October 01, 2014, 08:24:38 pm *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?

Login with username, password and session length
News: Help support TripleA software development. Search me
  Articles  
   Home   Help Login Register AACalc  
Loading
Pages: 1
  Print  
Author Topic: Can subs attack subs?  (Read 4140 times)
Frontovik
A&A.org Submarine
****
Posts: 644



View Profile
« on: December 11, 2008, 04:04:45 am »
0

sounds very weird, but i'm doubting
if german sub in 1941 gets out of baltic, kills english destroyer and survives, can USSR sub atatck that sub?
i think it's logically yes, but apperently there are soem new sub rules bout submerging
So can anybody help me out?  grin
Logged
tin_snips
A&A.org Tank
***
Posts: 285



View Profile
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2008, 04:19:55 am »
0

yeah, a sub can attack another sub. the attacking sub still gets it 'first strike' ability, if i remember correctly. but the defending sub can then submerge if it misses
Logged
Comassion
A&A.org Infantry
*
Posts: 30


View Profile
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2008, 06:18:18 am »
0

The defending sub can also fire back (even if it gets hit as a casualty), but it's only firing back at a '1', so it's probably better to submerge after the enemy takes a shot at you.
Logged
Krieghund
A&A.org Battleship
*
******
Posts: 4390


A&A Developer and Playtester


View Profile
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2008, 06:20:25 am »
0

The decision of whether or not to submerge is made both sides before any shots are fired, with the attacker deciding first, so a sub can only attack another sub if the defender chooses to fight (or if there's an attacking destroyer). This will be in the FAQ.
Logged
Adlertag
A&A.org Submarine
****
Posts: 968


I GLOBE YOU


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2008, 07:42:01 am »
0

This will be in the FAQ.

How many years did you playtest this game ?

Logged
ShredZ
A&A.org Artillery
**
Posts: 129


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: December 11, 2008, 08:56:17 am »
0

Sounds like youll want your answer in dog years Wink
Logged
runyan99
A&A.org Artillery
**
Posts: 164


View Profile
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2008, 11:40:14 pm »
0

The decision of whether or not to submerge is made both sides before any shots are fired, with the attacker deciding first, so a sub can only attack another sub if the defender chooses to fight (or if there's an attacking destroyer). This will be in the FAQ.

That's not the way the rule is written. According to the manual, page 30

"Anytime a submarine would otherwise roll the die to attack or defend, it can submerge instead."

Thus a sub attacked by another sub cannot submerge until after fired upon. A defending sub doesn't roll until after the attacker does. Unless the manual is flat wrong. The manual mentions an exception for aircraft, but not enemy subs.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2008, 11:43:32 pm by runyan99 » Logged
Woodstock
A&A.org Tank
***
Posts: 284


View Profile
« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2008, 03:14:26 am »
0

However, it also states that both an attacking and defending sub "are considered to fire at the same time" (But since that will mess up your dice table when 2 players roll simultanously, they roll after eachother), so that should mean that a defending sub can submerge right away.
Logged
Krieghund
A&A.org Battleship
*
******
Posts: 4390


A&A Developer and Playtester


View Profile
« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2008, 06:02:45 am »
0

Attacking and defending fire is considered to be effectively simultaneous, as Woodstock points out.  However, as a matter of practicality someone has to go first, as explained on page 18.  This expressed simultaneity also applies to submerging versus firing for subs.  The wording of the submerging rules obscures this issue, so it was clarified in the following FAQ entry:
Quote
Q. Exactly when is the decision made whether or not to submerge submarines?
A. The decision whether to submerge submarines is made before any dice are rolled by either side in an exchange of fire. The attacker decides before the defender does.
Logged
Funcioneta
A&A.org Heavy Bomber
*******
Posts: 12858


AA50 '42 2010 League Champion


View Profile
« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2008, 10:05:00 am »
0

Yep. The very rulebook is pretty clear. A new shiny improve of sub mechanics. I only noticed after the 1st game, and let subs sneak and ignore fleets if no dd are there. Excellent!  smiley

Seems they used all the good ideas with subs and no more good ideas were left when they designed China popcorn status and the whole China rules tongue  cheesy
Logged
Rakeman
Guest
« Reply #10 on: December 28, 2008, 02:37:24 pm »
0

Attacking and defending fire is considered to be effectively simultaneous, as Woodstock points out.  However, as a matter of practicality someone has to go first, as explained on page 18.  This expressed simultaneity also applies to submerging versus firing for subs.  The wording of the submerging rules obscures this issue, so it was clarified in the following FAQ entry:
Quote
Q. Exactly when is the decision made whether or not to submerge submarines?
A. The decision whether to submerge submarines is made before any dice are rolled by either side in an exchange of fire. The attacker decides before the defender does.

Does this mean that sub-stalling is in, if an attacking submarine can submerge before fighting?  Obviously only if a destroy is absent.
Logged
Romulus
A&A.org Submarine
****
Posts: 783


Audaces fortuna iuvat!


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2008, 03:18:58 pm »
0


Attacking and defending fire is considered to be effectively simultaneous, as Woodstock points out.  However, as a matter of practicality someone has to go first, as explained on page 18.  This expressed simultaneity also applies to submerging versus firing for subs.  The wording of the submerging rules obscures this issue, so it was clarified in the following FAQ entry:
Quote
Q. Exactly when is the decision made whether or not to submerge submarines?
A. The decision whether to submerge submarines is made before any dice are rolled by either side in an exchange of fire. The attacker decides before the defender does.

Does this mean that sub-stalling is in, if an attacking submarine can submerge before fighting?  Obviously only if a destroy is absent.

But subs, as TRNs, can not stall because they may be ignored by other surface ships that may treat the sea zone with subs within as friendly or am I wrong?

New sub rules are really interesting!
Logged
Krieghund
A&A.org Battleship
*
******
Posts: 4390


A&A Developer and Playtester


View Profile
« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2008, 04:27:51 pm »
0

But subs, as TRNs, can not stall because they may be ignored by other surface ships that may treat the sea zone with subs within as friendly or am I wrong?

You're not wrong.
Logged
Pages: 1
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

2014 Support Drive
Support Level
Forum Username
Note: payee will appear as Livid Labs, LLC.
Buy Axis & Allies
  • Axis & Allies 1942 [Amazon]
  • A&A Pacific 1940 [Amazon]
  • A&A Europe 1940 [FMG]
  • [eBay]
  • [eBay]
  • A&A D-Day [Amazon]
  • A&A Battle of the Bulge [Amazon]
  • [eBay]
  • [eBay]
  • WWII Themed Combat Dice [FMG]



Axis and Allies.org Official Gold Sponsor: Field Marshal Games

Axis & Allies.org Official Silver Sponsor: Historical Board Gaming
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP © 2014 Livid Labs, LLC. All rights reserved.
Axis & Allies is registered trademark of Wizards of the Coast, a division of Hasbro, Inc.
Note: the copyright below is for the forum software only.
Powered by SMF 1.1.16 | SMF © 2011, Simple Machines
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!