have a hard time coughing up the cash for more than 10 naval units a turn. Geez, even 10 subs would be 60 IPCs…
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Well if there was war in South America I bet Venezuela and Peru or Argentina (I get them mixed up as far as government, I can locate them between each other though) would help them fight against America and Brazil
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Just how much of the world will AA Europe cover if it extends to S America will it include S Africa too?
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An interesting proposition would be if the US +30 Global National Objective was:
Collect +30 IPCs if the United States controls Western United States, Central United States, Eastern United States, and Panama.
sneaking a hit on the canal would be an important way to let the axis hurt the US Economy.
Though making it cost 30 IPCs is a little strong……so maybe not.
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@The:
Just how much of the world will AA Europe cover if it extends to S America will it include S Africa too?
Yes. Which makes it truly awesome.
And even though it’d be one year too late historically, I’m sure that some German players will end up trying desperately to save their cruisers from getting bombed by the Allies, and unintentionally recreate the Battle of the River Plate:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_River_Plate
The South Atlantic won’t be all dead sea zones, I guarantee that.
There’ll be at least some games where the US will be distracted, and Italy will go all Godzilla on them, and grab Brazil… that even happens in AA50 occasionally, and there’s far fewer places to hide on that board. :-D
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