Ignore Germany Strategy

[wodan46]

It is assumed that Techs are OFF, but NOs are ON.
[Post heavily revised to reflect rethinking.]
This Strategy is built around killing Japan first.  Once Japan is contained or eliminated, even if Russia is lost, the Axis are no longer in a position to grab at the VCs needed to win, while the Allies are, limiting them to the sole option of trying to invade Britain, who has 40-50 income thanks to securing the Pacific Theater, and a large fleet of Bombers accumulated while the Axis defeat Russia.


Here are the Builds(if there is not sufficient income, demote a Tank to an Infantry or a Bomber to a Fighter):
[R1: 3 Tank, 1 Infantry, 1 Bomber][R2: 4 Tanks, 3 Infantry][R3+: Tanks/Infantry]
[B1: 2 Bombers, 1 IC][B2: 1 Bomber, 1 Carrier, 1 Transports 1 Tank][B3+: 2 Bombers, 3 Tanks/Infantry]
[A1: 1 Carrier, 2 Transports, 2 Tanks][A2: 4 Bombers][A3+: 4ish Bombers]

Key Moves:
1. Russia moves 2-4 Infantry to Persia on R1, then to India on R2, allowing the British to build an IC without it being captured.  They gather 7 Infantry in Buryatia and the invade Manchuria on R2 with their Bomber supporting.  Beyond that, they hold off Germany/Italy for as long as possible.  Russia will probably fall somewhere between turns 4-6.
2. Britain sends its 2 Fighters in UK to Northwest Africa on B1, then lands them on the Carrier built in India.  Combined with the Australian fleet, the British now have 1 Destroyer, 1 Carrier, 2 Fighters, and 2 Transports off of India, along with 5-8 British ground units supported by 2-4 Russian Infantry.  They advance into Burma as early as can be done, perhaps even B1, and advance into French Indochina soon after, while the Transports are used to recapture East Indies and Borneo.  China should be liberated when possible, whereupon it will block the axis off from going through Chinghai, while securing an SBR site for USA.  Britain should use their Bombers on Italy first, they are far more vulnerable to SBR, and should sink any fleets that threaten Britain or are easy targets.
3. America regroups their fleet on A1, secures Iwo-Jima on A2, moves their Bombers to SBR positions on A3 (Iwo Jima or a Chinese/Russian inland territory), and begins SBR on A4, followed by eventually using them to capture.  The Bomber fleet should be used to clear out the Japanese fleet when the chance presents itself.  Japan's loss of their Continental territories, Indonesia, and a SBR campaign should reduce them to building 2 Infantry every other turn, allowing the US to easily finish Japan off once they have sufficient Bombers.

Once Japan is defeated, the Allies can refocus on killing Germany/Italy and recapturing Russia.  While Germany will probably have huge economy of 60-70 by now, US should be 60-70 as well, and Britain 40-50, while Italy has around 20-30 depending on their fortunes in Africa.  Furthermore, Germany will be heavily spread out.  Most importantly, they will have a mere 7 VCs.  They should be unable to secure more VCs without being hopelessly spread out, and unable to get a fleet in the water to threaten Britain, who should have 6-10 Bombers by the time they finish Russia, and who is probably building about 4 Bombers a turn.

[PelierBay]

I feel an operation sealion for germany

[atarihuana]

if russia stacks 7 inf in bury, ��� will simply kill them. most of the ��� openings i have seen, can reach india j2. i always set up India J2, i always build a factory In FIC as japan J1

 this strat is hoping for a dumb opponent.

if russia goes down turn 4, what stopping german sending planes to japan to help. or sealion?

[wodan46]

I feel an operation sealion for germany

If they feel like wading through 20+ Infantry, I suppose.

if russia stacks 7 inf in bury, ��� will simply kill them.

On J1?  To do so, they'd have to either ignore the American fleet, or fail to capture anything else in East Asia.

most of the ��� openings i have seen, can reach india j2.

By which time Russia has moved between 1-7 units into it.

if russia goes down turn 4, what stopping german sending planes to japan to help. or sealion?

UK should be massing Infantry often.  By Turn 4, they should have 20+ Infantry.

Germany shouldn't be able to reach India until G6.  They shouldn't be able to land Fighters in a Japanese territory until G6 as well, and that's if they are careful.

By G6, Japan should be dead.

Also, a more moderate version of this strat has Russia only send the 8 Infantry in Siberia, 2-4 Infantry from the Caucasus, the Bomber to the east, and otherwise maintain a standard defense.  If they do this, they should still hold out until turn 4 at the very least and turn 6 at the very latest.

[atarihuana]

yeah i would ignore the BB and simply kil 21 IPC of russias best unit.

you try to hard reinventing the wheel dude...

by G6 japan is dead??   id like to see this playtested

and i feel tempted to open a thread "ignore wodan strats"

besides. japan can reach india J2 with 8 inf / art /5 planes / CA shot  - losses J1 ...

[wodan46]

yeah i would ignore the BB and simply kil 21 IPC of russias best unit.

To do so would still slow down their assault on Asia, and allow America to retain its fleet, which will allow them to take out Japan much earlier.

you try to hard reinventing the wheel dude...

and i feel temnpted to open a thread "ignore wodan strats"

Why not?  Its more interesting then talking about the same old strategies with tiny variants on them.

by G6 japan is dead??   id like to see this playtested

Japan is going to start losing its more valuable territories on turns 2 and 3, while getting SBRed by the US.  If the Russian force in Siberia is killed, then they will lose French Indochina anyways, costing them their NO and giving one to Britain.

[atarihuana]

why not? because you expect a dumb an ready-to-die opponent. thats why.

and they dont loose FIC.

[Funcioneta]

No, you cannot ignore any power in this game. Even the sneaky italians must be defeated for allies win. Even China must be killed J1  And better don't talk about that crazy strats that think they can ignore Godzilla 

[atarihuana]

KGF doesnt ignore Japan

[Nickwins89]

Hypothetically all these crazy strategies could work, but in actual testing, I don't think they could work, because opponents are trying to stay alive. No offense Wodan, but those same strats with slight variants are the ones that work, so those are to be the ones that are the mainstay of strategic thinking. Major plans that I always use: Germany needs to butcher all those Russian troops and cause damage to the British navy, Russia Needs to hold onto it's rear and to fend off and push back the germany advance. The Japanese need to obliterate China and The UK Empire and battle off the USA fleet. Italy needs to just... well... get some cash. and The United States needs to bomb the crap out of Germany and destory the Japanese Empire and support Africa or British incursions on the European mainland.

I try to not stray far from simple ideas in this game. I think it helps me stay grounded and not say... buy a russian AC and fighter R1 in the belief that it will be helpful.

In some circumstance where the Japanese player is a nub and the Germany player isn't paying attention to what the other allies are doing these strategies could work, but If the British were focusing thier power on destroying japan first I would be doing my utmost to destroy London. And about that stack you were talking about on London, why just support the invaders with a ton of heavy bombers or something similar, in order to destroy tons of infantry?

[wodan46]

Hypothetically all these crazy strategies could work, but in actual testing, I don't think they could work, because opponents are trying to stay alive. No offense Wodan, but those same strats with slight variants are the ones that work, so those are to be the ones that are the mainstay of strategic thinking. Major plans that I always use: Germany needs to butcher all those Russian troops and cause damage to the British navy, Russia Needs to hold onto it's rear and to fend off and push back the germany advance. The Japanese need to obliterate China and The UK Empire and battle off the USA fleet. Italy needs to just... well... get some cash. and The United States needs to bomb the crap out of Germany and destory the Japanese Empire and support Africa or British incursions on the European mainland.

The problem is that doing those strategies makes your forces means you become a jack of all trades and master of none.  Which is better, coming mere inches from killing all 3 Axis players at once, or crushing 1 Axis player while allowing the others to expand?

If the British were focusing thier power on destroying japan first I would be doing my utmost to destroy London. And about that stack you were talking about on London, why just support the invaders with a ton of heavy bombers or something similar, in order to destroy tons of infantry?

So you are saying that if Germany somehow gets, by a 1/6 chance, the most powerful tech in the game, in a chart that they aren't likely to be researching anyways, then builds a fleet of Bombers while protecting a massive territory, then they might be able to take out Britain.  And you accuse me of hypotheticals.

Actually, I was presuming that Techs were off.  If techs are on, the Allies should abuse them.

Also, a more effective strat for UK in this strategy might be to build a bomber or turn, use them to sink any fleet Germany builds, and otherwise SBR them.  If need be, they start stacking Infantry as well.

Moderate Strategy:
Britain: Build IC in India only, get Bomber each turn to SBR Germany and keep their fleet in check.  May choose to retain Fighters in UK rather than send them to form a Carrier group in India.
Russia: Send only 4 Infantry to India and 8 to Manchuria with a Bomber supporting, otherwise focus on Germany
USA: Should probably still remain focused on Japan entirely, though they skip the Alaska IC.  Build up and SBR for the first few turns, while recapturing Borneo/East Indies if possible, then launch a large invasion of Japan.

Its hard to plot this strategy since much of it is dependent on Axis reactions.  Does Germany kill the British fleet or take Karelia G1?  Does Japan use their Pacific fleet to kill the American fleet of wipe out the Russians in Manchuria on J1?

[Funcioneta]

KGF doesnt ignore Japan

Sure? KGF utterly ignores Japan in the 3-4 first rounds. Enough for lose the game for allies

[bugoo]

Actually i think best way to play this would be the following.

Russia retreats ALL Siberian units back toward russia then into china, as well as 2 inf on turn 1.

Russia sends 2-4 inf into Persia, purchases 4 arm, 1 fig, placing armor in caucus and fig in Moscow.

IF that would be enough to hold India, UK does following, also depends on German moves as well.

UK buys 2 bombers and an IC for in India, lands 2 figs on Gibraltar with 2 inf as well (yes trannie is gonna die).  If possible strafe/take burma (you want to kill as many land units as possible).

US gears up to cover UK landings in africa, or prepares to do so itself as well as pressure japan and go after south pacific.  Also, us lands 2 figs in australia and moves the AC to z46.  This allows the US to drop 3 planes (depending on japan) on india turn 2 as well.  Make sure the US buys atleast 3 subs and 1 trannie.

This will allow you to destroy italy's fleet, or start bombing Germany to aid Russia, and it allows you to break off if the Russian forces would not be enough to hold India, or allows Russia to follow a standard strategy against Germany -4 inf which can come back in 1 round.  Also, the Russian armor can come back very quickly if needed, or can push against Italy in Africa.  The key here is you have options, UK doesn't have to go for it and Russia isn't hurting that badly.  The other big thing to keep in mind is japan has no 'second wave' so to speak to hit India with in most openings.

Honestly though, if the UK wants to help in Asia, kick some German/Italian ass so the Russians can push back in china.

[wodan46]

Actually i think best way to play this would be the following.

Russia retreats ALL Siberian units back toward russia then into china, as well as 2 inf on turn 1.

Russia sends 2-4 inf into Persia, purchases 4 arm, 1 fig, placing armor in caucus and fig in Moscow.

IF that would be enough to hold India, UK does following, also depends on German moves as well.

UK buys 2 bombers and an IC for in India, lands 2 figs on Gibraltar with 2 inf as well (yes trannie is gonna die).  If possible strafe/take burma (you want to kill as many land units as possible).

US gears up to cover UK landings in africa, or prepares to do so itself as well as pressure japan and go after south pacific.  Also, us lands 2 figs in australia and moves the AC to z46.  This allows the US to drop 3 planes (depending on japan) on india turn 2 as well.  Make sure the US buys atleast 3 subs and 1 trannie.

This will allow you to destroy italy's fleet, or start bombing Germany to aid Russia, and it allows you to break off if the Russian forces would not be enough to hold India, or allows Russia to follow a standard strategy against Germany -4 inf which can come back in 1 round.  Also, the Russian armor can come back very quickly if needed, or can push against Italy in Africa.  The key here is you have options, UK doesn't have to go for it and Russia isn't hurting that badly.  The other big thing to keep in mind is japan has no 'second wave' so to speak to hit India with in most openings.

Honestly though, if the UK wants to help in Asia, kick some German/Italian a** so the Russians can push back in china.

Workable, I suppose.  However, the presence of 7 Russian Infantry in Buryatia with a Bomber supporting means Japan has to choose between losing Manchuria, or ignoring the American fleet, both of which are very bad things.

[gebs99]

I dont like any stat that focuses on ignoring any nation because i like to play with a certain degree of "realism" no rusian player will agree to be wiped out just for the sake of the other countries. However, i liked the bomber idea though. I was thinking perhsps i could buy that bomber en R1, regroup East near manchuria making japan think im fleeing.  Then un R2 attack with all soldiers + bomber. Im not seeing the gameboard right now there could be space limitations but its just an idea.